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Artur pendragon
10-09-2010, 03:01 AM
Does Ganoes Paran reappear in any later books after he and onearm's host disappear in the seven cities?:confused:

Terez
10-09-2010, 03:08 AM
Only briefly, when someone...can't remember who...contacted him via some magic method or another. Well, I haven't read DoD yet. I need to do that soon...

I remember hearing a rumor he wouldn't be seen again, and that the ending had nothing to do with him, but that makes no sense really...

Sei'taer
10-10-2010, 10:19 PM
Does Ganoes Paran reappear in any later books after he and onearm's host disappear in the seven cities?:confused:



If you really want me to spoil it for you, he is alluded to many times in DoD but he doesn't show up. I'd really like him to be there at the end, but we'll have to wait and see

DahLliA
10-10-2010, 11:25 PM
IIRC there was a quote from Erikson saying that not all loose threads would be gathered up in the last book(and considering the sheer amount of them it would be impossible). and I got a feeling that Paran might be one of them.

then again he's also said he and Esselmont will write more side-novels, so all hope is not lost.

hopefully we'll find out what Silverfox used the T'lan Imass for too some day.

yks 6nnetu hing
10-11-2010, 08:33 AM
question #2: does each book just ditch everything that happened in the previous one?

I'm now 140 pages into book 2. While book 1 ended quite interestingly after all (and he managed to get over his own pretentiousness. Either that or I stopped caring about his preening in the foreword) and I managed to get my hopes up for the rest of the series... book 2 so far... well, it sucks, it's all back to square 1. I paid good money for that lug of paper so I keep hoping it'll get better. But seriously starting to wonder if I should bother at all :(

Daekyras
10-11-2010, 09:38 AM
question #2: does each book just ditch everything that happened in the previous one?

I'm now 140 pages into book 2. While book 1 ended quite interestingly after all (and he managed to get over his own pretentiousness. Either that or I stopped caring about his preening in the foreword) and I managed to get my hopes up for the rest of the series... book 2 so far... well, it sucks, it's all back to square 1. I paid good money for that lug of paper so I keep hoping it'll get better. But seriously starting to wonder if I should bother at all :(

I found the same with deadhouse gate. The third book(memories of ice?, can't remember for sure!) is set at the same time and is a more direct sequel to gardens. Percevere yks, it gets better.

jason wolfbrother
10-11-2010, 11:27 AM
The first five do sort of jump around but they all tie in together eventually and continue onward generally in sequence from there on. The two (third set to be released around same time as The Crippled God is) Ian C. Esslemont books also fit into the storyline, Knight of Knives is a prequel to the entire series, and Return of the Crimson Guard takes place between Reaper's Gale and Toll the Hounds. There is still some jumping around but not quite as much as between Gardens of the Moon/Deadhouse Gates and then again with Memories of Ice/House of Chains. Daekyras is right, persevere :) Don't give up. It is worth the hassle of struggling through Deadhouse Gates.

Artur pendragon
10-11-2010, 12:52 PM
Only briefly, when someone...can't remember who...contacted him via some magic method or another. Well, I haven't read DoD yet. I need to do that soon...

I remember hearing a rumor he wouldn't be seen again, and that the ending had nothing to do with him, but that makes no sense really...

If you really want me to spoil it for you, he is alluded to many times in DoD but he doesn't show up. I'd really like him to be there at the end, but we'll have to wait and see

Thanks for the Info. I just got Reaper's Gale after sitting on back order for a month (Burn Amazon:mad:):)

Sei'taer
10-11-2010, 03:16 PM
question #2: does each book just ditch everything that happened in the previous one?

I'm now 140 pages into book 2. While book 1 ended quite interestingly after all (and he managed to get over his own pretentiousness. Either that or I stopped caring about his preening in the foreword) and I managed to get my hopes up for the rest of the series... book 2 so far... well, it sucks, it's all back to square 1. I paid good money for that lug of paper so I keep hoping it'll get better. But seriously starting to wonder if I should bother at all :(


I loved book 2. Coltaine is my hero! I hear a lot of people say how much they hated it but it's one of my favorites. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose.

I skipped the Esselmont books...should I go get them?

Terez
10-11-2010, 06:19 PM
I liked the end of book 2. The rest of it sucked.

I'm trying to read ROTCG right now. Night of Knives was...kinda like reading YA. But for all that, it's easy to read.

DahLliA
10-13-2010, 01:02 PM
I skipped the Esselmont books...should I go get them?

I recommend them at least.

and Coltaine is pretty awesome.

as for Deadhouse Gates I remember being a bit pissed off that it seemed to just start all over, but after a while I started enjoying all the new characters as much as the old ones. had the same problem with House of Chains, but got over that too pretty quickly.

yks 6nnetu hing
10-14-2010, 04:27 AM
I recommend them at least.

and Coltaine is pretty awesome.

as for Deadhouse Gates I remember being a bit pissed off that it seemed to just start all over, but after a while I started enjoying all the new characters as much as the old ones. had the same problem with House of Chains, but got over that too pretty quickly.

well, seeing as I had a problem identifying with any of the characters in book 1 until about 100 pages before the end... *sigh*. I am somewhat more intrigued by some of the characters in book 2 though.

There are some things that... the historian being the only one to pick up on the aim of the military practices - lame! man, that stuff was so obvious. There were a few more things but not sure if they are/were spoilers or not.

DahLliA
10-14-2010, 10:47 PM
There are some things that... the historian being the only one to pick up on the aim of the military practices - lame! man, that stuff was so obvious. There were a few more things but not sure if they are/were spoilers or not.

Duiker is an ex-soldier though. IIRC he pretty much got forced into becoming a historian by one of the old guard. can't remember which of them though

Sarevok
10-15-2010, 06:14 AM
Duiker is an ex-soldier though. IIRC he pretty much got forced into becoming a historian by one of the old guard. can't remember which of them though

By the emperor himself. :p

yks 6nnetu hing
10-15-2010, 07:02 AM
irrelevant. A 6-year old could have picked up the purpose of those drills. And yet, a cadre mage and the entire officers corps didn't??? wtf?

*sigh* frankly, those Malazans got what they set in motion themselves. Don't occupy places you morons! Or if you do occupy places, please be aware that the indigenous population might be a tad bit pissed off and probably will retaliate.

Terez
10-15-2010, 07:05 AM
as for Deadhouse Gates I remember being a bit pissed off that it seemed to just start all over, but after a while I started enjoying all the new characters as much as the old ones.
Even Felisin?

DahLliA
10-15-2010, 08:22 AM
Even Felisin?

well. it's been a while since I read DG, but while I wouldn't enter any longterm relationship with her I did find her well-written :p

anyone is bound to become a bit bitter when your sister sends you off into slavery and prostitution:p

Crispin's Crispian
10-18-2010, 12:37 PM
question #2: does each book just ditch everything that happened in the previous one?

I'm now 140 pages into book 2. While book 1 ended quite interestingly after all (and he managed to get over his own pretentiousness. Either that or I stopped caring about his preening in the foreword) and I managed to get my hopes up for the rest of the series... book 2 so far... well, it sucks, it's all back to square 1. I paid good money for that lug of paper so I keep hoping it'll get better. But seriously starting to wonder if I should bother at all :(
Over at the MalazanEmpire.com forums, the common response is, "the timeline doesn't matter."

For the most part, things have an order, but Erikson himself has said that readers shouldn't get caught up wondering which event happened when. I think each book internally is fine, but there are some known inconsistencies between books and historically.

YKS, I don't remember exactly when, but some familiar characters do show up again. Every time I think about rereading DG, I think to myself, "blech...the Chain of Dog is so grueling and boring." Then I start rereading it and realize it's not. Most of all, SE's books hold up better on rereads than those of almost any other author.

yks 6nnetu hing
10-19-2010, 04:22 AM
Even Felisin?

you know, I think so far Felisin's my favourite in this book. Talk about Stockholm syndrome plus incredible naivete plus extreme paranoia :D Not a necessarily likeable character, but best written of the bunch.

But, we'll see, not even halfway thought yet.

Over at the MalazanEmpire.com forums, the common response is, "the timeline doesn't matter."

For the most part, things have an order, but Erikson himself has said that readers shouldn't get caught up wondering which event happened when. I think each book internally is fine, but there are some known inconsistencies between books and historically.

YKS, I don't remember exactly when, but some familiar characters do show up again. Every time I think about rereading DG, I think to myself, "blech...the Chain of Dog is so grueling and boring." Then I start rereading it and realize it's not. Most of all, SE's books hold up better on rereads than those of almost any other author.
well... It's not the timeline so much as the characters. That's basically what makes or breaks the book for me: if I'm not interested in the characters, what's the point of reading. In book 1 the only one that was even remotely interesting to me was Tattersail and we know what happened to her in that book. Although, towards the end, Kruppe was also becoming somewhat interesting.

I'm guessing that lots of people like the Sorry/Apsalar character? I find her... barely there. Even when she gets screen-time (so to speak), she's just flat. No expression, no emotion, no intrigue - She doesn't even propel the story on.

Sukoto
10-19-2010, 06:15 PM
It's been a couple years since I read the first 3 Malazan books. Now I am having trouble remembering what happened in each book. The plot did seem a bit spastic, to be honest. I'm not going to continue with the series until it's finished.

That said, I found the completely different stories in each book refreshing. You learn early on that any one storyline might just drop off the face of the earth, so you can't really invest yourself into any particular one. It makes it a more enjoyable, easy read that's full of surprises.

Crispin's Crispian
10-21-2010, 01:32 PM
well... It's not the timeline so much as the characters. That's basically what makes or breaks the book for me: if I'm not interested in the characters, what's the point of reading. In book 1 the only one that was even remotely interesting to me was Tattersail and we know what happened to her in that book. Although, towards the end, Kruppe was also becoming somewhat interesting.

I'm guessing that lots of people like the Sorry/Apsalar character? I find her... barely there. Even when she gets screen-time (so to speak), she's just flat. No expression, no emotion, no intrigue - She doesn't even propel the story on.

I don't know that everyone loves Apsalar. She was definitely deviod of character for the first few books, but that was the point. Erikson makes up for that a bit later, though.

In GotM, my favorite was Crone, followed closely by Rake. (It's not really fair to like the coolest character ever written, but even so...) Crone and Kruppe are great together in their few moments. Later on SE digs much more deeply into some characters, especially in HoC and MT. One particular character introduced in HoC is very well developed, and if you liked what he did with Felisin you might just like this character too.

Galagros
10-22-2010, 10:18 AM
This series often confuses me. It isn't that there are a ton of characters, it's that you often don't see some characters for huge lengths and the chronology of when things happen boggles the mind. I started reading shortly before Toll the Hounds was released, so I am definitely new to it (and have only read through once). At certain points I really found myself wanting to just toss one of the books away and never look back, but then there would be an epic moment that would keep me around.

I haven't read Dust of Dreams yet (or Night of Knives, for that matter). I'm waiting until after ToM before I even begin to contemplate an entire re-read of the series.

Crispin's Crispian
10-26-2010, 02:27 PM
For what it's worth to fans and non-fans, there's some serious excitement about the final installment of the 10-book series. Some of the folks at MalazanEmpire.com (forum.malazanempire.com) (who are also personal friends of Steven Erikson) were given advanced copies of the book.

Apparently, Erikson delivers. "Big time!" Hetan (also an admin at ME.com) hasn't spoiled anything, but says the book is amazing and very satisfying. She said that it makes MoI look like a tea party, whatever that means.

Unfortunately, the release date has been pushed back to mid-late February, 2011. :(

Terez
10-26-2010, 08:39 PM
I have to read book 9 before I can get excited about book 10...

jason wolfbrother
10-26-2010, 10:29 PM
Well that is bad in that I now have to wait an additional 2 months to read it...but good because it means I can focus on ToM and TWoK ;) ;) :cool:. I've waited this long, and Erikson is good about delivering a book worth waiting for. I'll manage :) ;)

yks 6nnetu hing
11-26-2010, 04:05 AM
finished book 2. Liked the Felisin story arc - psychologically speaking it is very logical the way she progressed - even though Heboric fell flat in the end.

I didn't mind the chain of dogs storyline, found it somewhat implausible but not bad or anything

everyone died. yet again. *sigh*

Sarevok
11-26-2010, 04:48 PM
everyone died. yet again. *sigh*

*points at title of the book series and this thread*

Terez
11-26-2010, 05:17 PM
finished book 2. Liked the Felisin story arc - psychologically speaking it is very logical the way she progressed - even though Heboric fell flat in the end.

I didn't mind the chain of dogs storyline, found it somewhat implausible but not bad or anything

everyone died. yet again. *sigh*
I suppose it shouldn't surprise me that you liked Felisin but didn't get too excited about Coltaine. I think Felisin was the most annoying character ever, despite being believable.

Terez
11-26-2010, 05:20 PM
Over at the MalazanEmpire.com forums, the common response is, "the timeline doesn't matter."
No, no, no. You must chant to yourself, 'There is no timeline. There is no timeline. There is no timeline...'

Belazamon
11-27-2010, 01:43 AM
No, no, no. You must chant to yourself, 'There is no timeline. There is no timeline. There is no timeline...'
Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so.

Terez
11-27-2010, 01:46 AM
Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so.
Was that Kruppe or Tehol? I can't remember.

Belazamon
11-27-2010, 01:47 AM
Was that Kruppe or Tehol? I can't remember.
Ford Prefect, actually. ;)

Terez
11-27-2010, 01:50 AM
Ford Prefect, actually. ;)
I suspected it was something non-Malazan too. But it sounded like something either Kruppe or Tehol might say.

Belazamon
11-27-2010, 01:53 AM
I suspected it was something non-Malazan too. But it sounded like something either Kruppe or Tehol might say.
True fact. And I could just as easily see Ford wrestling an angry cactus as well.

Infidel
11-27-2010, 12:22 PM
FWIW, I read on one of the Malazan Empire threads that Erikson had said that Memories of Ice was written, and supposed to be published, following Gardens of the Moon, but that the manuscript was lost. No copy, no digital backup, nada. He was so pissed and dejected that he didn't rewrite it until he finished Deadhouse Gates.

Next reread, I'm going to follow that order.

yks 6nnetu hing
11-29-2010, 03:25 AM
I suppose it shouldn't surprise me that you liked Felisin but didn't get too excited about Coltaine. I think Felisin was the most annoying character ever, despite being believable.

not saying I liked her exactly. For one, I thought what came out of her mouth was too mild compared to what Erikson wanted to convey in her thoughts. For another, I thought it weird that she was most influenced by events/people that she really didn't spend comparatively as much time with. Meaning, Heboric and Baudin barely made an impression on her... Well, Baudin made a small impression in the very end... but still.

Coltaine was impressive but unfeasible. Particularly the end. On so many levels.

And, most of all, I still have a problem with the way Erikson writes. He comes off super-snobby and elitist while his writing style is not even close to RJ in descriptive and complex, Hobb in emotional or even Sanderson in dialogue.

Terez
11-29-2010, 09:08 PM
How far have you made it? Erikson is not really a snob on this sort of thing but his fans are, for sure. His descriptive writing takes a HUGE step up starting in about book 6.

morat'corlm
11-30-2010, 12:34 AM
His interviews and Q&A sessions (at least the ones I've read recently) tend to come across pretty arrogantly. Not on a Goodkind level, but he seems to think himself quite the artiste.

Terez
11-30-2010, 12:36 AM
His interviews and Q&A sessions (at least the ones I've read recently) tend to come across pretty arrogantly. Not on a Goodkind level, but he seems to think himself quite the artiste.
Not any more than RJ did. Erikson has done something pretty unique with his series; don't mistake his knowing that for arrogance.

yks 6nnetu hing
11-30-2010, 02:58 AM
How far have you made it? Erikson is not really a snob on this sort of thing but his fans are, for sure. His descriptive writing takes a HUGE step up starting in about book 6. I've finished book 2, will take a break for a Potter re-read now.

His interviews and Q&A sessions (at least the ones I've read recently) tend to come across pretty arrogantly. Not on a Goodkind level, but he seems to think himself quite the artiste. See, that's exactly it. I got really put off by his foreword in Gardens of the Moon (yeah, I read the forewords... lame, I know) where he compared himself to other writers whose works are hard to get into at first. 1) Eco does not write 80000-page epics, at most it takes about 50 pages to "get into" his books 2) The writers he compares himself to are actually good. you can call me wrong but if a fantasy writer compares himself to Tolkien, Steinbeck and Dumas in the same breath, I assume he's either joking or completely full of it. And Erikson wasn't joking. 3) why on earth do the readers have to "work their way in" until book 6 (!!!!) to get to like the stuff?

pompous ass, is what he is.

Crispin's Crispian
11-30-2010, 01:22 PM
3) why on earth do the readers have to "work their way in" until book 6 (!!!!) to get to like the stuff?

pompous ass, is what he is.
Funny...I liked GotM right away, and didn't mind the challenge not knowing who was who or what, in general, was going on. I guess I must be in the tiny minority.

Most readers loved the Chain of Dogs storyline, but it wasn't my favorite. I also found it implausible and Coltaine far too one-dimensional (if not completely uninteresting). I was much more taken by the Bridgeburners scenes and with Icarium/Mappo.

Since you're not like most readers, you might not find that the third book is amazing and stupendous and the best book since writing was invented. I don't think that at all, but I do think it took the series to a new level of (good) complexity and excitement.

If you can make it through Book 4 (which was the weakest, IMO, despite that I enjoyed the first part more than the average reader), you might get hooked.

LOL And if you just make it through Book 9...

yks 6nnetu hing
11-30-2010, 01:43 PM
Funny...I liked GotM right away, and didn't mind the challenge not knowing who was who or what, in general, was going on. I guess I must be in the tiny minority.

Most readers loved the Chain of Dogs storyline, but it wasn't my favorite. I also found it implausible and Coltaine far too one-dimensional (if not completely uninteresting). I was much more taken by the Bridgeburners scenes and with Icarium/Mappo.

Since you're not like most readers, you might not find that the third book is amazing and stupendous and the best book since writing was invented. I don't think that at all, but I do think it took the series to a new level of (good) complexity and excitement.

If you can make it through Book 4 (which was the weakest, IMO, despite that I enjoyed the first part more than the average reader), you might get hooked.

LOL And if you just make it through Book 9...

meh. I really didn't mind the confusion. I've started a series from book 4, and then 1, 2, 3, 5, 6, 7 for crissakes. I mind the blithe... sort of... "let's pretend no-one cares about anything and nothing hurts at all. Oh, and let's constantly write ourselves into a corner and then provide a deus ex machina to get the story going again" I don't even mind the timeline issues - we're talking about magic, time can definitely be flexible. It's just... one battle after another and he gets through it by the skin of his teeth, and then gets an even mightier foe and even crappier situation but oh look out of nowhere help comes and they get through by the skin of their teeth but oh look, an even worse situation comes and there's no way out and then they all escape and almost survive but they don't survive but they survive (but maybe never to be seen again on screen). and they don't care either which way because it's all "bigger than themselves" and whatnot. blahdiblahdiblah.

I think I'll keep reading so I can keep complaining though:p

DahLliA
11-30-2010, 06:17 PM
I just pretty much figured Coltaine was using his powers(him being an ascendant and all) to boost his troops. sorta like an aura of awesome

Crispin's Crispian
11-30-2010, 07:42 PM
It's just... one battle after another and he gets through it by the skin of his teeth, and then gets an even mightier foe and even crappier situation but oh look out of nowhere help comes and they get through by the skin of their teeth but oh look, an even worse situation comes and there's no way out and then they all escape and almost survive but they don't survive but they survive (but maybe never to be seen again on screen). and they don't care either which way because it's all "bigger than themselves" and whatnot. blahdiblahdiblah.

I think I'll keep reading so I can keep complaining though:p
Wow. You're going to love the rest of the books. Just wait till you meet Karsa.

DahLliA
01-24-2012, 12:20 PM
I just got Orb, Sceptre, Throne(the new Malazan book by ICE) today.

only read a few pages, but it looks like it's going to be a great trip back to Darujhistan.

I also figured out why I like the Malazan books so much. it's the lack of one major bigbad.

I know you got the Crippled God, but he doesn't have the same role as the DO for example. and not every scheme or story in the Malazan books are either for or against the CG.

just makes the world feel bigger in a way

Crispin's Crispian
01-25-2012, 03:40 PM
I just read the Prologue on the web. It won't be released in the States till May or something. Glad to hear to sounds good.

SauceyBlueConfetti
01-27-2012, 11:22 AM
I have always ordered my Malazan books (after the first 2) through Amazon UK because the release dates in the US were YEARS behind.

For some odd reason, they ship out of a bookstore in New York or Indiana and are cheaper than the US versions. I accidentally ordered two of the same book once, the customer service was great and said return it, no problem. I didn't--I forwarded on to someone from TL. Bela? You SDog? I don't remember. The covers are different than the US releases, the books are different sizes too. But you get it early :)

go here (http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_0_8/276-0137727-5485645?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=orb+sceptre+throne&sprefix=orb+scep%2Cstripbooks%2C505) then click the link on the right that says "more buying choices" than scan the list for NEW and where they originate. I see Indiana listed.

Crispin's Crispian
01-27-2012, 03:58 PM
I'm actually behind on my WoT reread, plus have another book in the queue that was written by the husband of my wife's co-worker. In other words, I can wait till May. I think I'll end up buying Stonewielder and OST on my Kindle.

DahLliA
03-06-2012, 02:59 PM
finished OST on the train this Friday

gotta say the ending did feel a bit rushed, but he managed to get the "Malazan feeling" correct.

which of course means I almost OD'd on bittersweetness near the end :p

one weird thing in this book though:

K'rul is suddenly a woman?

Terez
04-01-2012, 11:59 AM
I'm not reading the thread, to avoid spoilers. But an interesting person dropped by the Malazan chat room yesterday, and I thought some of you might enjoy reading this transcript (http://forum.malazanempire.com/index.php?showtopic=21940&view=findpost&p=949633).