h(x)=f(g(x)) (I hate algebra.)

[Terez]

I'm in class right now. Never have I been so lost in a class as I am right now. Marie is trying to help me, and she's being very patient and thorough, but this stuff turns my brain to mush!

[JSUCamel]

I've never understood why people have such problems with algebra.

It's variables, man! A = 5, B = 60, A * B = C .. so what's C? C is 5 * 60. It's really that easy.

I think people try to over think it.

Functions are the same way. There are rules to functions, but like driving a car, you don't need to know all the mechanics to make it work.

Just think of functions as other variables and plug in the answers. The only real difference is that functions are more complicated variables.

Let's say g(x) = 6x, and f(x) = 2x + 1

if the function call is f(g(x)) then you're replacing the "x" in the f(x) with g(x). So f(g(x)) = 2(6x) + 1 (or f(g(x)) = 12x + 1)

anyway, it makes sense to me. you right-brained folks confuse me.

[caladanbrood]

I still maintain my threat to talk you through some of my thermodynamics notes one of these days;)

This kind of stuff (the first one is actually really simple;)):
http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/966/thermo2eh1.jpg

http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/8427/thermo1ci3.jpg

[irerancincpkc]

Wow. I'll stick to my English/History... :D

[Terez]

I understand that all of this stuff is really simple, and that it's all about plugging values here, here, and here to determine this value. I just don't understand the language of it anymore (it's been years) and I don't understand what it's all applied to and how. Yet. So it's not so much that I have a hard time learning this stuff as it is I'm very behind on the stuff I'm already supposed to know. It's intimidating. :D

[Spidy]

I've always been a fan of the Epsilon/Delta proof of limits.

[JSUCamel]

sadly, i also understood caladan's thing.

is there such thing as too nerdy? :(

[Terez]

Hey, I know lots of cool stuff that you guys probably don't know. :p

[SauceyBlueConfetti]

I use algebra every day in my work.

every
single
day

Math of all sorts came easily to me, yet I despised the subject and was bored by it in high school and college. And now, (heavy sigh) it is my life, so go figure. hehehe unintentional pun there.

[Birgitte]

~giggles at SBC's pun~ I like puns...

I'm the same way, though, SBC, just without the using math everyday at my job. I've always been really good at it and really bored by it. I missed a full two weeks of my statistics class last October due to mono where we were learning how to test statistics hypotheses and was given absolutely no tutoring or any help to catch up whatsoever (everything I missed was just forgiven, taken out of my grade) and still got an A- in the course. (I was so pissed for a while there, though. We didn't even have a book. I just guessed based on how we were doing the harder hypotheses stuff.) Anyway, yeah, I amaze myself with my math skillz. I just don't wanna do it...

[DeiwosTheSkyGod]

Linguistics covered my math requirement :D Even more useless than higher math, but way easier.

[Yuri33]

The best advise I've heard with regards to math is that it's all about patterns and plagiarism. Mathematicians are always looking for ways to do new things with tools they already have. They hate developing new methods. If you're plowing along on a problem and find yourself lost in expressions that you've never seen and are getting more and more complicated with each step, you're probably doing it wrong. Go back and look for the familiar. Chances are there's a simpler way to do things.

[cottillion]

I still maintain my threat to talk you through some of my thermodynamics notes one of these days;)

This kind of stuff (the first one is actually really simple;)):
http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/966/thermo2eh1.jpg

http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/8427/thermo1ci3.jpg
Diffy Q is the class that still haunts my dreams. I'm in political science now too so the highest math I actually need is like statistics.

[GonzoTheGreat]

I've always liked the following quote:

"I turn away with fright and horror from the lamentable evil of functions which do not have derivatives." Charles Hermite, in a letter to Thomas Jan Stieltjes.

That was a chapter heading in my Calculus book. As can be expected, the book then went on to show ways of dealing with functions which do not have derivatives. A useful example of such a function is the Kronecker delta (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kronecker_delta).

PS I had to look up the author of the quote, but I had the wording correct.

[Gilshalos Sedai]

~Gil's head explodes.~

[Davian93]

~reads broods post~

Yup...that's why I like History. I was great at math all the way up to Calculus. I was that annoying one that always had the answer the fastest, even in gifted and honors classes and then 11th grade hit with its bloody calculus. The glory days of "Davian the math whiz" were brutally cut down in their prime and now I own a bunch of history books that are thankfully devoid of such evil equations. I also took Honors Astronomy that year and it was more like Astrophysics than the sitting in the planetarium that I had envisioned. Painful times both.

[Sarevok]

Yeah, I've also found calculus one of the hardest parts. :(
(I had to look up the word calculus first, and seems to be the same as intergraalrekening, here)

Seems I have to edit that:
It was integral calculus that I found hard, differential calculus wasn't too bad.

[Gilshalos Sedai]

Isaac Newton got high one day and decided he needed to torture his graduate students a little more.


Hence Calculus was born.

[Frenzy]

my calculus teacher said Isaac Newton invented all these far-out equations, then invented Calculus to prove them.

makes sense to me.

[Yuri33]

Newton created classical physics (mechanics), but couldn't explain it properly with the math that existed. So he created Calculus to do so (it was being developed by other people as well, but Newton was the first to create a unified framework). It is true, however, that Newton was an ass. He was one of the rudest, most arrogant scientists of his time, constantly jealous of others' innovations.

I find it funny that high school education in the US teaches physics before calculus using simplified equations and very non-realistic problem sets. A basic understanding of calculus should be a requirement before teaching classical mechanics.

[GonzoTheGreat]

I find it funny that high school education in the US teaches physics before calculus using simplified equations and very non-realistic problem sets. A basic understanding of calculus should be a requirement before teaching classical mechanics.
Depends on the pupil, I guess. I remember that I had a bit of trouble with calculus at first, until I suddenly realised "acceleration is the differential of velocity, and distance travelled is the integral". With that physical example it was suddenly simple and obvious.

[Spidy]

We did that here in Australia as well, though most often Physics is core subject in a stream and Maths II, includes Calculus, was always an elective. Too old to know curent arrangements.

[Ozymandias]

I also, cannot handle math, and like Dav, went on to history.

I understand algebra. Its finding limits and stuff like that; basically anything to do with a graph, that throws me off.

I understand the concepts but always get tripped up when solving equations.

However, I can read and write rudimentary Akkadian... so I guess we all have our nerdy quirks.

Spidy, where do you live in Australia? (the seppo comment gave it away... jerk).

[Spidy]

Last four and a half years, Sydney, previously Brisbane and/or Toowoomba in QLD. May be moving again very shortly. Jerk to the left, lurch to the right.

[JSUCamel]

Spidy, where do you live in Australia? (the seppo comment gave it away... jerk).

You mean the "We did that here in Australia as well" comment didn't give it away?

[Terez]

I used to be good at Algebra. When I took it back in school, my teacher (his name was Richard Pryor, ha) told the rest of the class that I was smarter than them. And then he asked the class, "Does anyone think they're smarter than Terez?" I offered up a few names of people in the class I thought were smart, and he rejected them. He liked to have me work problems for the class, to show them how it was done. Too bad I don't remember how.

See why I'm so arrogant? It's because of people like Mr. Pryor...

[Davian93]

How many History peeps do we have here anyway?

Me
Ozy
Uno
WH (I'm not sure he has any degrees but he knows a ton)

who else?

[Gilshalos Sedai]

SBX.


I WAS a history major till I switched.

[Ozymandias]

You mean the "We did that here in Australia as well" comment didn't give it away?

Shut up, Camel. Lol I didn't see that post when I posted...

And I'll be spending a semester abroad in Sydney... is Glebe an area of the city where students would hang out? I know its near Uni of Sydney campus... but is it close to bars or restaurants and the like?

And I don't have a degree yet, Davian. I'm not required to pick a concentration, but at the moment its looking like I would have graduated with a degree in Neo-Assyrian history.

[Spidy]

Glebe is close to two Uni's, University of Technology, Sydney is immediately close, just up the road (1km) is University of Sydney.

[Gandelail]

I've got a minor in history... moved away from it after that. I am moving to Australia for a year starting this August... I'm really excited. Anything I should watch out for in Melbourne? :D

[Terez]

Yeah, watch out for porterhouses.

[Gilshalos Sedai]

Steaks?

[Terez]

Duh.

[Spidy]

Gansters, football supporters, arty types with lots of ambition but no talent.

Is a great city for Art/theatre in general though and the food is awesome, best in OZ.

[Gilshalos Sedai]

Hell, Terez, for all I know you were using Aussie slang for really stupid people. :) (Get it, meatheads? Oh, c'mon, that was funnier than that!)

[Terez]

The Melbourne is the biggest steak you can get at Outback Steakhouse. ;)

[Crispin's Crispian]

I understand that all of this stuff is really simple, and that it's all about plugging values here, here, and here to determine this value. I just don't understand the language of it anymore (it's been years) and I don't understand what it's all applied to and how. Yet. So it's not so much that I have a hard time learning this stuff as it is I'm very behind on the stuff I'm already supposed to know. It's intimidating. :D
When I took physics in college, it had been three or four years since my last algebra class (took physics as a junior, and "advanced" algebra as a junior in high school). All the kids in that class had just taken college algebra and I was so far behind. I felt like a complete idiot and couldn't keep up with the lectures... :( I did manage a B in the class, though. Thank goodness I was good at trig.

[cottillion]

I had a really wierd start with math. I always had decent As and Bs with math in high school then took precalc and physics my first year in college and did terrible with Ds in both. Then I waited a year and took calculus and ended the semester with 104 average. The way my professor taught it it all just seemed so simple. It wasn't until differential equations that I had any trouble at all.

[Mort]

Math Fail!

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e381/EManF05/expand-math.jpg

[SauceyBlueConfetti]

How many History peeps do we have here anyway?

Me
Ozy
Uno
WH (I'm not sure he has any degrees but he knows a ton)

who else?


ME. History Major in college. RUN AWAY from math. RUN AWAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I would give my right pinky to work in art history (and make the same money)!!

[jason wolfbrother]

LOL but you did exactly what they said to do. ;) lol

[Birgitte]

RS is a History/ Political Science major. And I really enjoy history... just no way in hell I'd major in it.

[Terez]

My first test is in two hours. Despite Marie's best efforts, I'm going to fail...

[Sarevok]

*hugs Terez*
you'll do fine :)

[Terez]

OPEN BOOK TEST!!!!! :D


This prof's lectures are useles, but god I love him...

[caladanbrood]

Hahaha, sorted :D

[GonzoTheGreat]

O xein', angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti têde: keimetha tois keinon rhémasi peithomenoi.

It's all greek to me.

[Terez]

Gonzo, the resident linguist. :D

[caladanbrood]

It's all greek to me.
They did maths a bit, didn't they?

[Terez]

Maths and music. I <3 Pythagoras! :D

[Terez]

So, I dropped algebra. I got an 80 on my first test, despite the open book. That's unacceptable.

[GonzoTheGreat]

80 out of a hundred, 80 out of a thousand, 80 from the best with 83 candidates, 80 what?

[Terez]

80%

I'm happy with my English 101 and English 102 grades, though, so I'm keeping those. Here's the comments from my English 101 prof on my first essay for that class:

"Not much to say. The grading form forces me to give 100, which I never do, but your essay is nearly flawless. You were right in that if you keep doing what you're doing, this class will not interfere with your GPA. Lovely essay. Can I take your name off it and use it as a model for future classes? Let me know. Thanks. 100/100"

This is the prof that threatened to fail me at the beginning of his course - he told me I was going to hate his class. :D

[Sarevok]

80% is bad??

[Terez]

I had this conversation with Brood earlier. Yes, it's bad...you guys grade weird.

[Yuri33]

I don't understand, Terez. Are you just going to start over and try again next semester or something? Is this going to delay your graduation?

[Terez]

No, it won't delay my graduation, because I've planned my last two semesters light in case of a situation where I had to drop something. Also, there's a Math 101-E (easy) version available during the normal school year for the same credit.

[Dragon Thief]

Hey, I know lots of uncool stuff that you guys probably don't know. :p

Fixed!

And I had two and a half years of calculus in college, and 2 in high school. Trig is easy. Algebra is easy. Equations, functions, matrixes, all that stuff is easy.

It's the damn arithmetic I hate. Stupid numbers getting in my math. Grumble Grumble.

[Terez]

I thought trig was pretty easy too, but then I had a teacher that didn't go out of the way to make it more complicated than it was. I would have taken calculus too but said teacher had a nervous breakdown my junior year (right after we finished trig) so that was no go.

[tanaww]

It's odd. I'm a Finance major, right? Money = Math. Money math is actually no problem. I was really good in math up to Geometry. Geometry was boring as hell and I despised it. It went downhill from there. Squeaked through some in college and walked away. Until I had to take the GMAT. I scored in the 97%ile on the Verbal and the 35%ile on the Quantitative. Can you tell I hate math?

RS is a bastard. He is a math genius but a history major. He makes no sense. Tested out of any college math thanks to a 5 on the AP Calculus Exam and is a history major. History majors don't get jobs in their field! GAH!

[Terez]

I'm glad my mom isn't a member here. :D

[tanaww]

Well, I have thought about leaving quite a bit lately. Let you youngin's have your fun...

[Terez]

lol...you hang around more than them so why should you go? :D

[Crispin's Crispian]

It's odd. I'm a Finance major, right? Money = Math. Money math is actually no problem. I was really good in math up to Geometry. Geometry was boring as hell and I despised it. It went downhill from there. Squeaked through some in college and walked away. Until I had to take the GMAT. I scored in the 97%ile on the Verbal and the 35%ile on the Quantitative. Can you tell I hate math?



Same thing happened to me, Tana. In fact, I may have gotten exactly the same percentiles--I know I was 97 on Verbal and in the 30s on Math. In fact, for one program I applied to, I retook it to improve my math score. Guess what happened? Math score stayed the same, and ended up with a higher Verbal. D'oh.

I blame the way I was taught math in school. From the beginning, it's all abstraction that you have to learn to apply later. If it was taught as an applied thing from the beginning, I, at least, would have had a better grasp on it all along. Plus when I took the GMAT I hadn't taken algebra or trig or geometry in...five years? Plenty of time to forget.

[tanaww]

I blame the way I was taught math in school. From the beginning, it's all abstraction that you have to learn to apply later. If it was taught as an applied thing from the beginning, I, at least, would have had a better grasp on it all along.

I agree. I remember thinking all those Geometry Theorems were developed by really smart people and I'd just take their word for it! And when I took the GMAT I'd been out of college five years. It'd probably been 8 since I had Applied Calculus and six or seven since Stats. Now I'm applying for a PhD program that, if I am accepted, includes Multivariate Analysis. Know anyone who can tutor that? Shit.

[Crispin's Crispian]

I agree. I remember thinking all those Geometry Theorems were developed by really smart people and I'd just take their word for it! And when I took the GMAT I'd been out of college five years. It'd probably been 8 since I had Applied Calculus and six or seven since Stats. Now I'm applying for a PhD program that, if I am accepted, includes Multivariate Analysis. Know anyone who can tutor that? Shit.
Probably Gonzo, and a few other Theorylanders.

What is the PhD program? SCM?

[tanaww]

Yes sir! SCM at NMSU if they'll have me. They keep losing my damn recommendation letters and acting like it's my fault! Jerks.