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Tomp
05-09-2012, 09:28 AM
If "they" decided to do movies/tv-series of WoT "they" probably couldn't keep everything from the books.

What would be best (least harmful) to leave out?

This is not supposed to be an in depth analysis of WoT. Just a fun discussion.

Landro
05-09-2012, 09:33 AM
The rearranging of skirts! That can probably go :D
Rand and Mat's trip between Whitebridge and Caemlyn is also likely to be cut

Zombie Sammael
05-09-2012, 11:41 AM
That bath scene in COT. That's definitely out.

It'd be interesting to see how you'd do a TV series or movie of WOT. You could not do what GOT has done and have one book per season or movie, due to the sheer number of books. I suspect you'd have to truncate a lot of the latter part of the series.

Heinz
05-09-2012, 12:20 PM
The rearranging of skirts! That can probably go :D
Rand and Mat's trip between Whitebridge and Caemlyn is also likely to be cut

With the exception of Four Kings. But yea, the rest could be summarized in about 20 seconds of 'traveling scenes', and maybe another short scene of the final meeting with that farmer (forget his name?) who gives them a ride into Caemlyn itself.

David Selig
05-09-2012, 12:23 PM
That bath scene in COT. That's definitely out.
If it's on HBO, not only it would be in, the scene would be much longer.

Jokeslayer
05-09-2012, 12:32 PM
That bath scene in COT. That's definitely out.

The bath scenes seem like something you'd want to leave in.

It's been a while, but I feel like you could cut the entire Bowl of Winds arc without missing too much (anything critical with the Kin or the stash can easily be restructured to elsewhere) as long as you cut most of the weather stuff from elsewhere.

SauceyBlueConfetti
05-09-2012, 12:39 PM
The first chapter of every book that basically gives all the simplistic plot details just in case anyone out there picks up the 4th book first and has NO CLUE what is going on:

1. Saidar vs Saidin
2. Aes Sedai explanations
3. Tar Valon
4. The Forsaken
5. Ogier


Actually, now that I think on it, most of the Ogier storylines could be culled, with another character filling in with all the Slow Paced Life and Wise Words stuff.

Landro
05-09-2012, 12:40 PM
That bath scene in COT. That's definitely out.

The one in aCoS ch33 is much worse

Davian93
05-09-2012, 01:36 PM
If it's on HBO, not only it would be in, the scene would be much longer.

We'd also learn about all those lonely nights in the Novice chambers where Egwene and Elayne comfort each other...and the extra special episode where Min and Nynaeve join in.

Davian93
05-09-2012, 01:37 PM
Also, you could probably truncate books 8-13 down to maybe 2 full seasons of episodes...at most. Not much really happens there.

Heinz
05-09-2012, 02:07 PM
We'd also learn about all those lonely nights in the Novice chambers where Egwene and Elayne comfort each other...and the extra special episode where Min and Nynaeve join in.

Full details of Shalon and Ailil?

Or worse.. Toveine with a memory flashback during her exile/penance years. *shudder*

Rand al'Fain
05-09-2012, 02:08 PM
We'd also learn about all those lonely nights in the Novice chambers where Egwene and Elayne comfort each other...and the extra special episode where Min and Nynaeve join in.

In that case, it would go to Cinemax, aka, Skin-a-max.

Davian93
05-09-2012, 02:11 PM
In that case, it would go to Cinemax, aka, Skin-a-max.

I take it you havent been watching GoT on HBO...there's a minimum of 2 completely gratuitous sex scenes in every single episode.

SauceyBlueConfetti
05-09-2012, 02:18 PM
I take it you havent been watching GoT on HBO...there's a minimum of 2 completely gratuitous sex scenes in every single episode.

HIJACK inserted: my biggest issue is they show these rockin' female bods, full frontal, then we get a half turned Theon Greyjoy FLOPPY. Umm, let's be fair here to the genders. ;):p
:UN-HIJACK

I don't like the idea of WoT being made into a film/series now. It would look to coat-tailish on the GRRM series and likely be poorly done. So they should leave it be.

Dragon Thief
05-09-2012, 02:18 PM
While an Official Shat Ton of stuff would have to be cut, the good news is that all of those crazy detailed passages that merely describe things - rooms, clothing, appearances, etc - can be translated easily, so that all of that visual stuff is taken in with a glance during the other scenes.

Dragon Thief
05-09-2012, 02:20 PM
HIJACK inserted: my biggest issue is they show these rockin' female bods, full frontal, then we get a half turned Theon Greyjoy FLOPPY. Umm, let's be fair here to the genders. ;):p
:UN-HIJACK.

I don't mind when [certain parts of] those female bodies are floppy. Or at least jiggly. I bet Davian doesn't either.

Davian93
05-09-2012, 02:29 PM
HIJACK inserted: my biggest issue is they show these rockin' female bods, full frontal, then we get a half turned Theon Greyjoy FLOPPY. Umm, let's be fair here to the genders. ;):p
:UN-HIJACK

I don't like the idea of WoT being made into a film/series now. It would look to coat-tailish on the GRRM series and likely be poorly done. So they should leave it be.

First, I agree on not ever really wanting to see a WoT film/series as I also think it would be coat-tailish and they'd never get the look of channeling right.

Two...as if you arent eye-humping Gendry every time they show him with his shirt off.

Davian93
05-09-2012, 02:30 PM
I don't mind when [certain parts of] those female bodies are floppy. Or at least jiggly. I bet Davian doesn't either.

Jiggles add to my enjoyment and significantly "advance" the plot so to speak.

In all seriousness though, I tend to not watch the nude parts out of respect for my SO. We do listen to those parts however as there is still a good bit of important dialogue being discussed.

Dragon Thief
05-09-2012, 02:32 PM
First, I agree on not ever really wanting to see a WoT film/series as I also think it would be coat-tailish and they'd never get the look of channeling right.

I think the ageless look would be the buzz kill for me. I'm not sure there's a real way to do that without making everyone look like they dated a plastic surgeon who loves the botox.

Davian93
05-09-2012, 02:44 PM
I think the ageless look would be the buzz kill for me. I'm not sure there's a real way to do that without making everyone look like they dated a plastic surgeon who loves the botox.

My guess is that they'd simply get rid of that little tidbit...or just have all younger women play AS roles and make a point to mention their ages being different than how they look.

Overall, I just dont see it being made and I hope it doesnt as the FX would cost way, way too much.

Look at how little they show the Dragons in GoT or even the Wolves...both are major budgeting issues that massively effect even a well-funded show like GoT. They also have avoided all the major battles due to cost...with the Blackwater being the sole exception from what I hear for Season 2 where its simply too big a plotpoint to do the "Prep/Fade to black" they've done for the other battles so far.

Landro
05-09-2012, 03:12 PM
They could do WoT with animation instead. As long as it's done well, that shouldn't be a bad thing.

Oden
05-09-2012, 04:00 PM
Considering all the movies where they try to animate characters to look like actors (the Polar Express among others), I can imagine that the results of an animation can be quite good as long as the voice actors live long enough to make the entire series.

Landro
05-09-2012, 04:26 PM
Considering all the movies where they try to animate characters to look like actors (the Polar Express among others), I can imagine that the results of an animation can be quite good as long as the voice actors live long enough to make the entire series.

That's a big advantage of doing animation. We have a story that spans about 2-3 years and even if they compress the story, it will be hard to get it done in 10 years. The actors playing the young characters (Rand, Perrin, Mat, Egwene, Nyneave, Elaine, etc) would age so much faster than their characters that it wouldn't very believable. The Harry potter movies had the advantage that each book spans 1 year so all they had to do was make 1 movie per year and the actors would age at the same rate as their characters.

With voice actors you don't have to worry about how old your actors are/look

Nazbaque
05-09-2012, 04:35 PM
I think WoT would work better as a TV series. Movies would either end up long as hell or so heavily cut that it wouldn't really be WoT anymore.

On the issue of live-action vs animated I'd prefer live-action, but the effects for shadowspawns and channeling added to the cost of the cast of thousands... it would bomb after season 2 either because it's too expensive to keep going or too poor quality to keep raitings. So animation would probably work better. Especially if it's done in Japanese style. Man those Myrddraal would be scary.

What would be cut? Now that depends on episode length. With 25 min episode length the first episode would probably be prologue and chapters 1-4 and a bit of chapter 5. TBC at the point where Trollocs come a knocking at the al'Thor farm. Some character intros would be pushed to episode two when Rand and Tam get back to Emond's Field. Thom and Lan easily, possibly Egwene and even Perrin, Nynaeve's might go all the way to Baerlon. Rand, Mat, Moiraine and Fain would have to be introduced in episode one along with some minor characters. That I think would be the first episode pretty much. LTT and Ishy bit, Rand sees the Myrddraal, Rand and Mat mess about in EF, Moiraine and Fain get introduced, Rand and Tam get back to the farm, Trollocs smash the door in, TBC add as many character intros as time allows. 45 min episodes would probably stay truer to details but in the end it would just be the same stuff two 25 min episodes had in them. The main difference would be that the character intros would be in the right places and the first episode ends where the second 25 min episode would have: at chapter 8 just after Tam has been healed when Rand is informed he has to leave TTR.

Figbiscuit
05-10-2012, 11:05 AM
In all seriousness though, I tend to not watch the nude parts out of respect for my SO. We do listen to those parts however as there is still a good bit of important dialogue being discussed.

Do you both close your eyes?

Figbiscuit
05-10-2012, 11:06 AM
And in order to stay on topic, I think WoT would be much easier to adapt and work much better as an animated TV series, but then I think you'd lose a lot of potential audience who may class it as a children's series.

Nazbaque
05-10-2012, 11:36 AM
Good point Fig, but I think you could get around that simply by putting the very scary myrddraal in everything that promotes the show

Davian93
05-10-2012, 12:02 PM
Do you both close your eyes?

No, we just tend to not stare. Its not really a huge deal on any level for either of us.

Heinz
05-10-2012, 02:09 PM
Good point Fig, but I think you could get around that simply by putting the very scary myrddraal in everything that promotes the show

I, for one, severely dislike animation. But they raise good points about cost and special effects in a live production.

Zombie Sammael
05-10-2012, 04:31 PM
Seven may stay, the rest must...

Oh, sorry, wrong thread (http://theoryland.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=6921).

Figbiscuit
05-11-2012, 06:00 AM
Good point Fig, but I think you could get around that simply by putting the very scary myrddraal in everything that promotes the show

Fair point. And a few Trollocs.

GonzoTheGreat
05-11-2012, 07:15 AM
Good point Fig, but I think you could get around that simply by putting the very scary myrddraal in everything that promotes the show
Gonzo has a look at the Myrddraal in the BWB. It could work, perhaps.

professorskar
05-12-2012, 12:11 AM
This is a topic I always think about during rereads. With GoT in season 2, I've noticed how things have to be cut or rearranged to keep the plot moving in an episodic format, to make sure everyone has something interesting going on. Like how you see very little of Arya traveling and interacting with Hot Pie and those guys, in pretty much one episode she went from on the road to Harrenhall.

As for WoT, as much as I'd like to see as faithful an adaptation as possible, there's a lot of things that could go. Many scenes not involving major characters, for example. Obviously not all of them, something like the Darkfriend social is important and interesting as well. But something like, say, Byar reporting to Pedron Niall in the prologue of The Dragon Reborn could probably go.

As for entire storylines, one I'd definitely cut would be Morgase's. Nothing is really lost if you remove all of the scenes of her escape and exile. Still have her be found by Perrin and all that, but if the audience found out at the same time as Perrin who she really is, I don't think there's that big of a loss.

Basically a lot of situations like that. Even Siuan/Min/Leane/Logain's story could be trimmed. Show them leave Tar Valon, and then show up in Salidar. We don't really need to see the trial of the lamp getting knocked over and burning the barn, hell, they have to explain all that to Sheriam and Co. anyway when they arrive.

Keep in mind I'm not saying that these things are meaningless or don't add to the books, but you have to be willing to trim the fat when you're talking about adapting something. Especially if you're talking movies and not a series. Remember, a movie is meant to be watched in one sitting, while a book the size of WoT is certainly not. And there's a lot of characters in Wheel of Time, and that can be confusing to people as well. Again to reference GoT season 2, the Mara and Jojen Reed were probably left out just because the producers probably thought it would be too much for people to follow (they changed the names of Robert Arryn and Asha Greyjoy because they thought people would get confused after all). If WoT was adapted into another medium, I wouldn't be surprised to see some characters combined, or even left out and their role adopted by a different one to keep the head count down.

Oneirist
05-12-2012, 05:00 AM
Certain characters are left out for entire books, and certain important characters (particularly the Forsaken) make only rare and obscure appearances so as to not give too much away, which means they'd probably constantly be recasting them.

I think an anime would be awesome, as long as they don't make everyone look androgynous.

Figbiscuit
05-14-2012, 11:40 AM
I think it's highly unlikely any of us would be totally happy with whatever adaptation was produced.

I'd watch it anyway tho *grins*

Matoyak
05-14-2012, 05:51 PM
...but then I think you'd lose a lot of potential audience who may class it as a children's series.Yup, because for some unfathomable reason the west forgot that animation can tell stories for all ages, and often times better than live-action.

EDIT: I think I need to make myself more clear. The west didn't forget that animation can tell stories for all ages, it simply forgot that animation doesn't have to be aimed at mainly younger audiences. Pixar does great all-ages animation, and Disney proper can do it from time to time as well, but the target is still children. The west has forgotten that you can use animation to tell a story aimed at an older audience as the primary.

Rand al'Fain
05-14-2012, 07:37 PM
I think it's highly unlikely any of us would be totally happy with whatever adaptation was produced.

I'd watch it anyway tho *grins*

Same here, even if I'd regret it later, like with the Dragon Ball Z live action adaptation abortion. I watched, expected it to be bad, and was still shocked by how much they bastardized it, for lack of a better word.

Lupusdeusest
05-19-2012, 10:37 AM
I'd love to see a motion-capture type thing - like they did recently with Tintin - but again, $.

On the other hand - going by fanart, they would likely end up casting Rand by the actor's sixpack quality rather than anything else.

I'm trying to work out if the middling scenes with Domon/Egeanin and that Seeker thing could be cut. A lot of time could be saved in CoS-KoD by just flicking swiftly through various povs, to be true. I was pissed when they cut Bombadil from LotR, but mostly because they replaced it with Arwen nonsense. (I cut a lot of incoherent rambling out of this para. It's late.)

I think they'd be nuts to cut the sister-bonding scene in WH though. Think of the viewership drop!

Tomp
05-19-2012, 04:10 PM
Some plot lines could be drastically shortened.
Examples are
Perrin's storyline after leaving Rand in ACoS until rescuing Faile.
Elayne's storyline after separating from Nynaeve & co.

Some persons and their stories could be completely dropped.
Examples are
Aram
Egeanin
Else Grinwell
Valan Luca (unless Felix is correct)
Olver (unless he does something spectacular in the last one)
Amys and Sorilea could be combined (unless DF)

Some nobles could be combined into fewer people (both in Tear, Cairhien and Andor)
Some Aes Sedai could be combined (so that not 15 AS does one substantial thing each, better if 5 does three things each)