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Crispin's Crispian
07-12-2010, 01:32 PM
I been having a lot of fun with Bcc at work lately. If you don't know what it is, Bcc is how you can "blind copy" someone on an e-mail message. That is, you can add someone as a recipient without the rest of the recipients knowing. Now, I almost never use Bcc; certainly not for anything private and only rarely to protect e-mail addresses on more public messages. But some people apparently love it, probably because they love to alert the subjects of gossip or complaints to the fact that their ears should be burning.

In the most recent case(s), I have an employee who has sent messages to me and Bcc'd other employees. On three separate occasions over the last six months, the Bcc'd recipients replied to all so I could see they had been added. :o:D The first time it happened, I was pissed because the employee Bcc'd my boss to complain about another one of my employees. My boss replied back asking for clarification--which I was happy to give. ;)

The second and third times it's been with larger groups, where the employee cc'd some people directly and Bcc'd the person we were talking about. It's funny, because these weren't even gossipy or negative e-mails, just informational.

Now when the Bcc'd person replies (which I'm starting to expect), I add a little "Hey, welcome to the conversation!" Next time I'll probably be more up-front about it.

"Hey, I didn't see you hiding under the Subject line. I'm glad you could join us."

Any other suggestions for fun things to say that get my point across? My point is: Don't trust people at this company to understand Bcc, and trust me enough not to tattle on me behind my back.

Ivhon
07-12-2010, 02:02 PM
Considering that this is your employee, it might be wisest to have a direct sit-down with him/her regarding the appropriate corporate use of BCC.

I know that the companies I worked for took that pretty seriously. If yours is the same, it would be a service to your employee to make sure he/she understands. Even if it is not as fun.

Davian93
07-12-2010, 02:23 PM
Considering that this is your employee, it might be wisest to have a direct sit-down with him/her regarding the appropriate corporate use of BCC.

I know that the companies I worked for took that pretty seriously. If yours is the same, it would be a service to your employee to make sure he/she understands. Even if it is not as fun.

He/she totally did it on purpose (going to your boss on the BCC)...total chickenshit move by him/her. And completely unacceptable. I'd rip him/her a new one for that type of insubordination BS.

Ishara
07-12-2010, 02:35 PM
Yeah, I have to say, the humourous approach to this kind of office bullshit is all well and good - so long as you actually make your point.

If I use bcc, I do so with the acknowledgement that the person I am bcc'ing will become know to everyone. By which I mean, I almost never bcc - unless it's myself. I do that as a CYA sometimes....

Crispin's Crispian
07-12-2010, 03:09 PM
Well, we don't really take much seriously here, and there isn't really a policy about anything. This isn't an insubordination issue.

I can't say "don't use Bcc", because really...there's no rule about it and I don't care to make one. I have already asked that my employee address concerns with me first before going over my head like that. In these later cases, though, there's no chain of command issue and not really any back-stabbing.

And in all honestly, I don't plan a jokey response next time. I plan a directly conversation about how (a) it can be considered disprespectful, and (b) haven't you figured out by now that most of our employees don't realize they've been blind copied? One of these days it's going to come back to you in a bad way.

But please, guys. This was supposed to be funny, not an HR discussion. Humor me with something funny to say.

Davian93
07-12-2010, 03:32 PM
Yeah, I have to say, the huourous approah to this kind of office bullshit is all well and good - so long as you actually make your point.

If I use bcc, I do so with the acknowledgement that the person I am bcc'ing will become know to everyone. Which mean, I almost never bcc - unless it's myself. I do that as a CYA sometimes....


Dont you have a "sent" folder?

Sei'taer
07-12-2010, 04:57 PM
Dont you have a "sent" folder?


If she's like me, she has a sent folder at work and a personal, very different email addy that she bcc's to for stuff that might accidently disappear at a later date but can't disappear from an email addy you do not access at work. I do this a hell of a lot...especially when I get emails like this:

Larry: I would make sure that the additional hours are needed. I do not think that the inspectors would work overtime if they were not needed, however, I would want them to document their overtime hours and describe the activities they performed. All overtime will be comp time. There is no overtime pay. Lisa has a form that we keep record of the comp time. Make sure everyone who works overtime fills out this form and explains the work they performed.

J. D. Head
Director, Economic & Community Development

To which I say, "Stick it up your hole" and BCC myself so I have record that this douche is proposing breaking labor laws. I'm the one who will probably end up challenging it because I have a huge job coming up and I want pay, not comp time.

Ivhon
07-12-2010, 04:57 PM
Well, we don't really take much seriously here, and there isn't really a policy about anything. This isn't an insubordination issue.

I can't say "don't use Bcc", because really...there's no rule about it and I don't care to make one. I have already asked that my employee address concerns with me first before going over my head like that. In these later cases, though, there's no chain of command issue and not really any back-stabbing.

And in all honestly, I don't plan a jokey response next time. I plan a directly conversation about how (a) it can be considered disprespectful, and (b) haven't you figured out by now that most of our employees don't realize they've been blind copied? One of these days it's going to come back to you in a bad way.

But please, guys. This was supposed to be funny, not an HR discussion. Humor me with something funny to say.

There's nothing funny about BCC....

Davian93
07-12-2010, 05:34 PM
If she's like me, she has a sent folder at work and a personal, very different email addy that she bcc's to for stuff that might accidently disappear at a later date but can't disappear from an email addy you do not access at work. I do this a hell of a lot...especially when I get emails like this:



To which I say, "Stick it up your hole" and BCC myself so I have record that this douche is proposing breaking labor laws. I'm the one who will probably end up challenging it because I have a huge job coming up and I want pay, not comp time.

Yeah, I do that too...on things that I might want to use in case I'm ever let go unexpectedly.

Bryan Blaire
07-12-2010, 06:59 PM
I know a couple of people that do the BCC crap all the time at work. I like to have fun with it, especially when I'm the BCC'd party. I'm usually the one that pokes my head into the convo with a reply all. :D That usually gets the truly paranoid people that BCC'd me in a tizzy.

I do use the BCC, but only as a way of putting a list together of people I need to e-mail but who don't need each other's e-mails, and if I BCC anyone, I BCC everyone the message and just send it to myself. That's usually for security/confidentiality reasons (since I talk to agents and officers from several agencies).

Terez
07-12-2010, 07:43 PM
I got chewed out by Seeker once for not using BCC for an email sent to multiple people. So that's what I use it for, and now it annoys me when people send out mass emails using CC instead of BCC.

Sinistrum
07-12-2010, 08:34 PM
I actually have to use this function for work email on a semi-regular basis for a legitimate work purpose. Given I work in a DA's office, we have to work with several law enforcement agencies. There are certain sections of one in particular that feel they are above responding to things such as subpoenas for the misdemeanor cases I primarily handle to the extent that they have complained to both my direct supervisor and the big boss lady DA about me doing it. Regardless of their feelings, I still have to subpoena them though as a part of my job, so when I do, I bcc my immediate supervisor to make sure that she knows that what I'm doing isn't anything other than playing nice and doing my job when I do subpoena them. Its annoying as hell and unbelievably infantile, but its better than the alternative which is them getting a creative license to complain about my subpoenas and forcing me to waste mine and my boss' time responding to it with what I actually sent.

yks 6nnetu hing
07-13-2010, 04:22 AM
hmm... I don't have that much of a problem with BCC's but that's maybe because people use distribution lists. Usually if I want to inform (for example) my boss of a conversation, I won't BCC him, I'll forward the email afterwards to him and him alone with an FYI. Because otherwise he doesn't get the hint that he's not supposed to know about the discussion.

fun things to say to the person who BCC'd people:
"how great, you've brought invisible friends to the party"

um... and I'm out. I'm sure more will come if I think about it for a while.

Davian93
07-13-2010, 08:31 AM
I openly CC my boss on about half the emails I send. Partly so that the people are aware that she's aware...which cuts down on them running to her whining about what I'm having them do (which happens alot as some of the people in my office seem to think that they have that right with her and them both being females. It pisses her off to no end and me as well as its total BS for them to try to end around me like that. I also CC her on alot of things I send outside our Agency so that she's aware of it and doesn't get blindsided into an inter-agency meeting (which I typically get out of attending). I only use bCC to cover my own ass my sending it to me and for other nefarious purposes.

yks 6nnetu hing
07-13-2010, 10:32 AM
I openly CC my boss on about half the emails I send. Partly so that the people are aware that she's aware...which cuts down on them running to her whining about what I'm having them do (which happens alot as some of the people in my office seem to think that they have that right with her and them both being females. It pisses her off to no end and me as well as its total BS for them to try to end around me like that. I also CC her on alot of things I send outside our Agency so that she's aware of it and doesn't get blindsided into an inter-agency meeting (which I typically get out of attending). I only use bCC to cover my own ass my sending it to me and for other nefarious purposes.:p well obviously. But the discussions that might possibly be considered industrial espionage if I were to openly cc him:rolleyes:

The guy can't keep his mouth shut. Today, he told the whole team that an ex coworker of ours whose contract did not get extended at this company and then he got a job at our direct competitor literally trying to take our business away... is being fired in that company, and no-one's supposed to know. I mean... on the one hand it's nice that he shares information but on the other hand if no-one's supposed to know then why tell EVERYONE?

Crispin's Crispian
07-13-2010, 11:56 AM
:p well obviously. But the discussions that might possibly be considered industrial espionage if I were to openly cc him:rolleyes:

The guy can't keep his mouth shut. Today, he told the whole team that an ex coworker of ours whose contract did not get extended at this company and then he got a job at our direct competitor literally trying to take our business away... is being fired in that company, and no-one's supposed to know. I mean... on the one hand it's nice that he shares information but on the other hand if no-one's supposed to know then why tell EVERYONE?
And that's one reason I can't jump up and down angrily about Bcc. I know people talk and send forwarded e-mails all around the office, even when they're asked to keep things confidential, so I feel using Bcc for that purpose is just the dumb way to go about it.

I have a co-worker who gives the appearance of being very, very careful with information ("Close the door, this is confidential..." or "I can't say more right now, but..."). But get him talking for about two minutes and he'll spill every confidential personal detail there is.

It's annoying as hell, because I try really, really hard to keep things quiet. It's part of our value proposition to our clients, and just part of how I do my job. It's one thing to not understand that, but it's a whole other enchilada when you claim to understand it then deliberately flout it for your own gossipy self-aggrandizement.

Davian93
07-13-2010, 12:02 PM
I never tell anyone anything in my office that I wouldn't mind everyone else knowing about. In fact, its an artform if you want to get something back to someone without speaking to them directly: I tell a couple of the right people and the issues gets back to the intended recipient within 2 days at max. If I send an email, I assume everyone will know about it eventually...even if its to my "friends" in the office.

Brita
07-13-2010, 12:24 PM
I learned a hard lesson about the pitfalls of email about 5 years ago. I think I have told this story here before, but oh well- I'll tell it again.

A co-worker and friend was leaving for a new job. There was one physician that she did not get along with at all. So, she forwarded me some email correspondence between herself and said physician, in which the physician had replied in a snappish and condescending manner. I hit reply and said "I guess you'll be kicking your heels in joy to get away from her" (or something like that). Well, I had hit reply to the attachment, and not to my friend. My email went straight to the physician herself!

Ya- as soon as I realized my mistake I went into serious damage control, which consisted of genuinely apologizing to the physician, my boss, and my boss' boss for very unprofessional behaviour.

Ironically, this physician and I now have an amazing working relationship- and we get along remarkably well.

In regards to the OP- Bcc for privacy reasons is, of course, necessary. Bcc in any other situation is just sneaky.

Ishara
07-13-2010, 10:08 PM
Sorry for not being funny SDog - I was reading it at work and was responding with my work brain. ;)


And in all honestly, I don't plan a jokey response next time. I plan a directly conversation about how (a) it can be considered disprespectful, and (b) haven't you figured out by now that most of our employees don't realize they've been blind copied? One of these days it's going to come back to you in a bad way.

I think I must be inured to workplaces that don't have clear chains of command and hierarchy. I fail to see how that kind of workplace can be successful, but I know that it is! Really, the bottom line should be how potentially damaging the bcc can be TO THE SENDER. The consequences are completely beyond your control...so never put anything in an email that you aren't willing to say to someone's face.

Dont you have a "sent" folder?
Sure, but in many cases, it's a lot easier to have those CYA emails in the same place as the replies.

If she's like me, she has a sent folder at work and a personal, very different email addy that she bcc's to for stuff that might accidently disappear at a later date but can't disappear from an email addy you do not access at work. Also, yes. Smart move. I provide advice in my line of work. That's it, that's all. I have emails proving that so that when I get emails to my manager saying she "TOLD" me to do x, y, and z" I can say, uh, uh. I told you that your options were a, b, c, x, y, and z, and the pros/ cons associated with each option. The only time I TELL people what to do is when I TELL them that they can't violate the collective agreement(s) or legislation.

Crispin's Crispian
07-14-2010, 11:29 AM
Sorry for not being funny SDog - I was reading it at work and was responding with my work braon. ;)

What's a braon? :p


I think I must be inured to workplaces that don't have clear chains of command and hierarchy. I fail to see how that kind of workplace can be successful, but I know that it is!
We have a semi-clear hierarchy, and the chain of command is supposed to be crystal clear. However, I'm not a command-and-control type of manager, which is actually really good for my team.

Really, the bottom line should be how potentially damaging the bcc can be TO THE SENDER. The consequences are completely beyond your control...so never put anything in an email that you aren't willing to say to someone's face.This. And that's exactly what I meant about the people here not thinking to look at whether they were Bcc'd. If you were do to this with personal or confidential information, you would be fired.

Ishara
07-14-2010, 02:28 PM
What's a braon? :p


We have a semi-clear hierarchy, and the chain of command is supposed to be crystal clear. However, I'm not a command-and-control type of manager, which is actually really good for my team.

This. And that's exactly what I meant about the people here not thinking to look at whether they were Bcc'd. If you were do to this with personal or confidential information, you would be fired.

LOL - And I was writing THAT with my cold beer brain! ;)

If your management style works for you - then keep doing it! It's when it's not working for you that I get involved anyways. LOL

Davian93
07-14-2010, 03:32 PM
The goal of any mid-level manager should be that of a petty tyrant.

reTaardad
07-14-2010, 06:06 PM
In my company, we almost only communicate through IM and I definitely like it that way. Everyone has a company email account, but it's mostly only used by the VP to send spam to all of the employees. Since we're programmers, most of our questions have to be answered immediately, so email is nearly useless unless we're planning server maintenance or something several weeks in advance.

JSUCamel
07-14-2010, 06:19 PM
In my company, we almost only communicate through IM and I definitely like it that way. Everyone has a company email account, but it's mostly only used by the VP to send spam to all of the employees. Since we're programmers, most of our questions have to be answered immediately, so email is nearly useless unless we're planning server maintenance or something several weeks in advance.

This is how my company is. Then again, we're so small we can just turn around and say "hey, what about this...?" and have it answered immediately. But we're also pretty lax about working from home, so we IM each other a lot too when someone is out. I've never really had to deal with the BCC thing, so this whole thread is out of my league.

You old fogeys and your "email". hah. Get with the 21st century, people!

Crispin's Crispian
07-14-2010, 06:21 PM
This is how my company is. Then again, we're so small we can just turn around and say "hey, what about this...?" and have it answered immediately. But we're also pretty lax about working from home, so we IM each other a lot too when someone is out. I've never really had to deal with the BCC thing, so this whole thread is out of my league.

You old fogeys and your "email". hah. Get with the 21st century, people!

Unfortunately the level of technology of a company is directly proportional to the age of the sales force.

At the same time, I don't want to have IMs from all my sales people all the time. Good god.

Bryan Blaire
07-14-2010, 06:30 PM
In my section of the gov't, we are absolutely forbidden any type of IM program on any machine. Even the times when the IM functionality on our e-mail program has been activated, it has been thrown down with great force, along with the activating personnel.

Ivhon
07-14-2010, 11:02 PM
From a strictly business standpoint, IM is a risk to productivity.

There are certain situations where it becomes a boon - IT and telecommuting in particular - but in other situations you can easily wind up with people using their company IM account to sit there and chat all day instead of doing their job.

Not saying that it is bound to happen that way, but I could definitely see that happening at some of the places where I used to work.

Terez
07-15-2010, 02:58 AM
Re: chain of command issues. I have been trying to get my piano teacher to enlist the piano technician to fix some pianos for weeks now, and she keeps telling me to do it myself. I realize now it's an ingrained chain of command thing. My dad was a maintenance man at the place I used to work, and I know it made his job 100x more difficult when everyone had his number, and for a while they had to cut it down to where only upper management could call him out, because the lower management would call him out for things they were supposed to be able to handle on their own, or things that were less important than others. So I keep feeling like my teacher should be the one to call him. I called my dad directly when I needed something fixed, but that's because he was my dad...

yks 6nnetu hing
07-15-2010, 03:55 AM
From a strictly business standpoint, IM is a risk to productivity.

There are certain situations where it becomes a boon - IT and telecommuting in particular - but in other situations you can easily wind up with people using their company IM account to sit there and chat all day instead of doing their job.

Not saying that it is bound to happen that way, but I could definitely see that happening at some of the places where I used to work.

I think that depends alot on the company overall business culture. When the people around you never or very rarely use IM for personal chat then you're much less likely to do so too. Especially in an open-plan office :p We use Skype for everything, including confcalls if at all possible. It's either free or zounds cheaper than the landline, not to eaven talk about cellphone bills...

We do use IM within the office to share funny youtube clips though. sometimes.

GonzoTheGreat
07-15-2010, 05:36 AM
Re: chain of command issues. I have been trying to get my piano teacher to enlist the piano technician to fix some pianos for weeks now, and she keeps telling me to do it myself. I realize now it's an ingrained chain of command thing. My dad was a maintenance man at the place I used to work, and I know it made his job 100x more difficult when everyone had his number, and for a while they had to cut it down to where only upper management could call him out, because the lower management would call him out for things they were supposed to be able to handle on their own, or things that were less important than others. So I keep feeling like my teacher should be the one to call him. I called my dad directly when I needed something fixed, but that's because he was my dad...But if your teacher thinks you can do it yourself, then why don't you fix the pianos?

I mean, a piano is basically a black box which produces music* if you bang on the keys. Fixing that ... how hard can it be?

Edited to add footnote.

* Well, noise. If it's me banging on the keys, then I can't prove the music part, but the noise I can manage. Which change in definition only makes the repair job all the easier, of course.

Matoyak
07-15-2010, 05:41 AM
Well huh. I always wondered what the difference between the three boxes at the top of an email was. I've only ever needed to use the "to:" input. :o :) :o

Informative thread! Woot, learn sommat new every day.
So what's the difference between "cc:" and "to:"? I know I just put a comma to separate emails in the to list if I need to email multiple people...how is "cc:" different from that?

GonzoTheGreat
07-15-2010, 05:46 AM
"cc:" is supposedly more convenient. Especially for those who are short on punctuation marks. Based on a lot of things that appear on the Internet, only a minority of keyboards actually has punctuation marks on them, I think.

Matoyak
07-15-2010, 05:50 AM
"cc:" is supposedly more convenient. Especially for those who are short on punctuation marks. Based on a lot of things that appear on the Internet, only a minority of keyboards actually has punctuation marks on them, I think.Ah, yes, those punctuation-less keyboards are quite popular nowadays...here's hoping it's only a fad. :) ;)
Side-note: How do you get more convenient than simply adding a comma? :confused:

yks 6nnetu hing
07-15-2010, 05:51 AM
Well huh. I always wondered what the difference between the three boxes at the top of an email was. I've only ever needed to use the "to:" input. :o :) :o

Informative thread! Woot, learn sommat new every day.
So what's the difference between "cc:" and "to:"? I know I just put a comma to separate emails in the to list if I need to email multiple people...how is "cc:" different from that?

To: the people you want to take action about the problem. The main addressee(s) of the email

cc: the people who have a vested interest in the topic, people who will want to know of any progress/new information on this topic.

For example, you're sending a response to a complaint back to the original complainer but you cc your own boss so a) s/he sees that you've taken action and b)what the action was and c) the original complainer sees your boss on cc which means that s/he implicitly agrees with the response you're giving so no point going back to him/her complaining about your work quality.

Matoyak
07-15-2010, 06:20 AM
To: the people you want to take action about the problem. The main addressee(s) of the email

cc: the people who have a vested interest in the topic, people who will want to know of any progress/new information on this topic.

For example, you're sending a response to a complaint back to the original complainer but you cc your own boss so a) s/he sees that you've taken action and b)what the action was and c) the original complainer sees your boss on cc which means that s/he implicitly agrees with the response you're giving so no point going back to him/her complaining about your work quality.So it's pretty much only really useful in a corporate setting. Gotcha. :) Thanks for the info :)

Davian93
07-15-2010, 08:01 AM
In my section of the gov't, we are absolutely forbidden any type of IM program on any machine. Even the times when the IM functionality on our e-mail program has been activated, it has been thrown down with great force, along with the activating personnel.

Mine too...though it was one recommendation I made when I first came on board and it was gently shot down as unneccessary. You can send 500 non-work related emails to another employee but IMing is unprofessional.

Davian93
07-15-2010, 08:04 AM
Well huh. I always wondered what the difference between the three boxes at the top of an email was. I've only ever needed to use the "to:" input. :o :) :o

Informative thread! Woot, learn sommat new every day.
So what's the difference between "cc:" and "to:"? I know I just put a comma to separate emails in the to list if I need to email multiple people...how is "cc:" different from that?

If you send me something on the cc line, I'll immediately assume I'm not the main recipient but that I'm simply being kept in the loop. I'm far less likely to contribute to the email discussion at that point as I'd feel like I'm stepping on the direct recipient's (To Line) toes.


EDIT: I probably send out a good 200 emails a day that are work related and a few hundred more that aren't...yea government!

yks 6nnetu hing
07-15-2010, 08:56 AM
If you send me something on the cc line, I'll immediately assume I'm not the main recipient but that I'm simply being kept in the loop. I'm far less likely to contribute to the email discussion at that point as I'd feel like I'm stepping on the direct recipient's (To Line) toes.


EDIT: I probably send out a good 200 emails a day that are work related and a few hundred more that aren't...yea government!

200/8=25 25/60=0.4 or thereabouts... so you send out one email every 2 minutes? How long does it take for you to write the email? and how on earth do you manage to get actual work done?

Ivhon
07-15-2010, 09:18 AM
200/8=25 25/60=0.4 or thereabouts... so you send out one email every 2 minutes? How long does it take for you to write the email? and how on earth do you manage to get actual work done?

You missed the part where he said he worked for the government?

All joking aside, my private sector use of email and IM (telecommuter on the IT payroll) was similar to what Dav reports. Of course, being in IT (although Im not techie at all), the workloads were feast or famine. Next to nothing to do for 3 days and then 8 days of work that need to be done by tomorrow at 4:30 (be on the conference call to give the CIO and EVP a detailed progress report on the following issues:)

Davian93
07-15-2010, 10:15 AM
200/8=25 25/60=0.4 or thereabouts... so you send out one email every 2 minutes? How long does it take for you to write the email? and how on earth do you manage to get actual work done?


Actual work? Email is work...

Note: most of them are short one sentence IM level emails but still "work related".

Ishara
07-15-2010, 11:33 AM
This is how my company is. Then again, we're so small we can just turn around and say "hey, what about this...?" and have it answered immediately. But we're also pretty lax about working from home, so we IM each other a lot too when someone is out. I've never really had to deal with the BCC thing, so this whole thread is out of my league.

You old fogeys and your "email". hah. Get with the 21st century, people!
and this:

Unfortunately the level of technology of a company is directly proportional to the age of the sales force.

At the same time, I don't want to have IMs from all my sales people all the time. Good god.
I wouldn't WANT to be IM'd by my clients, and if I have a quick question for a colleague, I GET UP and ask them. Also, IMing is verboten here in govt. Lots of colleagues BBM each other though....

From a strictly business standpoint, IM is a risk to productivity.

The rationale we are provided whenever it is suggested. >.<
Well huh. I always wondered what the difference between the three boxes at the top of an email was. I've only ever needed to use the "to:" input. :o :) :o

Informative thread! Woot, learn sommat new every day.
So what's the difference between "cc:" and "to:"? I know I just put a comma to separate emails in the to list if I need to email multiple people...how is "cc:" different from that?

I think yks covered it for you. Yes, it's basically a "keep you in the loop" thing.

Crispin's Crispian
07-15-2010, 12:04 PM
Re: chain of command issues. I have been trying to get my piano teacher to enlist the piano technician to fix some pianos for weeks now, and she keeps telling me to do it myself. I realize now it's an ingrained chain of command thing. My dad was a maintenance man at the place I used to work, and I know it made his job 100x more difficult when everyone had his number, and for a while they had to cut it down to where only upper management could call him out, because the lower management would call him out for things they were supposed to be able to handle on their own, or things that were less important than others. So I keep feeling like my teacher should be the one to call him. I called my dad directly when I needed something fixed, but that's because he was my dad...
This is absolutely true in tech support, at least as far as I've been involved in it. If you give people an inch, they will take a mile.


I think that depends alot on the company overall business culture. When the people around you never or very rarely use IM for personal chat then you're much less likely to do so too. Especially in an open-plan office :p We use Skype for everything, including confcalls if at all possible. It's either free or zounds cheaper than the landline, not to eaven talk about cellphone bills...

Ivhon definitely knows about the dangers of IM. There times in late 2000 and in 2001 where we Yahoo'd way more than what was probably productive for work. It goes back to what you're working on, but there's a real risk to productivity if you get addicted to it.



I wouldn't WANT to be IM'd by my clients, and if I have a quick question for a colleague, I GET UP and ask them.
Well, it might be beneficial here, because we have a remote sales force that calls in or e-mails to HQ. IM would be easier in a lot of cases, but at the same time I encourage them to consolidate questions into one e-mail, and encourage them not to call me when an e-mail will suffice. If all my salespeople IM'd me, I'm just afraid I'd be IMing all day long.

GonzoTheGreat
07-20-2010, 09:06 AM
I just read about a case of a dutch municipality, which sends out an email newsletter to those of its inhabitants who have signed up to that. That should have been done with BCC, but someone made a mistake and used the TO field.

The same would of course be true with all sorts of other newsletters, and in many of those cases too there would be no reason at all for all other recipients to know precisely who was getting the mail.

And, of course, if a mail is send onwards, then the TO and CC fields are kept in the mail (unless deleted manually). And once something becomes a chain email, there's no guessing where it will end up, so at that point you have to assume that spammers will also learn of this email address which you are actually using.

In short: unless there is a reason to use the TO or CC field, the BCC field would be the best.

Davian93
07-20-2010, 09:41 AM
When going outside a firewall with mass emails? Definitely. In a closed work environment...the Bcc leads to many stupid issues.

I figure the maturity level of my office is about 9th-10th grade High School. You'd be amazed at the petty whiny crap I witness on a daily basis here.

Matoyak
07-20-2010, 04:21 PM
I figure the maturity level of my office is about 9th-10th grade High School. You'd be amazed at the petty whiny crap I witness on a daily basis here.Wow, Freshman/Sophomore level? That's impressive. :eek: (in a bad way, of course)

Crispin's Crispian
07-21-2010, 12:20 PM
Wow, Freshman/Sophomore level? That's impressive. :eek: (in a bad way, of course)

I don't think it's all that uncommon. I can certainly relate to what Dav is saying.

Sinistrum
07-21-2010, 01:11 PM
Me too. Its really pathetisad.

Sei'taer
07-21-2010, 05:52 PM
I don't think it's all that uncommon. I can certainly relate to what Dav is saying.

I know, right? It's, like, awful.

My wife has a new job and two of her co-workers, who are in their mid twenties, sit and listen to hannah montana and the jonas brothers all day. She is incredibly happy to get to enjoy it with them. I guess her christmas gift will be an ipod...since she only communicates thru IM even though they all sit right next to each other she really doesn't need to hear.

Plus, one of them is a jehovahs witness. That made her giddy with joy!

Davian93
07-21-2010, 06:42 PM
I know, right? It's, like, awful.

My wife has a new job and two of her co-workers, who are in their mid twenties, sit and listen to hannah montana and the jonas brothers all day. She is incredibly happy to get to enjoy it with them. I guess her christmas gift will be an ipod...since she only communicates thru IM even though they all sit right next to each other she really doesn't need to hear.

Plus, one of them is a jehovahs witness. That made her giddy with joy!

I didn't know your wife worked at my office...

Ishara
07-21-2010, 09:48 PM
It'sapaycheque.It'sapaycheque. It'sapaycheque. It'sapaycheque.

You just keep telling Al to repeat that mantra to herself. LOL

Crispin's Crispian
07-22-2010, 11:24 AM
It'sapaycheque.It'sapaycheque. It'sapaycheque. It'sapaycheque.

You just keep telling Al to repeat that mantra to herself. LOL

What the hell is a paycheque? Is that Canadian for something good?

Davian93
07-22-2010, 12:38 PM
What the hell is a paycheque? Is that Canadian for something good?

Sounds socialistic...and thus evil.

Ivhon
07-22-2010, 01:54 PM
Sounds socialistic...and thus evil.

Damn Canookians. All they do is sit around all day and collect paycheques.

Ivhon
07-22-2010, 01:56 PM
What the hell is a paycheque? Is that Canadian for something good?

I think its a hockey thing. Like an extra-hard hit or something like that. "Dude just got paychequed! Blood on the ice...."

Sei'taer
07-22-2010, 05:56 PM
Sounds socialistic...and thus evil.

Sounds French to me, which is even worse.

yks 6nnetu hing
08-27-2010, 08:41 AM
bump. Because something funny has happened with BCC - someone who is clearly overzealous has BCC'd all recipients to a confcall and put a "confidential" banner on the whole shebang. Everyone knows who will probably attend, mind you. But, this person has a habit of calling in before everyone else and then pretending that they're not there until something comes up where they can stick someone else in the back.

oh my, the paranoia....

Crispin's Crispian
08-27-2010, 04:16 PM
bump. Because something funny has happened with BCC - someone who is clearly overzealous has BCC'd all recipients to a confcall and put a "confidential" banner on the whole shebang. Everyone knows who will probably attend, mind you. But, this person has a habit of calling in before everyone else and then pretending that they're not there until something comes up where they can stick someone else in the back.

oh my, the paranoia....

Please oh please give me the number so I can crash the call.

Ishara
09-01-2010, 08:40 AM
LOL

I've ended calls and made everyone call back in when I know we have lurkers. that shit is disrespectful and really quite stupid.