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nameless
09-27-2010, 04:26 PM
Just an idle thought, but I noticed there are a decent amount of similarities between the value system of the Horneaters and the Shin. They both place supreme value on the creation of food and crafts and relegate warrior-castes to the bottom of the pecking order. This is the opposite of the Alethi system, but there are hints that it is closer to the original ideals of the Radiants and the Way of Kings, and that the present Alethi hierarchy is an inversion of those ideals. Many of the lighteyes mock Dalinar for his devotion to a book that claims lighteyes (ie warrior caste whose eyes have been transformed by Shards) should be subservient to commoners. Dalinar himself believes that to be a misinterpretation of the Way of Kings, but he has his own prejudices that would make him resist the idea of lowering the social standing of the warrior class. So I got to thinking: what do the Alethi and their neighbors have that cause them to value eye color as a sign of leadership that could explain why their value system was corrupted? The answer: Shards. The Horneaters do not have any Shards, and the Shin treat carrying the one Shardblade they own as a punishment. Alethkar, on the other hand, has more Shards than any other nation on the planet. I think the Shardblades may have somehow given Odium leverage to corrupt their possessors away from the ideals of the Radiants, and this corrupting influence is why the Recreance, in which the Knights Radiant allowed untrained minds to pick up Shardblades, was considered such an awful crime.

FollowYourMuse
09-29-2010, 08:38 PM
The Comment by Wit made me wonder even more on the lighteyes concept:

"Perhaps Wit should have been bemused by the stock these people put in something as simple as eye color, but he has been many places and seen many methods of rule. This didn't seem any more ridiculous than most others.
And, of course there was reason the people did what they did. Well, there was usually a reason. In this case, it Just happened to be a good one."
The Way Of Kings, Epilogue
Bold added by me, What is the Good reason that they choose the ruling class because of light eyes?

FollowYourMuse
09-29-2010, 08:55 PM
I think this may explain a lot on the reasons for valueing ligth eyes/

Interlude 3 " The Glory Of Ignorance":
Szeth internal commentary:

"What would these men say if they knew the man who emptied their chamberpot was a Shardbearer and a Surgebinder? A Windrunner, like the Radiants of Old? The momnet he summoned his Blade, his eyes would turn from dark green to pale-almost glowing-saphire, a unique effect of his particular weapon"

Two things come to mind here, 1 that at least for Szeth, his Blade turns his eyes light ( makes him a Lighteyes).
and 2. His particular Blade? is his Blade different than the other Shardblades?

nameless
09-29-2010, 10:03 PM
I think maybe his Blade is one of the Nine left behind when the Heralds deserted. If the Heralds had glowing blue eyes it would explain the Alethi tradition of associating blue eyes with leadership.

Madgod
10-06-2010, 11:00 PM
and 2. His particular Blade? is his Blade different than the other Shardblades?

From what I understood in the book, his Shardblade is at least shorter than the others. Most Shardblades are about 6 feet if i remember correctly, and Szeth's is a normal sized sword. Now why there is a difference, I have no idea. I wouldn't think it was one of the Heralds, for some reason I want to guess they would be the same size or bigger than most. Maybe his was originally a dagger/short sword?
Also, I thought every Shardblade made the owener a lighteyes, thats why every darkeyes went to war was to try to win one. So then the next question would be, why do the other Shardblades change the eye color permanently and not Szeth's?

nameless
10-07-2010, 06:44 PM
That could be a language issue. The Alethi don't have any word for nobility/leadership other than "lighteyes," so that's how they would refer to a promotion whether or not someone's eye color actually changed.

JaconKin
10-08-2010, 02:03 AM
I think this may explain a lot on the reasons for valueing ligth eyes/

Interlude 3 " The Glory Of Ignorance":
Szeth internal commentary:



Two things come to mind here, 1 that at least for Szeth, his Blade turns his eyes light ( makes him a Lighteyes).
and 2. His particular Blade? is his Blade different than the other Shardblades?

Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that from all the characters in the books, he is actually closest to having the full capabilities of a Knight Radiant?

Able to use the lashing magic and has a shard blade? Remember the one vision sequence when the Knight's Radiants actually gave up their blades, they glowed and had glyphs on them. A feature that the Shardblades seem to lack currently.

One Armed Gimp
10-09-2010, 02:03 PM
Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that from all the characters in the books, he is actually closest to having the full capabilities of a Knight Radiant?

Able to use the lashing magic and has a shard blade? Remember the one vision sequence when the Knight's Radiants actually gave up their blades, they glowed and had glyphs on them. A feature that the Shardblades seem to lack currently.

I tend to agree on why Szeth's become lighter.

As for the last part, I think you are confusing some scenes. The Blades of the Heralds have glyphs, the Radiants Shardeplate glowed and had glyphs when fighting the Essence, but the Shardblades merely glowed when the Radiants gave them up, they did not have glyphs.

Terez
10-09-2010, 04:51 PM
I think all Shardblades have glyphs on them. Elhokar's blade is described as having the 'ten fundamental glyphs' on it.

One Armed Gimp
10-09-2010, 06:54 PM
Elhokars is the only one that we know of currently. We do know that some of other Shardblades have etchings and designs on them. Then again does Elhokars really count? The glyphs seen on the Shardplate only appeared when the Knights Radiant were wearing them and they were glowing. Elhokars glyphs are etched in.

WinespringBrother
10-10-2010, 08:53 PM
The Comment by Wit made me wonder even more on the lighteyes concept:


Bold added by me, What is the Good reason that they choose the ruling class because of light eyes?

TWOK Epilogue:
The gates were closed, and these men were of the night watch, a somewhat inappropriate title. They didn't spend time "watching" so much as chatting, yawning, gambling or ---in tonight's case---standing uncomfortably and listening to a crazy man.

This section is right before the one you quoted. My impression is that the "good reason for what people do" was referring to listening to the crazy man who is probably wiser than he seems.

Nafro
12-17-2010, 12:41 PM
Elhokars is the only one that we know of currently. We do know that some of other Shardblades have etchings and designs on them. Then again does Elhokars really count? The glyphs seen on the Shardplate only appeared when the Knights Radiant were wearing them and they were glowing. Elhokars glyphs are etched in.

Wasn't Taln's blade at the end described as "plain".