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Sei'taer
05-25-2010, 06:42 AM
So...this was on the local news last night.

Group Says Blacks Targeted For Abortions (http://www.wreg.com/news/wreg-abortion-by-race-story,0,2421538.story)
April Thompson
11:26 PM CDT, May 24, 2010

The mention of abortion can bring a bitter battle.
Now one side is taking that battle to new heights.

Eighty billboards are already up around Atlanta Georgia, proclaiming black children are an endangered species, because black women get abortions at a rate higher than those of other races.

"African Americans in America are being targeted by Planned Parenthood and other organizations for abortion to lower the population," says Dr. Alveda King. She is the niece of Dr. Martin Luther King Junior, the pioneer in the civil rights movement.

Alveda King is leading a movement of her own. She says abortion is a weapon in a conspiracy to kill African Americans.

"We have 12 to 13 percent of the population but 33% of the abortions. The plan of genocide says make it available, make it low cost or no cost, put it right there in their communities and they will come." she says.

Our search of the Center for Disease Control abortion statistics found out of 820, 000 legal abortions reported in the country in 2005, 55% were to white women and 36-percent were to black women.

Compare that to the overall population and Alveda King says it speaks volumes.

A new film called "MAAFA 21" connects abortion to Nazi-style eugenics, weeding out unwanted, poor African Americans.

It says there was an elite class of people behind the push, including Margaret Sanger, the founder of Planned Parenthood.

"Dr. Margaret Sanger said colored people are like weeds and they need to be exterminated. So she mounted birth control campaign and a sterilization campaign. Later it became an abortion campaign," says King.

Planned Parenthood of Memphis declined our request for an on camera interview.

In a written statement, a spokesperson said, "The billboard campaign in Atlanta is part of a misinformation campaign run by organizations that just do not trust women to make private personal medical decisions. Margaret Sanger's brief involvement with the eugenics movement was wrong, and those ideas have never been part of the Planned Parenthood mission or services. "

Planned Parenthood says Dr. Martin Luther King supported its work.

The organization even gave Dr. King an award in 1966.

"He was offered that award. He did not attend the ceremony. Dr.King was pro-life. His wife Coretta Scott King was pro-choice. She went on to read the speech prepared by someone other than her husband. So Planned Parenthood tried to associate their work with Martin Luther King Junior," says Alveda King.

There are also strong voices who don't buy the genocide claim.

Sister Song is a group of several grassroots ethnic organizations that are pro-choice advocates.

"If we take the choice away from women, it would go back to the 40s, 50s, and 60s where they go in the back room of quacks and get abortions. Every woman should have a choice," says Doris Bradshaw a Sister Song member who lives in Memphis.

She says it's not abortion that's killing the African American race; it's the environment, with pollution causing more infant deaths that abortion.

She also says "official" statistics on abortion don't tell the whole story.

"People can't afford to go to the private doctor. That's not being recorded. We don't know how other nationalities are being counted. That's something that should be tallied before they start pushing it's only African Americans getting the abortions," says Bradshaw.

So Sister Song is launching its own effort to spread its message of reproductive justice, which counter's Alveda King.

Davian93
05-25-2010, 06:49 AM
There was a good Law & Order episode about this subject. An inner city clinic doctor was deliberately sterilizing minority mothers without their consent, etc etc.

Even if their statistics are true...have they correlated the abortion rates with the birth rates for the various races? There very well could be a connection there. Perhaps its higher among African Americans simply because their pregnancy rate is higher...

Or perhaps its BS statistical noise.

GonzoTheGreat
05-25-2010, 06:54 AM
Or maybe anti-conception is used less in that group, so that they need another solution.
It has been proven (in quite a lot of different places) that improving sex education and greater availability of anti-conception decreases abortion rates.
But rather than using that, the anti-abortion crowd generally wants to depend on a "don't ask, don't tell" policy. Can anyone guess how well that works?

Davian93
05-25-2010, 06:58 AM
Or maybe anti-conception is used less in that group, so that they need another solution.
It has been proven (in quite a lot of different places) that improving sex education and greater availability of anti-conception decreases abortion rates.
But rather than using that, the anti-abortion crowd generally wants to depend on a "don't ask, don't tell" policy. ]


And education (in the U.S.) is usually deterimined by one's socio-economic standing and the African-American community is historically at the bottom of that totem poll. I would simply call Shenanigans on this one.

Can anyone guess how well that works?

I suppose we could ask Bristol Palin...or maybe her kid.

Mort
05-25-2010, 07:11 AM
Probably a the socio-economics make black people have more abortions because they are to a higher degree further down on the economic ladder than white people. More black people can't afford having a child, or maybe get them way younger than white people.

Someone mentioned higher birth rate with black people as well? I dunno if that was a guess or a fact, and how much higher the birth rates really are, but that would be a very natural explanation to the higher abortion rate if it is true.

I wouldn't be surprised if Freakonomics has covered this, sounds familiar. Or we've just had this discussion before ;)

yks 6nnetu hing
05-25-2010, 07:16 AM
I concur that it's probably heavily related to education and socio-economic standing.

I would also like to ask, why is it that when a person has one parent as African as you can get and the other... anything else, then the child is still African(-American)? The reason I'm asking is that there has to have been a huge amount of racial mixing in the last... oh... 300 years or so (ok, maybe more in the last 40-30 years than before, but still). So why do Amfrican-American activists count the way they do, isn't it a discrimination of some sort? Only, I really don't know who are they discriminating against...

GonzoTheGreat
05-25-2010, 07:56 AM
I would also like to ask, why is it that when a person has one parent as African as you can get and the other... anything else, then the child is still African(-American)?Because that's how racists started using the term, so racists still count that way. The fact that they are (at least in part) different racists now is apparently irrelevant.

Hopper
05-25-2010, 08:16 AM
I'm curious about something. The difference in abortion rates for various races is listed and is touted as being significant, but I don't see any mention of the pregnancy rates.

Are the pregnancy rates the same? If not, the whole argument is completely bogus

Leanne
05-25-2010, 08:43 AM
Planned Parenthood encourages abortion any chance they get. I went there to get birth control at 17. Just to find out, surprise! you're pregnant! Oops, waited a tad too long. Anyway, the only option they gave to me was abortion. They never once mentioned adoption or offered to point me in the direction for some help I could receive if I did want to have my baby, like parenting classes, WIC, there are a lot of programs available to help. They gave me all kinds of brochures, every single one about abortion. I never went back again.

Davian93
05-25-2010, 08:45 AM
I'm curious about something. The difference in abortion rates for various races is listed and is touted as being significant, but I don't see any mention of the pregnancy rates.

Are the pregnancy rates the same? If not, the whole argument is completely bogus

http://www.allcountries.org/uscensus/83_projected_fertility_rates_by_race_origin.html

This old Census data (from 2000) shows that Whites have the lowest birth rates in the US...it goes Hispanic, Black, White basically....for the big three that is...American Indian/Eskimo and Asians also beat out Whitey.

IE: Its likely total statistical BS.

Sei'taer
05-25-2010, 08:47 AM
I don't know, Hopper.

Ms. King likes to come to Memphis and stir up trouble. We have the highest infant mortality rate in the US anyway, so she uses it to her advantage. I guess since she's related to Dr. King she's special.

Memphis has enough problems with race without her here stirring it up.

Orc
05-25-2010, 08:52 AM
I'm curious about something. The difference in abortion rates for various races is listed and is touted as being significant, but I don't see any mention of the pregnancy rates.

Are the pregnancy rates the same? If not, the whole argument is completely bogus

With a couple of minutes of searching I found a National Vital Statistics report from the CDC (Centre for Disease Control - http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/nvsr.htm#vol58) indicating that the birth rate for black women was significantly higher than that of white, non-hispanic women. The statistics are for 2007 and 2008.

Davian93
05-25-2010, 08:53 AM
With a couple of minutes of searching I found a National Vital Statistics report from the CDC (Centre for Disease Control - http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/nvsr.htm#vol58) indicating that the birth rate for black women was significantly higher than that of white, non-hispanic women. The statistics are for 2007 and 2008.

Exactly. This is just pathetic propaganda. Of course black women have more abortions...they also get pregnant more often. Stunning insight, Ric Romero!

Sinistrum
05-25-2010, 09:15 AM
Table one in the link below gives you the real reason why blacks have a higher rate of abortion. They are second in terms of teen pregnancy rate, only behind hispanics (who btw are predominantly Catholic, a religion that condemns abortion).

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0193727.html

They also have the highest rate of out of wed-lock births too.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/wayoflife/04/08/out.of.wedlock.births/index.html

But no, this is apparently all a nefarious scheme to commit genocide against blacks and not just the result of people engaging in statistically risky behavior and suffering the accompanying consequences.

Basel Gill
05-25-2010, 09:42 AM
Now now, let us not confuse the issue with facts. That gets in the way of personal agendas. ;)

Davian93
05-25-2010, 10:37 AM
~rereads thread~

Wow...I think all of TL is in agreement here. That's when you know something is complete and utter BS...if we all agree, its gotta be jacked up.

Enjoy this moment everyone. :)

Frenzy
05-25-2010, 10:56 AM
~rereads thread~

Wow...I think all of TL is in agreement here. That's when you know something is complete and utter BS...if we all agree, its gotta be jacked up.

Enjoy this moment everyone. :)

~basks~

Ivhon
05-25-2010, 11:33 AM
~rereads thread~

Wow...I think all of TL is in agreement here. That's when you know something is complete and utter BS...if we all agree, its gotta be jacked up.

Enjoy this moment everyone. :)

Preposterous! You assume all of TL is in agreement based on a sample of responses that is far too small to be representative. THERE SHALL BE NO CONSENSUS!!

Although...in this case I am in utter agreement.

Frenzy pass the basking lotion. Get some right there on the itchy spot on the back? Thanks!

Sinistrum
05-25-2010, 12:16 PM
Frenzy pass the basking lotion. Get some right there on the itchy spot on the back? Thanks!

Just make sure its not the stuff she uses to "bask" with her cucumber. :D

Brita
05-25-2010, 02:08 PM
~~chokes on coffee~~

Wow, I've been (pretty much)gone for a few weeks and I come back to this......glad to be back :D

Davian93
05-25-2010, 02:33 PM
~~chokes on coffee~~

Wow, I've been (pretty much)gone for a few weeks and I come back to this......glad to be back :D

Welcome Back Aes Sedai! :D:):D

Basel Gill
05-25-2010, 02:34 PM
It IS quite the moment. Perhaps there is a Hallmark card that is appropriate to the occasion?

GonzoTheGreat
05-25-2010, 02:48 PM
I don't think there are any cucumber greeting cards. At least, I haven't managed to find any on the Internet. So far, at least.

yks 6nnetu hing
05-25-2010, 02:55 PM
http://m.profilelayouts.com/pl/ss/1154.jpg

it's not exactly a greeting card but it does express the sentiment, I believe.

edit: found an actual greeting card (http://m.profilelayouts.com/pl/ss/1154.jpg)
http://rlv.zcache.com/humorous_cucumber_card-p137429371416164691qjw3_210.jpg

JSUCamel
05-25-2010, 03:11 PM
it's not exactly a greeting card but it does express the sentiment, I believe.

http://brianseitel.com/cucumber-nazis.jpg

Cucumber Nazis approve.

Basel Gill
05-25-2010, 03:26 PM
Zieg Heil, mein pickle.

GonzoTheGreat
05-25-2010, 03:46 PM
Zieg Heil, mein pickle.Based on my (admittedly not very good) knowledge of the language you're trying to use, I think that should have been:
"Sieg Heil, mein Pickle."

I'm not entirely sure that "Pickle" is indeed a German word, but if it is, then it should start with a capital letter in this context.

Sei'taer
05-25-2010, 04:20 PM
Based on my (admittedly not very good) knowledge of the language you're trying to use, I think that should have been:
"Sieg Heil, mein Pickle."

I'm not entirely sure that "Pickle" is indeed a German word, but if it is, then it should start with a capital letter in this context.

"Sieg Heil, mein sauer Gurke." ?


Where's frickin' Anaiya when you need her? Has a kid and thinks she has to spend all her time with it. Give it a chew toy and let it learn how to get along.

Sarevok
05-26-2010, 01:07 AM
"Sieg Heil, mein sauer Gurke." ?


Where's frickin' Anaiya when you need her? Has a kid and thinks she has to spend all her time with it. Give it a chew toy and let it learn how to get along.

It would have to be "meine Sauergurke", I think... :)

Firseal
05-26-2010, 01:42 AM
~rereads thread~

Wow...I think all of TL is in agreement here. That's when you know something is complete and utter BS...if we all agree, its gotta be jacked up.

Enjoy this moment everyone. :)

It won't last

Frenzy
05-26-2010, 01:56 AM
~facepalm~

tworiverswoman
05-26-2010, 03:18 AM
How the hell do you Godwin a thread with CUCUMBERS!!?

GonzoTheGreat
05-26-2010, 03:29 AM
Well, it should not be too surprising that our Feminazi can manage that. It may surprise some that she managed it years before this thread even got started, though.

Terez
05-26-2010, 04:06 AM
It would have to be "meine Sauergurke", I think... :)
I hate endings in German. I screw them up alot.

GonzoTheGreat
05-26-2010, 04:53 AM
I hate endings in German. I screw them up alot.I don't think the alot likes that much either.

Terez
05-26-2010, 05:01 AM
Yes, I imagine it does not.

Anaiya Sedai
05-26-2010, 08:20 AM
Technically, it's sauere Gurke.

I think it's illegal to use the term "sieg heil" in public in germany.... meh.

....and somehow we managed to get from abortions to cucumbers. ~winces at the mental image~

GonzoTheGreat
05-26-2010, 08:22 AM
Well, obviously, one leads to the other, or the other way around.

Sei'taer
05-26-2010, 09:01 AM
Technically, it's sauere Gurke.

I think it's illegal to use the term "sieg heil" in public in germany.... meh.

....and somehow we managed to get from abortions to cucumbers. ~winces at the mental image~

Damn, I was almost right. My German has gone to shit over the years.