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irerancincpkc
08-26-2008, 07:08 AM
The DNC began last night, and if anyone saw it, I'm not sure it could have gone any better.

Unity is what was needed, and having Ted Kennedy speak after a video tribute, voice raspy but strong and physically looking great, for the situation he is in, unity is what happened. If there was a better way to start the convention I don't know of it.

What I really loved about opening night was how positive it was. Everything was upbeat, including Michelle Obama's heartfelt speech. She is an intelligent, amazing, down to earth woman. I consider Barack to be lucky. And then when their little girls took the most of their mic time (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/25/obamas-daughters-interrup_n_121322.html)... and caught his mistake... :D I hope the rest of the convention can go as well.

You know, it's a funny thing. I've always had an interest in politics, always loved my country, always wanted it to be the best it could be, which isn't that different from most Americans, I think. But this past year in particular, I think I've come to realize just how great this country is, in a way that I didn't before. For all the complaining and partisan fighting (that I am guilty of) and distrust of politicans and our leaders, I think we are lucky. There is room for improvement, don't get me wrong, but it seems like we spend a lot of time complaining about something being broken and how nothing is being done about it, rather than enjoying the parts that haven't splintered. Human nature? Perhaps. But if you spend all your time thinking about what is wrong, then I think that just might be the end result: wrong. Just me thinking there, but okay. :D

Davian93
08-26-2008, 07:10 AM
Yeah...I was impressed how Obama finally laid out his plan to show how he was gonna change things...oh wait he basically just had a big love fest and couldnt quite remember where he was telecoming from....Yawn. Even CNN thought it went bad.

irerancincpkc
08-26-2008, 07:19 AM
Well CNN had James Carville on... what do you expect?

And Obama speaks on Thursday, with two days inbetween specifically planned for policy. Last night's theme was family night. It was something they had to do, since everyone seems to think that the competition will subtly play the angry black woman card, and it was something that was a great way to start out the convention. If you yawned at Kennedy's speech then you have no soul. :D

Ivhon
08-26-2008, 07:28 AM
I thought the speeches that were shown were great for what they were. Both Kennedy and Michelle Obama had great speeches.

However, Republican smear campaigns are working and, as usual, the Democrats are not hitting back. There will be no love-fest next week. Just 4 straight days of non-stop lies and slams, and if the Democrats and Obama dont get in the ring and throw punches of their own - and there is a LOT to swing at - they will lose.

I love the ideal of high-road politics, however they just dont win elections. We have learned from Rove and Clinton that the way to win is to go down and dirty. The dirtier the better and forget the truth or any semblance of it. Right now, the Republicans lie and smear far better than the Dems and they will win the election unless that changes.

Davian93
08-26-2008, 07:43 AM
Family Night??? All I saw was some angry black lady...


It was good to see Kennedy...the last patriarch of the Kennedy clan...the real Kennedys at least...not their spoiled kids.

I wasn't referring to Carville...all their analysts and that of MSNBC and Foxnews seemed to think the night was a waste.

EDIT: I should mention I was mainly watching the Phillies/Dodgers game on ESPN2 in HD...the convention was commercial filler at best for me.

Sodas
08-26-2008, 09:44 AM
Waste? If you are at either end of the political spectrum (which is pretty much all you see on cable news) then you probably aren't in the demographic that last night was for.

Last night seems scripted to attract independant women's votes. Look at the reference by Michelle to Hillary. It was a major reaching out point and it probably was the biggest applause line of the night. The speach was designed to pull the heart strings of moms. My wife told me after that she too would be proud if she were up there, talking about me in those glowing terms. So it was very powerful to certain people, clearly.

As far as the RNC goes, more and more people will tune it out. People don't want to hear Dudya, Cheney or Rice speak anymore. And heck, half the senators up for reelection from the Republican side aren't even going to be there at the RNC.

I really think people need to stop worrying about the Democrats and going negative. Remember, reguarding the tightening polls that :

1. They are head-to-heads - not the full election spectrum which shows an increased lead for Obama once Nader and Barr are included.

2. In non-incumbant races, they are always close prior to labor day. It's after labor day, you will begin to see movement. In Reagans case, that didn't come till the final week of the election, but it was massive.

3. People in swing states in particular like Colorado, look more at a person's character than policies. So they want to relate to them. High negatives pushes these types away. Just look at the campaigns the Republicans lost in Deep Red Lousiana this past spring.

4. Most importantly (edited in) the national polls are being filtered through 2004 voter turn out models. Obvious, through voter registration even the basic numbers have changed. In terms of GOTV, Obama is spending heavily compared to McCain who is almost out of his primary spending. Soon, he will be only able to spend the $84 Million in tax payer money he opted into. So his current spending advantage over Obama will stop ~ and Obama will be able to outspend him 2-1 or even 3-1 over the remainder of the campaign.

Davian93
08-26-2008, 10:17 AM
It will depend greatly on McCain's VP choice...if he picks a party hack...he's done for. If he's smart and picks someone like Jindal he has a chance. Lieberman would be the ballsy choice that I'd love to see him make as it would show he's still a maverick and of course almost certainly lose the election in the process as the entire Right stays home and it splinters the party...our current political model needs a kick in the arse anyway...both parties are out of touch with the political middle (which is growing bigger by the day).

Sodas
08-26-2008, 10:54 AM
Jindal? Lol. That guy is a wack job and a half. Two words : Exorcism and Castration. You could pick him or any number of characters and be doomed. I honestly think the worst choice would be Romney because of his Mormonism, which many evangelicals fear is a cult - not a religion.

McCain's best choice would be Lindsay Graham (S.C). That name is never floated, but the guy is a former JAG officer and smart as hell. I could see him as the best chance against Biden.

Making good decisions is not exactly McCain's forte, so I expect that Pawlenta guy.... yawn....

Sinistrum
08-26-2008, 11:01 AM
Meh, so not paying attention. The conventions are nothing more than beauty pagents. Lots of flashiness and presentation, but completely devoid of substance.

GonzoTheGreat
08-26-2008, 11:08 AM
And not even a swimsuit competition, as far as I know.

Ivhon
08-26-2008, 11:12 AM
And not even a swimsuit competition, as far as I know.

Now that you mention it, Michelle Obama is the first potential First Lady since Jackie that would do well in a swimsuit competition.

Sinistrum
08-26-2008, 11:22 AM
Now that you mention it, Michelle Obama is the first potential First Lady since Jackie that would do well in a swimsuit competition.

I think I just threw up a little in my mouth...

Davian93
08-26-2008, 11:23 AM
Jackie was hot...easily the best looking first lady ever...lets not compare anyone to her.

irerancincpkc
08-26-2008, 11:23 AM
I hope McCain picks Romney... they hate each other. :D

4. Most importantly (edited in) the national polls are being filtered through 2004 voter turn out models. Obvious, through voter registration even the basic numbers have changed. In terms of GOTV, Obama is spending heavily compared to McCain who is almost out of his primary spending. Soon, he will be only able to spend the $84 Million in tax payer money he opted into. So his current spending advantage over Obama will stop ~ and Obama will be able to outspend him 2-1 or even 3-1 over the remainder of the campaign.

Yep. And Obama is expanding the political map into traditional red states, and that will help the Democrats running for Congress in those states a lot.

And Michelle is pretty...

Davian93
08-26-2008, 11:25 AM
She's alright...but she's no Jackie.

I think the Red State thing is overstated...Virginia is far more blue than it used to be as are places like NM and CO. Its just a shifting in populace...not a brilliant new strategy on his part. PA is shifting blue as well and it has been for 15 years. This is nothing new.

Ivhon
08-26-2008, 11:25 AM
Jackie was hot...easily the best looking first lady ever...lets not compare anyone to her.

Not comparing to Jackie.

Comparing to Laura, Hillary, Barbara, Nancy, Ros, Betty, Pat and Ladybird

Davian93
08-26-2008, 11:26 AM
Not much competition there.

tanaww
08-26-2008, 11:33 AM
All I have to say about the DNC is that I'm really happy CBS didn't pre-empt Big Bang Theory and How I Met Your Mother For it.

It's nothing but a dog and pony show and not worth my time to watch.

Davian93
08-26-2008, 11:35 AM
It's nothing but a dog and pony show and not worth my time to watch.

Canine, equine extravaganza!!!

That's what we called any VIP type deal in the Army...you know those fun things where a general is coming through and they make you move desks to vacuum underneath them..as if the general gives a crap about dust behind a desk.

irerancincpkc
08-26-2008, 11:37 AM
I think the Red State thing is overstated...Virginia is far more blue than it used to be as are places like NM and CO. Its just a shifting in populace...not a brilliant new strategy on his part. PA is shifting blue as well and it has been for 15 years. This is nothing new.
I dunno... Obama does have this 50 state stragety... and he is going after Georgia, and you can't say that's been shifting until now.

Sinistrum
08-26-2008, 11:40 AM
Sorry but I don't associate any politician with sexy, especially someone like Michelle Obama. Getting screwed yes, but not sexy.

JSUCamel
08-26-2008, 02:43 PM
States aren't really red and blue anymore. If you really broke down the voting habits by district, you'd find that the cities are more liberal and the rural areas are more conservative. The only reason, say, New York votes one way is because the voters in NYC (which I'm guessing are primarily Democrats, but I don't really pay attention to this stuff) far outweigh the voters in the rest of the state.

Virginia might be a red state, but I bet places like Richmond and Norfolk are much bluer than smaller areas in Virginia.

Davian93
08-26-2008, 02:44 PM
Its mainly N. Virginia that's pushing the balance towards blue as it was one of the fastest growing areas in the country for the past decade.

Gilshalos Sedai
08-26-2008, 02:55 PM
No, in Texas, it's pretty much just Austin that's Blue. ;)

Cary Sedai
08-26-2008, 03:15 PM
No, in Texas, it's pretty much just Austin that's Blue. ;)

That's why Austin rocks! :D

Ivhon
08-26-2008, 03:41 PM
That's why Austin rocks! :D

Amen!

Sinistrum
08-26-2008, 03:42 PM
That's why Austin rocks!

No, that is why we know Austin is full of dirty hippies. :p

Gilshalos Sedai
08-26-2008, 03:52 PM
Keep Austin Wierd!

Cary Sedai
08-26-2008, 03:53 PM
I believe my sarcasm detection meter just went off the charts!

Gilshalos Sedai
08-26-2008, 03:57 PM
I wasn't sarcastic. I like that slogan. ;)

Sei'taer
08-26-2008, 04:32 PM
Interesting poll numbers (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/daily_presidential_tracking_poll) if you're into that kind of thing.

irerancincpkc
08-26-2008, 06:28 PM
If only there was a way to judge what or who the American people wanted... :D

Birgitte
08-27-2008, 12:15 AM
Sorry but I don't associate any politician with sexy, especially someone like Michelle Obama. Getting screwed yes, but not sexy.


~giggles~ Wonderfully said, Lizard. Seconded, with the addition that they are screwing everyone else.

And don't you insist U of H is full of dirty hippies, too? So Austin can't have a monopoly on them.

irerancincpkc
08-27-2008, 06:51 AM
Man, did Hillary hit it out of the park last night! Everyone thought she would just do what she had to, but she did more! What a great job, doing everything she could to unify the party.

"No way. No how. No McCain." I love it! :D

Sinistrum
08-27-2008, 10:52 AM
Okay, you're right Spammer! Lets call the election right now for Obama on the basis of a few cliche sound bites! :rolleyes: Seriously dude, I realize that you are young, naive, and enthusiastic but it has really started going over the top here. Hillary's speech, Michelle Obama's, the entire DNC, means exactly squat. It is all meaningless drivel designed to hook the mindless masses along for the ride Dems want to take the country on (same as what the RNC will be) with a few catchy phrases and is certainly no reason to get this excited.

irerancincpkc
08-27-2008, 10:58 AM
I know I'm over the top; I've never claimed to be calm or realistic. :D And I'm sure in ten years I will be cured of my over-excitedness, don't worry. :D

Even if I do disagree that it is meaningless, one of these two men is going to lead our country, and I think that does mean something.

Cary Sedai
08-27-2008, 11:01 AM
Don't mind Sini, too much. There's nothing wrong with being excited about our government and participating. That's the whole point, that we participate. Even if we can't make things perfect, you can't make anything better with out trying.

The lizard is slightly cynical, though loveable all the same :p

Sinistrum
08-27-2008, 11:22 AM
There's nothing wrong with being excited about our government and participating.

Until you actually get exposed to how it all works. Then there is no excuse left to get excited at all.

Cary Sedai
08-27-2008, 11:47 AM
Not everyone in the government is corrupt. Not everything the government accomplishes is evil. There are things to be excited about. Just because you know how it works (money talks), doesn't mean you can't have faith in your fellow humans.

There will always be greed, and corruption and power hungry tyrants. As you've stated before, it's they way humans are. But those kinds of government officials are perfectly happy for you to dislike the government and refrain from participating. This helps them. Unless you dislike it and do something to make change.

Theres nothing wrong with being positive, hopeful, excited and participating, even when you know how it works. I think especially because you know how it works. I don't think it means you are naive, either.

For me, I know that I would rather be those things and feel good about the choices I make (wether or not they really have any weight on the issues at all), than depress myself with negativity.

I think this is a personal choice. You can't make anyone, anything. You can only be who you are, and show it.

Sinistrum
08-27-2008, 12:03 PM
doesn't mean you can't have faith in your fellow humans.

Yes but I also know how my fellow human tends to operate too.

But those kinds of government officials are perfectly happy for you to dislike the government and refrain from participating.

Just because I dislike the government, they way it is currently run, and the way we decide who composes it is by no means an indication that I won't participate. I just means that I do so with my eyes open, my expectations appropriately tempered, and without acting like I just got laid for the first time in response to any of the parts of the circus that currently composes our electoral system.

Ivhon
08-27-2008, 12:06 PM
Here, here, Cary!

I am as cynical as they come. However, I think that this particular election - even moreso than the last one - is vitally important to our country.

Do I think the Democrats or Obama are perfect and without flaws? Absolutely not.

However, the Republicans have lied, cheated and swindled the American public for 8 years. They have raped the Constitution and our resources, bankrupted our coffers, ruined our reputation and dishonored our soldiers for no other reason than to enrich a select few oilmen. I find this unconscionable.

Yes the Democrats have had their scandals of late. However they are dwarfed in number and in impact by those of the Republicans and the administration.

I make no claims that this party and this candidate are remotely perfect. However, bear in mind that it is we the people - not the media, not the politicians - that force our politicians on both sides of the aisle to promise everything under the sun and then pillary them when they cannot deliver. We set ourselves up for that disappointment and then tune out because these politicians can't deliver what we force them to promise - the impossible.

Cary Sedai
08-27-2008, 12:14 PM
I didn't mean you specifically, Sini, I was using the general "you". :p

Yes, I think you should have your eyes open, you should know and understand just what's going on.

You can see everything very clearly and still be excited about your participation in it.

When people are negative about our government, and tell others there's nothing to be excited about, it can turn people off of participating. Not enough people participate now, because they "know" how it works and feel that they won't make a difference.

I personally feel, that if we can make participating a positive and exciting thing, then more people would participate. More people who participate, the more we are involved, the better it can be.

Even if we can't make things perfect, you can't make anything better with out trying.