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View Full Version : Ender's Game + sequels


Mort
09-23-2010, 08:23 PM
I re-read this book recently. I still like it a lot. I like practically everything about it. The narrative in the beginning of every chapter where you see a dialogue of two others discussing what Ender goes through. Cool way to do it. Anyone know if any other author has done something similar?

I also like the whole struggle, there is a strong sense of struggle, loneliness but also camaraderie in a way.

Another thing that stuck with me is how the civilization is explained, how social discussion is being held "online". Especially since the book was written pre-internet era :)

I read the sequals to Ender's Game, long after I read Game though. Ender's Game is able to stand on it's on, and you can finish there if you'd like. I really liked the second book but they became less and less interesting for every book. Although I have not read the sequals in many years, that may have changed.

I started on the parallell series but only read one book and never came any further...

I heard very recently that they are thinking of doing a movie adaptation of Ender's Game too!
That could turn out very interesting. I just hope they don't do an "Avatar: The last air bender" of it... Sucks compared to the animated series.

Davian93
09-23-2010, 08:38 PM
I LOVED Enders Game. It was actually the book that got me to start reading Sci-Fi/Fantasy. I picked it up in 6th grade and haven't looked back.

I didnt care as much for Xenocide or Speaker for the Dead but they were alright. The Bean companion novels were fairly decent as well (I believe I've read pretty much all of them at this point).



While we're on OSC, The Memory of Earth series is fairly interesting too...despite the massive religious overtones.

Indagator
09-24-2010, 04:02 PM
I really liked Ender's game when I first read it. I remember liking Speaker for the Dead even more. Never did finish Xenocide, or start Children of the Mind. I haven't read them in years, so I'm not sure what my reaction would be these days.

At this point I appreciate the Shadows series more than the first series. Well, that's not entirely correct; I really enjoy Ender's Shadow and Shadow of the Giant (the first and fourth novels, respectively.) The other two were rubbish - I don't think I even finished the third. At any rate, I don't think I missed anything that I couldn't pick up from the wikipedia recap.

The character of Peter in particular was fascinating to me. I also really enjoyed Bean's perspective in Ender's Shadow. He didn't evolve that much as the series progressed, but his evolution in that novel was satisfying. The extra insights into Ender's character and the Universe of Ender's game were nice.

The "Mormons...IN SPACE!" aspects of The Memory of Earth series were a little too distracting to get beyond the first novel, though I liked some of the ideas of that volume.

Edit: Too many "I's"
________
vapor genie (http://vaporizers.net/vapor-genie)

Davian93
09-24-2010, 04:08 PM
The "Mormons...IN SPACE!" aspects of The Memory of Earth series were a little too distracting to get beyond the first novel, though I liked some of the ideas of that volume.

I agree. The first 3 were bareable with that aspect of them but it was absolutely ridiculous in the 4th book. I did like those first 3 though. As soon as they all got on the spaceship, it was pretty much over...and the ending of the series was terrible...same as with the initial Ender books.


I never cared for the Alvin Maker books either.

nameless
09-24-2010, 07:40 PM
I liked the first 2 Ender books. After that they just degenerated into characters being blown away by the make-believe ramifications of make-believe scientific breakthroughs. I don't need to read 100 pages about how "phylotic resonance" means that maybe machines have souls or whatever the hell the point of all that was. Discussions about the ramifications of real science are interesting, but if it's just stuff the author invented and he's the one writing about how mind-blowing it all is, it comes off as him stroking his own ego and nothing else.

looqas
09-27-2010, 02:45 AM
Ditto to everything you have said here.

Series really got derailed. It was like a student partying hard and then settling down and starting a family. All the action gone. ;)

yks 6nnetu hing
09-27-2010, 05:51 AM
I think I agree with pretty much everyone: Ender's Game was just plain awesome with amazing sauce. I quite liked the direct sequels to the original story as well, mainly the non-human species were interestingly thought out and while some of the future technologies' ramifications were rather odd (the china-based genetically engineered obsessive-compulsive society was just weird), I thought those were rather interesting as well. thought-provoking, at least.

But did not like the parallel story of Bean - mainly because his genius much too often acted as a deus ex machina device just to get the story going. It doesn't matter that the situations is impossible, Bean to the rescue. Oh wait, but he's all dysfunctional. Never mind, Bean still to the rescue! Oh, and his alias is Legume - who would have thought, and him such a genius! I found most of the dialogue in the Bean series to be horribly contrived and half the time Card came off as a bad stand-up comedian. Quite sad, really.

Leanne
09-07-2011, 09:05 PM
Late to the game...I bought the box set for my son, Ender's Game is on his summer reading list. It's something I have been wanting to read for a long time. Awesome! I could not put it down. Hoping he is reading it as I type.

Question though. The next book in the box set is "Speaker for the Dead". As I understand it, that is actually the next book and the Shadow series are actually different viewpoints??? So, I can read these and then go back and read the Shadow books?

Davian93
09-07-2011, 09:14 PM
Late to the game...I bought the box set for my son, Ender's Game is on his summer reading list. It's something I have been wanting to read for a long time. Awesome! I could not put it down. Hoping he is reading it as I type.

Question though. The next book in the box set is "Speaker for the Dead". As I understand it, that is actually the next book and the Shadow series are actually different viewpoints??? So, I can read these and then go back and read the Shadow books?

The enemy's gate is down.


Yes, Speaker and Xenocide are the next two books of the series and Children of the Mind is the final in the 4 book Ender series. The Shadow series was written later and its from Bean's POV for the most part...with Petra getting some chapters as well along with Peter Wiggin. Its a companion series that repeats some of Ender's Game from Bean's viewpoint.

Personally, I LOVE Enders Game, tolerated Speaker and Xenocide, and enjoyed the Bean books. Enders Game is just an iconic novel up there with Starship Troopers and Moon is a Harsh Mistress for my favorite sci-fi books.

the_collective
09-08-2011, 06:45 PM
I'm disappointed to see that the general consensus on the original Ender's Game series (meaning all 4 books, not just the first one) is tepid at best, while everyone seems to have enjoyed the Bean series by a good margin more.

I had exactly the opposite reaction to all of the above. I loved Ender's Game, of course, but my enjoyment only increased through Speaker, then Xenocide. I'll admit that Children of the Mind wasn't all that impressive by comparison, but I even liked that book more than ANY of the Bean books. Though I want to point out that I think there seems to be 3 writing styles used for all of this: the one used for Ender's Game itself (and by proxy Ender's Shadow), the one used for books 2-4 of Ender's story, and the one used for books 2-4? 5? of Beans story. I think that perhaps this is the reason for the differing opinions on the series, but I digress.

I thought the only redeeming quality in any of the Bean books was seeing more of Peter Wiggin. (******POSSIBLE SPOILERS FOLLOW********) I thought Bean's character in particular was quite ridiculous with his abilities (he literally - fucking literally hides in a toilet's tank to avoid capture after being alive for a matter of weeks, iirc), his relationship with Petra was crap in my opinion, and the whole Achilles thing with the two of them using world governments as pawns essentially, was also something I didn't care for (or, rather be able to "suspend my belief" long enough to enjoy). (*********END OF POSSIBLE SPOILERS**********)

Some of you may be interested to know that Ender's Game as it exists today in its current form was only written to serve as an introduction to Speaker for the Dead, according to Card. In fact, there was one point several years ago that Card made the original novella available to read, and it tells Ender's whole story in just a few pages.

It was during my investigation of this novella that I'd learned Card had wanted to do the idea he'd had for Speaker independent of Ender's Game, and only decided after the fact that Andrew Wiggin was the character he'd wanted to use to portray the Speaker for the Dead himself. So he went back and fleshed out the whole Ender's Game idea to make Ender become the proper Speaker for the Dead.

At any rate, I thought it was interesting. I haven't bothered to find any quotes or links to give you guys, and I'm not sure any of it even exists any more, as it's been a while since I've seen such.

And for the record, Valentine Wiggin is not only aptly named, she's by far my favorite character in the series' (Peter's a close second). I noticed no one else gave her any love...

Davian93
09-08-2011, 06:54 PM
Ahh...you just reminded me of all the things I hated about the Shadow series. They WERE really bad at times now that I remember.

Leanne
09-08-2011, 09:21 PM
Some of you may be interested to know that Ender's Game as it exists today in its current form was only written to serve as an introduction to Speaker for the Dead, according to Card. In fact, there was one point several years ago that Card made the original novella available to read, and it tells Ender's whole story in just a few pages.



This is in the introduction to Speaker for the Dead.

yks 6nnetu hing
09-09-2011, 03:22 AM
I dint' like the Bean stories that much either, mainly because of the extremely... flippant style of writing. Much like reading Eddings - there's nothing wrong with Eddings but after you're used to exert your mind a bit (as was the case with Ender's Game and the follow-up original series), it just feels... vapid.

GonzoTheGreat
09-09-2011, 05:07 AM
Another thing that stuck with me is how the civilization is explained, how social discussion is being held "online". Especially since the book was written pre-internet era :)Nitpick: the Internet already existed for about a decade and a half when the book appeared.
True, it wasn't all that widely known, yet, but it was there. And I suspect that a sufficiently nerdy American student would have been aware of it in the late 1970s.

According to the Wiki page on OSC (which I read after typing the previous bit), "... he also spent a year in a Ph.D. program at the University of Notre Dame ... an environment that has played a significant role in Ender's Game and many of his other works."*

* Note: a virtual rubber ducky for the first one to spot what I did there.

the_collective
09-09-2011, 12:03 PM
Note: a virtual rubber ducky for the first one to spot what I did there.

Was it taking a Mormon author, pointing out that he went to a Catholic College, then specifically stating that the Catholic College "played a significant role" in the books we're talking about (and others, presumably including the aforementioned 'Space Mormons')?

That's all I got...

:-P

GonzoTheGreat
09-09-2011, 12:20 PM
Not good enough to get the VD.

the_collective
09-09-2011, 12:28 PM
Not good enough to get the VD.

Well, maybe someday someone will appreciate what I have to give enough to give me the VD...

<crosses fingers>

SauceyBlueConfetti
09-09-2011, 02:22 PM
To the typo Gods (in this case Terez) thank you for editing the thread title. I was having fits but didn't want to be called out as a grammar Nazi for changing it. :D

Oh, and I am ashamed to admit this: I have never read Ender's Game.

the_collective
09-09-2011, 02:49 PM
To the typo Gods (in this case Terez) thank you for editing the thread title. I was having fits but didn't want to be called out as a grammar Nazi for changing it. :D

My thanks as well. I also didn't want to be the spelling Nazi (btw, contrary to popular internet user opinion, spelling and grammar are completely separate issues, but I digress - English Nazi though I may be).

Oh, and I am ashamed to admit this: I have never read Ender's Game.

Lucky for you, there's still time, since it is still in print. You won't regret it. I don't care who you or what your views are. It's a damn good book.