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Southpaw2012
06-29-2011, 09:59 PM
out of the main characters, who do you think will die based on foretellings, viewings, dreams, etc? Rand doesn't count because otherwise this thread will turn into another one discussing how he'll come back to life.

The Unreasoner
06-29-2011, 10:21 PM
bryne's not going anywhere, unfortunately.

Bashere and dobraine though are going down,:(

i gotta bad feeling about talmanes though.

smart money says most characters with a recent love interest will survive.

Kimon
06-29-2011, 10:37 PM
bryne's not going anywhere, unfortunately.

Bashere and dobraine though are going down,:(

i gotta bad feeling about talmanes though.

smart money says most characters with a recent love interest will survive.

None of those are main characters, and with the possible exception of Bashere, there isn't really much in the way of textual evidence (viewings, foretellings, dreams) to hint at their potential for dying. Even with Bashere, there isn't much, just Min's viewing of something dark in his future, but that could mean many things.

With the exception of Rand, there isn't much reason to expect any of the mains will die, unless you believe that the Broken Wolf in the Dark Prophecy is someone other than Rand. Of course, "the last days of the Fallen Blacksmith's pride shall come" might mean that Perrin is toast too.

Elmindreada
06-29-2011, 10:44 PM
Unreasoner, I think you need to read the question again. I suppose arguments could be made about all the characters you mentioned being mains... but let everyone in on what you're basing all of this on that gives you such certainty.

out of the main characters, who do you think will die based on foretellings, viewings, dreams, etc?

Haven't you taken standardized tests? You'll always end up in the Trolloc cookpot if you don't read the directions thoroughly.

More on topic, I think that Mat might die, sad as I may be to see him go. I say this because A) he's cheated death one too many times for him to just get away with it all and B) I have no idea how Sanderson/Jordan are going to reconcile that odd marriage. Although, that could possibly be the reason why I'm not an acclaimed writer. (I'm going to file these reasons under "etc." to cover my rear).

And I've been beaten to it. Curse these slow fingers, now I'm just redundant! Ah well.

The Unreasoner
06-29-2011, 10:51 PM
talmanes is just a gut feeling, i admit.
but dobraine has had some viewings at least regarding the consequences of his death, and bashere has the same viewings, plus the something dark, plus his place in the saldaen line for the throne.

how do you come up with mat though? isn't he, along with merilille and talaan, like the only three we know for sure will survive from the outriggers?

Southpaw2012
06-29-2011, 10:54 PM
no worries, Bashere is an important character. As for Mat, someone said that RJ mentioned one of the outrigger novels would've been about Mat and Tuon that takes place after Tarmon Gaidon so if that was true, Mat will more than likely live. As for how that marriage will workout, I think it will based on Mat will help change the Seanchan ways and how the Empire could adjust its ways.

The Unreasoner
06-29-2011, 10:59 PM
if we are limiting 'main' to characters at the inn in baerlon, and if everything but etc needs a prophecy, aelfinn answer, viewing or dream, that list boils down to just rand. we can either widen the demands for 'main' status or we can run with etc, but otherwise...

i took etc to mean thematic demands, and given the tone of ToM, the views of Morgase and Faile, I don't see recently married couples suffering a high death rate

Elmindreada
06-29-2011, 11:04 PM
No no, I'm 100% aware that there was an outrigger that was going to be about the Seanchan. Which could very easily imply Mat was included... but for some reason I have it in my head that no one outright stated that it was about Mat/Tuon, and that it is just inference/speculation.

It just doesn't seem like Jordan to be so point blank about that sort of thing. Can you imagine him coming out and saying "Yes, these people will live past TG". Also, I actually immediately remebered that theory and have been trying to look it up in the databases, but all I can really find is this:

"Q: You have said, you are going to keep the series to twelve books. Since we are on eleven, what comes after book twelve, what do you plan to do after that?

RJ: At some point I will do the two prequel novels that I talked about, the two other prequel novels, besides New Spring. What I will be starting with is a trilogy called Infinity of Heaven, which will be a different universe, different world, different set of rules, different cultures. One culture that you meet eventually will be as close to being inside the Seanchan empire as you can come"

Also, how do we know there is an outrigger about Merilille and Taalan that insures their survival?? I missed that, apparently.

Kimon
06-29-2011, 11:19 PM
if we are limiting 'main' to characters at the inn in baerlon

Most would probably argue that mains = Baerlon Inn Ka-tet + Elayne and Aviendha (+ possibly Loial & Faile). If you add the main bad guys, I suppose you could toss in the remaining Forsaken and Taim.

looqas
06-30-2011, 12:57 AM
Lan and Nynaeve go ouut in a blaze of glory. Last king of Malkieri and all that. Besides Nyn did say he would choose Lan everytime as evidenced by her testing.

Marie Curie 7
06-30-2011, 02:06 PM
how do you come up with mat though? isn't he, along with merilille and talaan, like the only three we know for sure will survive from the outriggers?

Not sure where you get that about Merilille and Talaan. All that's ever been said about them, as far as I know, is that Brandon indicated that we might not find out what happened to them. That doesn't mean that they survive the Last Battle, or that they will appear in the outriggers (if they're ever written).

The Gathering Storm Book Tour, Scottsdale Public Library, Phoenix Arizona 16 November 2009 - kcf reporting

--Someone asked about Merilille the Aes Sedai in Caemlyn who ran away with a Sea Folk apprentice [Talaan]. It was implied that this may be a thread that goes unresolved.


No no, I'm 100% aware that there was an outrigger that was going to be about the Seanchan. Which could very easily imply Mat was included... but for some reason I have it in my head that no one outright stated that it was about Mat/Tuon, and that it is just inference/speculation.

It just doesn't seem like Jordan to be so point blank about that sort of thing. Can you imagine him coming out and saying "Yes, these people will live past TG". Also, I actually immediately remebered that theory and have been trying to look it up in the databases, but all I can really find is this:

RJ did state explicitly on his blog that he was going to write about Mat and Tuon about 5-10 years after the Last Battle, so we know that they survive.

Robert Jordan's blog 8 November 2006 - 'A Little Update'

So there you have it. Oh, finishing A Memory of Light, of course, and getting started on Mat and Tuon, and some others, five to ten years after the Last Battle. Those go without saying. Not a bad plan for the coming year, eh?

jana
06-30-2011, 02:26 PM
I want Perrin to betray Rand by attacking Moiraine. Then Mat can kill him. Then they can have a celebration like the one at the end of Return of the Jedi. Each dancing scene can take up three paragraphs.

greatwolf
07-02-2011, 01:57 PM
Faile? Though I would find anything to do with her boring. I think am suffering from an overdose of Faile...

I think quite a few will go at TLB. Cadsuane is really primed to go. Maybe Tam as well since he's had his day with Rand.

sandoz12
07-02-2011, 02:58 PM
how do you come up with mat though? isn't he, along with merilille and talaan, like the only three we know for sure will survive from the outriggers?

There's a thread on DM arguing (not unreasonably) that Merilille and Talaan were both killed by Careane.

As to Mat there is the RJ quote about there some truth to the saying that he has the Dark One's own luck. So I think he will have to lose his luck if the Dark One is defeated.

greatwolf
07-03-2011, 04:38 PM
talmanes is just a gut feeling, i admit.
but dobraine has had some viewings at least regarding the consequences of his death, and bashere has the same viewings, plus the something dark, plus his place in the saldaen line for the throne.

how do you come up with mat though? isn't he, along with merilille and talaan, like the only three we know for sure will survive from the outriggers?


If nyn's accepted test is anything to go by, then Sharina will survive along with Lan and nyn. But I don't see why Talaan or Merillile will survive.

Of course it goes without saying that none of the forsaken will be around. That would certainly put a spanner in the wheel's spin.

Davian93
07-03-2011, 06:52 PM
There's a thread on DM arguing (not unreasonably) that Merilille and Talaan were both killed by Careane.

As to Mat there is the RJ quote about there some truth to the saying that he has the Dark One's own luck. So I think he will have to lose his luck if the Dark One is defeated.

There's also a good chance that the moment the Last Battle ends, he'll no longer be ta'veren and thus, lose his luck that way.

jana
07-03-2011, 07:22 PM
Mat losing his luck makes sense. It would have made the outriggers more interesting, seeing him do it all with skill alone.

Davian93
07-03-2011, 08:39 PM
Mat losing his luck makes sense. It would have made the outriggers more interesting, seeing him do it all with skill alone.

A logical sidenote, does Perrin's alliance stay together once he's no longer ta'veren? Will he continue to be ta'veren after the Last Battle (as the Builder it seems like he'll continue to have an important role but who knows whether or not he keeps his special status. Without his ta'vereness, a good bet has it falling apart on him.

The Unreasoner
07-03-2011, 09:53 PM
I think they will both remain ta'veren after the LB, because they both have a role to play post-Tarmon Gaidon

jana
07-03-2011, 10:19 PM
I think they will both remain ta'veren after the LB, because they both have a role to play post-Tarmon Gaidon

I'm failing to see the connection here.
Bela has crap to do post-Tarmon Gaidon, like make babies with Mandarb after she chases off Aldieb, but is she ta'veren? No. (I should not have asked that. Queue Felix).

But the point is, lots of people and horses have stuff to do after the last battle, and I don't see how their ta'verenity is relevant.

Rand al'Fain
07-03-2011, 11:17 PM
I'm failing to see the connection here.
Bela has crap to do post-Tarmon Gaidon, like make babies with Mandarb after she chases off Aldieb, but is she ta'veren? No. (I should not have asked that. Queue Felix).

But the point is, lots of people and horses have stuff to do after the last battle, and I don't see how their ta'verenity is relevant.

Being Ta'veren is part of who they are. They were meant to take up important roles in the world, and their ta'vern abilities got them there. Which reminds me of a question that I'll ask for the questions thread.