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View Full Version : The insatiable call for outrigger novels


maacaroni
12-21-2011, 08:25 AM
I've noticed when Brandon broadcast that aMoL was finished he was bombarded with calls about whether he'd write some of the proposed outrigger novels that RJ considered doing before he passed on.

His view (and the view of Harriet) was that it would sully RJ's legacy or be exploitative.

I wonder what people's thoughts are?

My view is that unless RJ left comprehensive notes and Harriet changes her mind (time could change this) that BS is totally correct. Bear in mind that he has pretty much worked on these novels for three years, he has a right to do his own work and make his (already-growing) name in the fantasy genre. I feel lucky that WoT was finished at all and while I wouldnt say no to a book about Tam in the Companiions, or Lan/Moiraine pre-Eye of the World; I can live without them if the will or the wit (nice Fitz reference there) to produce them isn't there.

Thoughts?

Zombie Sammael
12-21-2011, 08:38 AM
My feeling on this is that it would be inappropriate to do it right away, but if as time goes by the demand is still there it should be reconsidered. I would honestly rather have them than not, myself, but I do understand the feelings of Brandon, Harriet, and the other people involved on not exploiting the hell out of it.

I am hopeful that if a final decision is taken on whether or not to write them before the release of the Encyclopedia, plot details from them may find their way into that volume.

Dajoran
12-21-2011, 10:58 AM
The instant outrigger questions struck me as highly ungrateful.

This is a man who by all means has put his own professional life on hold (well for Mr. Sanderson one book a year is slow...) to try his best to finish a series, beloved by himself and hundreds more, which is a fantastic thing in itself.

Imagine what could have happened if Mr. Rigney didnít keep notes.

Brandon should now be let free to continue his own work - (Stormlight Two please! After you've had one or two days rest of course...)

I think the outriggers should stay in the same pile that Infinity of Heaven is on. Not that I wouldn't love to read every word... but more so I think we're lucky that we will have an end to this series as it is. This turn of the wheel is over... Anything else is unnecessary.

Fin
12-21-2011, 11:04 AM
im with dajoran im glad he kept as much so we could get the ending that was correct, but other than a War of the Power book i say let the man finish his work.

Zombie Sammael
12-21-2011, 11:11 AM
im with dajoran im glad he kept as much so we could get the ending that was correct, but other than a War of the Power book i say let the man finish his work.

RJ said nothing set during the AOL. I expect that holds. Any work Brandon does on the series will be things that were already planned before RJ died.

jana
12-21-2011, 11:19 AM
This is a man who by all means has put his own professional life on hold

I don't get how, but I agree with the sentiment of the rest of your post.

Dajoran
12-21-2011, 11:42 AM
I don't get how, but I agree with the sentiment of the rest of your post.

Well since 2006 he has had at least two books of his own work published each year... he has as much said himself that a lot of that is down to a buffer of books that he had built up over the years (and as much as he likes to deny it, we know he is a prolific writer.)
Since he was pegged to finish WoT he hasn't done that much work on his own stuff, Way of Kings was first draft finished a few years before its release and Alloy of Law was just something that grew accidentally from a writing exercise.

I believe he also said that in a perfect world he would have worked on Stormlight Two alongside aMoL and published both in 2012 - but the shear scope of what he had to acomplish with WoT meant he had to put his own epic on the backburner.

AbbeyRoad
12-21-2011, 11:48 AM
The instant outrigger questions struck me as highly ungrateful.

This is a man who by all means has put his own professional life on hold (well for Mr. Sanderson one book a year is slow...) to try his best to finish a series, beloved by himself and hundreds more, which is a fantastic thing in itself.
Ungrateful? Let's be real here; adding his name to the works of a highly acclaimed bestselling author with a multitude of loyal fans built over decades was certainly a good career move, regardless of whatever perceived altruism or love of the books one can attribute to him.

That being said, after devoting his time to finishing the series, he's certainly in a good place to move on and finish the projects he has had to put on hold. I think the word 'ungrateful' doesn't fit, however. Someone would have finished the series, if not BS. He wasn't forced to do it; he wanted to as both a fan and young writer. He was paid well for it, and significantly increased his fan base.

If in the future he would like to come back to WoT, I would most likely want to read the outrigger novels. However, personally I will be content simply to have the primary series conclusively finished as well as possible, given the circumstances. If Brandon never wants to return to the world of WoT, I certainly wouldn't hold it against him. And if he and Harriet agree on outriggers in the future, I'd give them a chance.

suttree
12-21-2011, 12:17 PM
Maybe ungrateful isn't the correct term but it certainly is in quite bad taste.

As for the topic I believe there are very few notes for the prequels let alone the outriggers. As much as I would enjoy reading them I don't think it is something they should pursue. Agree with BS and Harriet completely.

eht slat meit
12-21-2011, 12:32 PM
I wonder what people's thoughts are?

My view is that unless RJ left comprehensive notes and Harriet changes her mind (time could change this) that BS is totally correct.

I don't consider the idea exploitative, but I do agree that unless RJ left notes on part with what he gave for AMoL, it would sully the work. Those notes, that level of insight are what makes the books -his- and worth reading.

Sanderson and the rest of Team Jordan have done a fantastic job of working with that material to complete the series. It's not perfect and isn't meant to be, because... simply put... they're not RJ. However, in more practical terms, the less there is of RJ's voice in it, the less worthwhile it becomes to produce. My opinion, of course.

If they want to open a non-canon sandbox to other writers like some have done with other popular series, I'd be okay with that, but I personally don't want read something that is presented as RJ's without really being his.

The work is great because of the author, not because of the work itself.

Dajoran
12-21-2011, 12:33 PM
@sutree & abbeyroad

My words were 'Instant outrigger questions struck me as... ungrateful'.

Take a moment to pay attention to what has happened and you may see my viewpoint... there is this guy right? He has spent 4 years of his life doing the work of another person (your points about a career move are true, but I never implied that Brandon was performing a selfless act here.)
He posts up on the internet 'Hey guys I'm finally finished that thing you wanted me to do!' and the peoples first response is 'OUTRIGGGAAARRRHHHSSSS'
That is ungrateful.

I'm not talking about the vast majority of people here... just a few people who didn't even thank the guy or say well done - just straight up 'we want more stuff' - it's 10am and the dude has been writing all gorram night.

Davian93
12-21-2011, 12:45 PM
I have nearly zero interest in seeing Brandon do the Outrigger novels. I would eventually like a Compendium or some sort of Silmarillion type collection but even that would be more than enough.

Let Brandon write his own stuff and let RJ's legacy stop with aMoL.

Basel Gill
12-21-2011, 04:08 PM
I have nearly zero interest in seeing Brandon do the Outrigger novels. I would eventually like a Compendium or some sort of Silmarillion type collection but even that would be more than enough.

Let Brandon write his own stuff and let RJ's legacy stop with aMoL.

I like that. A silmarillion type thing with enough backstories to satiate the rabid fandom would be nice, but I'd love to see what Brandon puts out on his own from now on. Stormlight is very promising to me.

Zombie Sammael
12-21-2011, 04:19 PM
I like that. A silmarillion type thing with enough backstories to satiate the rabid fandom would be nice, but I'd love to see what Brandon puts out on his own from now on. Stormlight is very promising to me.

I'm hoping that to some extent or another the Encyclopedia will serve this purpose.

Davian93
12-21-2011, 04:23 PM
I'm hoping that to some extent or another the Encyclopedia will serve this purpose.

That is my hope and belief as well. I think Harriet/Marie's encyclopedia will take care of what I'm looking for. I honestly dont want to see Outriggers from Brandon going off vague outlines from RJ. That is not in anyway meant to bash Brandon either but it just isnt the same and he has his own epic to work on that I'd like to read.

jana
12-21-2011, 04:50 PM
Well since 2006 he has had at least two books of his own work published each year... he has as much said himself that a lot of that is down to a buffer of books that he had built up over the years (and as much as he likes to deny it, we know he is a prolific writer.)
Since he was pegged to finish WoT he hasn't done that much work on his own stuff, Way of Kings was first draft finished a few years before its release and Alloy of Law was just something that grew accidentally from a writing exercise.

I believe he also said that in a perfect world he would have worked on Stormlight Two alongside aMoL and published both in 2012 - but the shear scope of what he had to acomplish with WoT meant he had to put his own epic on the backburner.

Like I said, I mostly agree with your original post, and I'm probably honing in on the least important part of it, but I don't agree at all that he's put his career/professional life on hold. The Wheel of Time is part of his professional life, and it increased his exposure a thousand-fold. He might have possibly obtained the same amount of success without it, but it probably would have taken ten to twenty years longer. I also don't think Stormlight One would have been released as early as it was without WoT. If I'm remembering correctly, it was the first book he pitched to Tor and they liked it but were too scared to publish it when he didn't have a name for himself yet. I'm not sure if that was still the case after Elantris and Mistborn came out, but the Wheel of Time made it a complete non-risk.

Tercel
12-21-2011, 05:00 PM
The instant outrigger questions struck me as highly ungrateful.I would interpret it like the audience shouting "encore" at a performance. Far from being ungrateful, such an act is an affirmation of the quality of the performance and the greatness of the performer. If Brandon hadn't done a good job no one would want to see him write more WOT, so a request for me is an affirmation of him as an author. So: ENCORE!!!

Also, a lot of people have been WOT addicts for up to 20 years, and have enjoying a regular fix of the WOT. So when Brandon tweets that he has FINISHED the WOT series, unsurprisingly people say "er, please, please tell me that there will be more".

This is a man who by all means has put his own professional life on hold (well for Mr. Sanderson one book a year is slow...) to try his best to finish a series, beloved by himself and hundreds more, which is a fantastic thing in itself.Given the number of non-WOT books BS has managed to publish in the last few years (leading him to be regularly be labelled one of the most prolific fantasy authors of all time) it's hard to see how his professional life is 'on hold' in any sense at all.

Also, when he was chosen for WOT I said "Brandon who?" and now I have read all the books he has ever published. Doing the WOT books was about the quickest path to instant stardom possible for a fantasy author. Now he has gained several million fans and appears to have publishers eating out of his hand and agreeing to his every whim as a result. So I say "professional career on hold"?!?!?

Imagine what could have happened if Mr. Rigney didnít keep notes.The existence of extensive notes is a strong argument as to why the outrigger novels should be written. The world is rich enough, and well documented enough that it can support additional books being written in it that substantially draw upon RJ's material. They would not be "money-spinners" or made up out of whole cloth by BS, but rather be extensions of RJ's legacy and be parts of his world that he himself envisioned writing. We can presume that RJ, had he lived, would have written those books as part of his WOT world, and so if BS is completing RJ's WOT work then those books are a part of that and RJ's work lies unfinished until those books are written.

I felt particularly that New Spring did a phenomenal job of 'filling in' events that are briefly alluded to in the main series. Having that work really does deeply enrich the WOT story, and so I feel that the other outriggers have the potential to do the same. Any outriggers which are in some way connected with the main story-line ought to be written. However any that are not connected need not be written.

Seeker
12-21-2011, 08:35 PM
I think Brandon might like to get back to writing his own characters.

As to the outrigger novels, I don't think it would be wrong or inappropriate to do them provided everything that got printed met with Harriet's approval.

Seeker
12-21-2011, 08:51 PM
The instant outrigger questions struck me as highly ungrateful.

This is a man who by all means has put his own professional life on hold (well for Mr. Sanderson one book a year is slow...) to try his best to finish a series, beloved by himself and hundreds more, which is a fantastic thing in itself.

Imagine what could have happened if Mr. Rigney didn’t keep notes.

Brandon should now be let free to continue his own work - (Stormlight Two please! After you've had one or two days rest of course...)

I think the outriggers should stay in the same pile that Infinity of Heaven is on. Not that I wouldn't love to read every word... but more so I think we're lucky that we will have an end to this series as it is. This turn of the wheel is over... Anything else is unnecessary.

It's nice to see someone who appreciates Brandon's work. Lord knows, the man has probably associated the word "Theoryland" with the phrase "What have I done wrong now?"

EDIT:

Not that I think it's wrong to criticize the guy's work, just that I find most of the criticisms have nothing to do with the quality of his work but rather the fact that he's not RJ.

Terez
12-21-2011, 09:08 PM
It's nice to see someone who appreciates Brandon's work. Lord knows, the man has probably associated the word "Theoryland" with the phrase "What have I done wrong now?"Somehow, I doubt it, since Theorylanders have always put forth a great deal of effort to keep that under control. Even Dragonmount has done that, but there are many more critics to be found there.

Davian93
12-21-2011, 09:17 PM
Brandon has done a remarkable job...I'd just rather read his own stuff than see him get collared as "the guy who took over WoT".

Besides, at least with aMoL, he had finished chapters, a ton of material, etc to work from. The outriggers are merely vague outlines from all accounts. Just let them go and we get it in encyclopedia form which would be better anyway.

Terez
12-21-2011, 09:19 PM
Besides, at least with aMoL, he had finished chapters, a ton of material, etc to work from. The outriggers are merely vague outlines from all accounts.Not true. Brandon said he left a lot of notes for everything, and that the only difference with the prequels/outriggers was that he didn't leave any finished scenes.

Davian93
12-21-2011, 09:21 PM
Not true. Brandon said he left a lot of notes for everything, and that the only difference with the prequels/outriggers was that he didn't leave any finished scenes.

I think that is a significant difference personally. Notes lend themselves to a Encyclopedia far more than asking him to spend years doing the prequels on top of his own career. He's already given 3+ years of his life to another man's work...let him do his own stuff now. Besides I want to read Stormlight.

suttree
12-22-2011, 12:23 AM
Not true. Brandon said he left a lot of notes for everything, and that the only difference with the prequels/outriggers was that he didn't leave any finished scenes.

That is interesting to hear, I was almost certain that I had read there were far less notes for the outriggers/prequals than the story proper. Thought that was one of the reasons BS was against it. Nevertheless once again I agree with those saying AMoL be the end. RJ gave us a great gift allowing his series to be finished by someone else. Moving forward beyond that just does not seem right.

Also for those who mentioned opening up the world to other authors RJ was dead set against any type of "shared world" situation.

Isabel
12-22-2011, 12:27 AM
I am absolutely against any outriggers or prequels. I think that was one of the first things I said to Brandon.
Jordan was always against anyone else writing in his world, but for finishing the series he made an exception.
Let aMoL be the ending Jordan wanted and don't keep writing the series. If that happens, i predict that Brandon will be remembered for the Wheel of Time and not RJ.

Rand al'Fain
12-22-2011, 01:48 AM
Personally, I wouldn't say no to a set of outrigger and/or prequel novels, provided they are done well and 100% approved by Harriet. But that's just me. I'm one of those people that hate when a long lasting book series just ends and you wonder what becomes of the characters later on.

On that note, I hated the ending to Animorphs when it came out, and since then, I've hated cliff hangers.

Terez
12-22-2011, 01:56 AM
Let aMoL be the ending Jordan wanted and don't keep writing the series. If that happens, i predict that Brandon will be remembered for the Wheel of Time and not RJ.That, I doubt, either way. (No offense to Brandon.)

Dajoran
12-22-2011, 04:10 AM
I would interpret it like the audience shouting "encore" at a performance. Far from being ungrateful, such an act is an affirmation of the quality of the performance and the greatness of the performer. If Brandon hadn't done a good job no one would want to see him write more WOT, so a request for me is an affirmation of him as an author. So: ENCORE!!!

An encore would be fine - maybe at a book signing in two or three days people could start asking him about his future plans - not 30 seconds after he has completed a large sum of work.

So when Brandon tweets that he has FINISHED the WOT series, unsurprisingly people say "er, please, please tell me that there will be more".

and

Doing the WOT books was about the quickest path to instant stardom possible for a fantasy author... So I say "professional career on hold"?!?!?

I'll say again, it appeared to me that this came in as ungrateful.

This is my own personal feelings unfortunately - an explination may be in order here, this may hopefully quell any future comments - I work two jobs you see - one is my day to day job. At night however I am the Batma-- kidding I am a... what you could call a Book Doctor - the work of an editor/writer but none of the fun. I too have to work heavily on other peoples books - I have received some credit in the industry, and if my own work was ever completed I probably would have an easier step up the ladder than most folks. I do not argue the fact that by doing the WoT Brandon has secured his future - I argue from, again, my own personal viewpoint, I spend quite a lot of my free time writing - I am getting paid and receiving recognition but it is not my job. Professionally, I would like my work to be sitting on shelves with my name being the sole one on the spine. But until I have the free time to complete something of my own, I would say that my professional career is on hold.

This is my own fault if I can make this connect to Brandons situation - but again I assure you all, this is just my opinion.

Given the number of non-WOT books BS has managed to publish in the last few years ... it's hard to see how his professional life is 'on hold' in any sense at all.

I've addressed this in an earlier post.

The existence of extensive notes is a strong argument as to why the outrigger novels should be written... We can presume that RJ, had he lived, would have written those books as part of his WOT world, and so if BS is completing RJ's WOT work then those books are a part of that and RJ's work lies unfinished until those books are written.

Sorry, I disagree, that is not a strong argument - just because something exists does not lead to a reason why it should be used.
Also, if I remember correctly, RJ didn't want to write the outriggers straight away - he had planned to move straight onto work with Infinity of Heaven - possibly then writing the outriggers in between IoH books, or even after that six-book series had completed.

maacaroni
12-22-2011, 06:32 AM
RJ didn't want to write the outriggers straight away - he had planned to move straight onto work with Infinity of Heaven - possibly then writing the outriggers in between IoH books, or even after that six-book series had completed.

Six that turned into fourteen? :)

I think of Frank Herbert's Dune, what a great book that was...and then the interminable sequels. How many are there now? Thomas Covenant books seemed to go on forever, too (at least, in my humble opinion.)

There is a danger of cheapening the main series if too many poorly thought-out 'outrigger' books come out. Ok, by what Terez says, he left outlines if not scenes, but ultimately, the writer (say, BS) would pretty much be writing from scratch. When does the book cease to be RJ and become the new writer? If BS was to write these outriggers and they weren't of the same standard (say, because he doesn't have enough RJ notes to work with), he would lose all of the kudos and good feeling he has built up by his brilliant work on the main arc stories. It's just not worth it.

Dajoran
12-22-2011, 08:04 AM
Six that turned into fourteen? :)

I was refering to the series Infinity of Heaven - RJ had planned to write this after he had finished with the main sequence of events in WoT.

The books were preported to be about a Shogun like character who washes up ashore in a strange land/culture (Think Link's Awakening mixed with Thomas Covenant) - these books would have been six in total - or two trilogies.

Tercel
12-22-2011, 01:39 PM
An encore would be fine - maybe at a book signing in two or three days people could start asking him about his future plans - not 30 seconds after he has completed a large sum of work.Well, true, at 7am after working through the night finishing AMOL, BS's 'future plans' were probably entirely incoherent and completely sleep-related.

Also, if I remember correctly, RJ didn't want to write the outriggers straight away - he had planned to move straight onto work with Infinity of Heaven - possibly then writing the outriggers in between IoH books, or even after that six-book series had completed.It seemed clear to me that RJ was getting a bit sick of WOT by the end. It had dragged on far longer than he had anticipated. I am sympathetic - the one book I have written dragged on for way too long and when it was done I wanted nothing more than to get it over and done with and never write a book again. (Although clearly BS and RJ don't feel this way, because they want to keep writing books) If BS is currently bored of WOT and wants to do other things for a while, that is totally fine with me. He is a fan of WOT, and it's not a boring fantasy world, so I'd be perfectly happy if goes and does other things for a few years and comes back in three years time with a fresh zeal for WOT and churns out a couple of outriggers at his famous pace of a zillion words per day.

Terez
12-22-2011, 06:51 PM
I think that is a significant difference personally.I didn't say it wasn't a significant difference. I said that what you said wasn't true.

Davian93
12-22-2011, 07:49 PM
I didn't say it wasn't a significant difference. I said that what you said wasn't true.

Notes and an outline are basically the same thing. The basic point was that RJ hasnt written any of the Outriggers unlike aMoL. He likely has notes along the lines of "Mat and Tuon reconquer Seanchan with some bulletes underneath...stuff that is nice for an encyclopedia but it would be Brandon writing all the prose.

Seeker
12-22-2011, 08:07 PM
I think any new WOT material that follows this should be set in another Age with new characters.

Frenzy
12-22-2011, 10:42 PM
The work is great because of the author, not because of the work itself.
Say that after reading Crossroads of Twilight.

Either everyone's suddenly been gripped with RJ fanboy love, or nobody wants to speak ill of the dead. Lots of people accused RJ of milking the cash cow by intentionally lengthening WoT. Would they say the same thing if BS wrote the Outriggers? Or anyone else other than Sanderson?

Do we want WoT to become another Forgotten Realms, or Krynn, or other realm of occasional gems scattered in a morass of mediocre writing? Is it even up to us to decide?

suttree
12-22-2011, 11:10 PM
Do we want WoT to become another Forgotten Realms, or Krynn, or other realm of occasional gems scattered in a morass of mediocre writing? Is it even up to us to decide?

I don't see it getting to that point. We know RJ was very much opposed to any sort of shared world scenario and if the prequels/outriggers do get written(which is a long shot) BS has stated he will do it.

As for your comment above I think "occasional gems" is being far too kind.

eht slat meit
12-24-2011, 08:02 PM
Say that after reading Crossroads of Twilight.

Either everyone's suddenly been gripped with RJ fanboy love, or nobody wants to speak ill of the dead. Lots of people accused RJ of milking the cash cow by intentionally lengthening WoT. Would they say the same thing if BS wrote the Outriggers? Or anyone else other than Sanderson?


You're mistaking me for a johnny-come-lately. Though not a fan since they first came out, or even a long term member of the WoT forums,I've been hooked on the books for near on a decade. I've acquired the books that have come out as they come out since I started reading them, and while the extended period of time gripes me somewhat, I -don't- see RJ as milking the cash cow and really, I just don't care what "lots of people" think I should believe about that.

I see Crossroads of Twilight serving several critical plot functions that will be clarified in the final chapter of AMoL, that is the actual AMoL book itself. Without that book, a lot of it will seem very much slapped together like a sandwich off a service burger joint.

I may be wrong on that, and if AMoL doesn't live up to the end goal that I believe CoT was intended to serve, I'll amend my opinion, but until then, my opinion of the book is unscathed. Yes, it drags somewhat, and I do have minor complaints regarding it. That said, I don't consider those minor points to be fatal flaws or indicative of any more serious flaw.

As far as the Outriggers are concerned, I've already made my thoughts clear on that - I'd rather not see them, because as Terez has already indicated, they are based on RJ's notes, not finished scenes. That means the entire set of books would be authored in BS's writing form. The material may be RJs, but the superior writing form was his as well. If I want to read BS's books (and I have), then I'll do so.

I'm not so besotted with the material that constitutes the world of WoT that I'm interested in seeing it endlessly or even short-term farmed out under other authors. That includes Sanderson, even though I respect what he's done for the series after RJ's passing.

fdsaf3
12-29-2011, 11:11 AM
Say that after reading Crossroads of Twilight.

Either everyone's suddenly been gripped with RJ fanboy love, or nobody wants to speak ill of the dead. Lots of people accused RJ of milking the cash cow by intentionally lengthening WoT. Would they say the same thing if BS wrote the Outriggers? Or anyone else other than Sanderson?

I agree with Frenzy here. You can count me among the people who kinda-sorta-definitely think that RJ at the very least didn't move through the plot quickly enough. I've been vocal about this before, and I don't want to start a big battle about this, but the bottom line is that in my opinion this series should have ended long before RJ died. I get it - RJ wrote an epic fantasy series, and there are a lot of details that need to be fleshed out for the world to come alive. That's fine. But think about how many times RJ said in interviews that he had the major events planned out in the series since day one. I'm a novice writer, and even I can appreciate the fact that while telling telling a story sometimes you realize that you need to add in additional material to support where you want the story to go.

But in my opinion, there's a difference between that and going into as much exhaustive detail as RJ did.

Look, I can write you a description of what I did today. It can be as short or as long and involved as you want.

I woke up, got ready for work, and have been at work for about three hours now.

If I *really* wanted to, I could make that into a 1000 page book filled with ridiculously in-depth descriptions of every car I passed on my drive to work, the thoughts going through my head at all times, etc.

Now, as far as story-telling is concerned, how much of that additional detail adds to the overall story that RJ set out to tell when he conceived the story arc? That's debatable - but for the record, I would argue only a relatively small percentage.

Writers are going to write. I think half the burden falls on RJ to curtail his own compulsion to include so many details and side plots. The other half, sadly, falls on Harriet and the editing team RJ had in place. As any creative person knows, you need to have someone whose job it is to step in and say "no, that's enough, time to wrap it up". I can't edit my own writing for shit; that's because to me it's always going to feel unfinished.

I guess my point here (see what I mean about rambling and the need for editors? :D) is that this series is sort of lurching to an end. I don't necessarily think that AMoL needs to be the end, merely an end (see what I did there?). Unless Brandon can inject a new take or add something unforeseen to the series by writing additional material, I think the series should end with the final book and whatever encyclopedia Harriet has planned.

Weiramon
12-29-2011, 05:30 PM
Works of literature are never finished, merely abandoned.

Seeker
12-29-2011, 05:42 PM
I agree with Frenzy here. You can count me among the people who kinda-sorta-definitely think that RJ at the very least didn't move through the plot quickly enough. I've been vocal about this before, and I don't want to start a big battle about this, but the bottom line is that in my opinion this series should have ended long before RJ died. I get it - RJ wrote an epic fantasy series, and there are a lot of details that need to be fleshed out for the world to come alive. That's fine. But think about how many times RJ said in interviews that he had the major events planned out in the series since day one. I'm a novice writer, and even I can appreciate the fact that while telling telling a story sometimes you realize that you need to add in additional material to support where you want the story to go.

But in my opinion, there's a difference between that and going into as much exhaustive detail as RJ did.

Look, I can write you a description of what I did today. It can be as short or as long and involved as you want.

I woke up, got ready for work, and have been at work for about three hours now.

If I *really* wanted to, I could make that into a 1000 page book filled with ridiculously in-depth descriptions of every car I passed on my drive to work, the thoughts going through my head at all times, etc.

Now, as far as story-telling is concerned, how much of that additional detail adds to the overall story that RJ set out to tell when he conceived the story arc? That's debatable - but for the record, I would argue only a relatively small percentage.

Writers are going to write. I think half the burden falls on RJ to curtail his own compulsion to include so many details and side plots. The other half, sadly, falls on Harriet and the editing team RJ had in place. As any creative person knows, you need to have someone whose job it is to step in and say "no, that's enough, time to wrap it up". I can't edit my own writing for shit; that's because to me it's always going to feel unfinished.

I guess my point here (see what I mean about rambling and the need for editors? :D) is that this series is sort of lurching to an end. I don't necessarily think that AMoL needs to be the end, merely an end (see what I did there?). Unless Brandon can inject a new take or add something unforeseen to the series by writing additional material, I think the series should end with the final book and whatever encyclopedia Harriet has planned.

I agree completely.

And, as to the fact that your writing always feels unfinished, I know your pain. Intimately.

yks 6nnetu hing
12-30-2011, 01:21 AM
I agree completely.

And, as to the fact that your writing always feels unfinished, I know your pain. Intimately.

Perhaps the old motto of Coco Chanel applies [paraphrased here because I'm too lazy to look up the exact wording]: "When you're all dressed up and ready to go out, look in the mirror. Then remove one item. Then go out."