PDA

View Full Version : McCain Shows some Class


Davian93
08-28-2008, 07:15 PM
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/28/mccain-to-extend-his-congratulations-to-obama-in-special-ad/

Unexpected to say the least...smart move my Mac.

Crispin's Crispian
08-28-2008, 07:19 PM
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/28/mccain-to-extend-his-congratulations-to-obama-in-special-ad/

Unexpected to say the least...smart move my Mac.
How nice of him. A personal phone call would have been classier and less open to criticism, but what the heck. I can't hardly complain about someone saying something positive.

Wait, yes I can! Do you think there's any chance at all that this was an attempt to dilute the excitement and anti-McCain energy that will accompany Obama's speech tonight?

Cary Sedai
08-28-2008, 07:39 PM
"How perfect that your nomination would come on this historic day," McCain also says in reference to the 45th anniversary of Martin Luther King, Jr.'s 'I Have a Dream' speech.

And there's the race card. If Obama's race was not at the forefront of his thoughts (or speach writers) why say that?
He is deliberately linking Obama and King together, by virtue of them both being black. I know everyone already knows that, but why point it out?

I always use this example when I talk about racism.

A newspaper will run a story "black man saves child from fire" (Or whatever). However if it's a white guy the story headline is "man saves child from fire"

Maybe it's just me, but as long as we keep using race to define people, there will always be racism issues...

Aside from that, I'm not certain I believe this add is sincere.

Davian93
08-28-2008, 08:23 PM
Whoa!!!! That's completely unfair. The Dems are the ones going on and on and on about this being a HISTORIC event...not McCain. He's just congratulating the guy. Its okay for the Dems to say its historic but not McCain???

ShadowbaneX
08-28-2008, 08:30 PM
I figure the less mudslinging the better. Hell, think of all the millions that could be saved if you took the mud-slinging advertising budget out of the elections. Take that money and fund some real national health care for the US or something.

pops taer
08-28-2008, 08:41 PM
used to be what happened when a 4 wheel drive vehicle piled through a huge mud hole!!!

I have an idea. I would have to research this but want to be lazy. At one time the political race for Prime Minister in England was alloted a very short period of time for the contestants to battle. From some place in my memory banks the time of 6 months jumps out and if I remember correctly the amount of money that could be spent was limited as well. I think the above should be put in place right away and that mudslinging should be abolished. Back to the old "If you cant say something good, keep your freaking mouth shut." Oh, well, ain't gonna happen here I reckon!!!!

Cary Sedai
08-28-2008, 08:47 PM
Whoa!!!! That's completely unfair. The Dems are the ones going on and on and on about this being a HISTORIC event...not McCain. He's just congratulating the guy. Its okay for the Dems to say its historic but not McCain???

Nope, I dont' think it is if they are using it in a racial way. I have not been watching any of the DNC speeches. I get my news here, actually. :p

If they (they being either the Dems or Reps) are using it in a way to "compare this black political figure with this black political figure" then, no, I don't like it.

If they are using it in a way to "compare this political figure to this political figure" then that's great.

However, I highly doubt either side is doing that. Pardon me for being vague. I don't care if it's a black man saying "that guy is black" or a white man saying "that guy is black" I dont' think the racial difference should be pointed out, or used in such a defining way. We are all humans.

But, aside from that. I still don't think the add is sincere. I only see the political implications and reasons for using it.

Davian93
08-28-2008, 08:58 PM
The guy who should be the Dem nominee is speaking right now...I.E. Al Gore. He should have ran. He could have won just as easily. Hell, even I would have voted for him.

To Cary: I agree that both sides are using it as a racial comparison not political. Its not "Historical" unless you consider his skin color. I'll be very happy when we run out of "Firsts" when it comes to race and sex in politics...I mean that in the positive way not a negative way. It shouldn't matter but sadly it still does to many people.

Ozymandias
08-28-2008, 11:56 PM
This isn't showing class. This is a smart political move. A private phone call would have been classy. Making it into a political statement of his "classiness" is exactly the opposite.

Not that it isn't the right message, nor do I think he doesn't mean it, but seriously. If he wanted to do a nice, classy thing, he would have called Obama and said all this, not made a video so everyone could see what a great guy he is. No coincidence that after his smear campaigns failed to take attention away from the DNC, he switched tack and decided to be nice. Consummate politician... anything to get him the limelight is whats going down.

Sodas
08-29-2008, 04:27 AM
It's a nice thought, but why an ad? Spending money on something that 99% of the American's watching tonight won't even know about. Like said above, a nice phone call would have be classier.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 07:26 AM
Cheap political trick, like kissing babies. :D

(I'm joking, by the way. :D)

Davian93
08-29-2008, 08:16 AM
So was Obama's continual references to MLK Jr bringing up the race issue?

Seemed like it to me.

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 08:55 AM
Continual? I only heard one.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 08:56 AM
Continual? I only heard one.


Okay, okay it was only one but it WAS in the finale of the speech. It was a fine speech...if only he could actually do some of the things he says.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:03 AM
It was a fine speech...if only he could actually do some of the things he says.
He can. You're just disillusioned after 8 years of Bush. :D

And it was the finest speech I have ever seen. He went for stregnth, not inspiration, and he somehow met skyhigh expectations. :D

On the McCain topic, Pawlentry and Romney both appear to be out of the VP mix, according to NBC News. If I could make a guess right now, I'd say Ridge.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:05 AM
If its Ridge, I'll be pulling the McCain bumper sticker off my car...I hate Tom Ridge.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:07 AM
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/08/29/mccain.vp/index.html

Governor Sarah Palin maybe? Never heard of her.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:13 AM
If its Ridge, I'll be pulling the McCain bumper sticker off my car...I hate Tom Ridge.
Oh yeah, I keep forgetting you are from PA too. :D

And I've not heard much about that Gov. either...

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:17 AM
Reading up on her now...former beauty queen, very right wing on most social issues...known for her ethics and for cleaning up corruption...pro life, anti gay marriage etc etc.

And very young at 44 years of age.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:19 AM
Reading up on her now...former beauty queen, very right wing on most social issues...known for her ethics and for cleaning up corruption...pro life, anti gay marriage etc etc.

And very young at 44 years of age.
And don't forget her best attribute; she'll hand McCain Alaska. :D :D :D

Really, that would be an out of the box pick. If it happens, I think it would mainly be because McCain doesn't want to have two old white men running again...

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:19 AM
Though apparently she's not in Ohio but rather still in Alaska...so likely not her though it would have been a smart choice for McCain to appeal to women and the party base.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:23 AM
Where did you hear she was still in Alaska? I just read this...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/29/tim-pawlenty-for-vice-pre_n_122334.html

A Gulfstream IV from Anchorage, Alaska, flew into Middletown Regional Airport in Butler County near Cincinnati about 10:15 p.m. Thursday, said Rich Bevis, airport manager. He said several people came off the plane, including a woman and two teens, but there was no confirmation of who was aboard.

"They were pretty much hustled off. They came right down the ramp, jumped in some vans here and off they went," Bevis said. "It was all hush, hush."

But if she has been seen in Alaska since, that ruins that idea.

tanaww
08-29-2008, 09:24 AM
And don't forget her best attribute; she'll hand McCain Alaska. :D :D :D

Really, that would be an out of the box pick. If it happens, I think it would mainly be because McCain doesn't want to have two old white men running again...

Adding a young woman to the ticket would be the first smart thing he's done. If only she were pro-choice (on all moral issues)...

And none of the so-called front-runners is moving toward Ohio based on what I've read. Romney and Pawlenty are both at home. Pawlenty's going to the fair. I'll bet he'll find the big Garth Brooks Butter Sculpture ;)

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:28 AM
ABCNews stated she was still in Anchorage...but who knows which story is accurate...Wikipedia was updated like 5 times in the time I read it on her.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:34 AM
I'll stick to it either being Ridge or Lieberman until we find out where Palin is.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:36 AM
I'll stick to it either being Ridge or Lieberman until we find out where Palin is.

Reading up on Palin...if she doesn't have any skeletons etc etc, she might be able to win the election for Mac. I don't see Ridge or Lieberman doing that. Right now Mac is like Rocky in the final round in Rocky II...he needs a knockout blow to win or he'll lose the election handily.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:39 AM
Well it depends. Palin has never been in the national spotlight; she could crack under the pressure. There are a lot of unanswered questions about her. Can she debate? Can she be an effective attack dog?

I'm not sure this will happen. Kind of like the Chet Edwards thing that popped up for Obama when he was about to make his pick...

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:40 AM
I doubt it too...it would be too ballsy even for McCain.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:42 AM
It would be a smart pick. It would get him instant media coverage, help appeal (in his mind) to Hillary supporters, help appeal to indep. women, ect...

But is she ready to lead? That seems to be McCain's thing is election, and if he picks a VP who is what McCain is calling Obama, that could look hypocritical, and Obama could slam him on it.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:43 AM
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/08/mccain-vp-conte.html

Probably not her.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:45 AM
I don't know about this. Pawlentry and Palin are both going to state fairs. Sounds a bit off to me...

Well then, back to Ridge and Lieberman... :D

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:47 AM
Shudders at the thought of Ridge...Ridge will be the knockout blow to McCain's chances...Moderates hate him and so to conservatives...he might ...MIGHT get him PA but that's it...And i personally doubt that even.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:50 AM
I'd rather (from an Obama's supporter's prospective, of course) have Lieberman than Ridge. People seem to genuinely dislike Lieberman... :D

Here's a question, who would you rather have? Romney or Ridge? :D

Davian93
08-29-2008, 09:53 AM
I'd rather (from an Obama's supporter's prospective, of course) have Lieberman than Ridge. People seem to genuinely dislike Lieberman... :D

Here's a question, who would you rather have? Romney or Ridge? :D


Its because Lieberman is looked at as a traitor as he ran on the Dem ticket just 8 years ago...

On Romney or Ridge...I'd probalby just not vote to be honest.

Sei'taer
08-29-2008, 09:58 AM
Here's a question, who would you rather have? Romney or Ridge? :D

Both would be terrible picks for him. If I had to pick it would be Romney. I really don't like Ridge at all and I don't like Romney much more.

From what I've been reading about Palin I like her, plus, if McCain was to get elected and stick to his promise of only serving one term (which...well he is a politician), Palin would be in a great position to challenge Hill in 2012...then she could take someone like Pawlenty or Jindal as vice. Course, McCain has to get elected first.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:58 AM
Really, Palin is the only chance McCain has to shock anyone; and I wonder if McCain would pick someone who tried to be VP and failed?

I didn't like Lieberman 8 years ago. Reminds me of a little weasel...

And I forgot to say, if Ridge is the pick, I think McCain would get an immediate bounce in PA, maybe pull slightly ahead of Obama, but I think that would dissapate over time.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:11 AM
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/C/CVN_VEEPSTAKES?SITE=NYPLA&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

The AP Wire is basically saying its Palin...we'll see I suppose.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 10:15 AM
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/01/sarah-palin-mccains-vice_n_116383.html

A Republican Source says it is Palin... interesting...

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:17 AM
I'm thinking it might actually be her....cool. If it is McCain just hammered a high fastball out of the park in the 9th to tie the game.

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 10:19 AM
The Reps are playing games. Republican sources have been saying yes and no to all the frontrunners all morning. I dont think we will know for sure until it is announced in 40 minutes.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 10:22 AM
I'm thinking it might actually be her....cool. If it is McCain just hammered a high fastball out of the park in the 9th to tie the game.
I wouldn't go that far... I'm not sure this lady is ready to lead, or has shown judgement to lead. Truthfully, McCain would think this is a good idea because she is a woman. We'll see where it goes though...

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 10:28 AM
If it's Palin, it would go a long way toward making me happier to getting off the fence on the Republican side. The only better choice would be Kay Bailey Hutchison. The only incumbent I still vote for.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:29 AM
If it's Palin, it would go a long way toward making me happier to getting off the fence on the Republican side. The only better choice would be Kay Bailey Hutchison. The only incumbent I still vote for.

She's very very conservative Gil...you might not care for some of her social views...

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 10:30 AM
She can't be THAT conservative or her husband would be Governor.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:34 AM
She can't be THAT conservative or her husband would be Governor.

She's so conservative that she took her oath of office in her kitchen barefoot. ;)

...and her hubby held her hand.

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 10:35 AM
Cute.

DeiwosTheSkyGod
08-29-2008, 10:36 AM
She's so conservative that she took her oath of office in her kitchen barefoot. ;)

...and her hubby held her hand.

Probably gave her permission, too. ;)

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:40 AM
http://www.foxnews.com/


Foxnews just broke it!

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 10:40 AM
Just saw on MSNBC front page that a McCain source told them it's Palin.

She is very conversative... I don't like her already. :D And hopefully that means she has supported Bush's policies... :D

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:41 AM
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25970882/

More importantly, a non tabloid news service confirmed it as well.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 10:42 AM
Watch, this turns out to be a hoax or something... :D

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:45 AM
I don't care for her stance on the social issues but McCain may have just saved his election chances. Game On!

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 10:46 AM
I don't know; I think once the initial excitement is over people will see through this for the political trick that it is.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:48 AM
I don't know; I think once the initial excitement is over people will see through this for the political trick that it is.

McCain picked an young outsider female (peeling off those moderate Hillary voters) for the same reasons Obama picked Biden whose known for his foreign policy and Washington insider status. This is no different.

Edit: Sadly CNN picked it up 3rd after the other 2...they're really slipping. And ABC looks pathetic after their reports having her in Alaska still (that reporter should be fired, she sucks).

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 10:52 AM
McCain picked an young outsider female (peeling off those moderate Hillary voters) for the same reasons Obama picked Biden whose known for his foreign policy and Washington insider status. This is no different.

Edit: Sadly CNN picked it up 3rd after the other 2...they're really slipping. And ABC looks pathetic after their reports having her in Alaska still (that reporter should be fired, she sucks).
She should be fired.

And no, it is very different. McCain has blasted Obama, saying he is not ready to lead, based on experience, and then he picks a VP, who could potentially lead the country, who has less experience than Obama? Come on, McCain picked her because he felt he had to spice it up, and also appeal to the conversative base.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 10:57 AM
Ah but she's already a Governor and thus is a leader while Obama has never been in that type of leadership role...even as a senator. And now Obama cant bash her without bashing his own "credentials" in those areas. Plus it gives all those disaffected Hillaryites a legit excuse to not vote for Obama. Brilliant.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 10:57 AM
Some reactions... taken from here. (http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/29/104243/090/219/578464)

Chuck Todd (NBC)

They really wanted to pick a woman, and there were no obvious choices.

Joe Scarborough (MSNBC)

I can't imagine a woman that's been a governor for a year and a half, but to debate Joe Biden on GEorgia, a remerging Russia, an emerging China and India, on the Middle East, my God, how does she do that?

I think Obama's speech last night put McCain over the edge, he was desperate. Had to appeal to the base. But he picks someone with hardly any political experience, no name recongnization, someone who is facing an ethics investigation by her own legislature, and has an infant child at home...

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 10:57 AM
You're just annoyed Obama picked an old white guy. ;)

Truthfully, an American Veep doesn't do a whole hell of a lot and I wasn't bothered by Biden (except for just plain not liking the man), and Palin's experience or lack thereof, doesn't bother me.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:00 AM
Ah but she's already a Governor and thus is a leader while Obama has never been in that type of leadership role...even as a senator. And now Obama cant bash her without bashing his own "credentials" in those areas. Plus it gives all those disaffected Hillaryites a legit excuse to not vote for Obama. Brilliant.
You're forgetting that by choosing Palin, McCain has taken away his not ready to lead line of attack. He basically has no attack line now. Obama won't bash her credentials, he will wait for McCain to go after his, then point out who exactly McCain picked to run with him.

So for that, and many other reasons, not brilliant. And you are forgetting that most of the disaffected Hillaryites are Democrats, and would never vote for a conversative mongul like her. Especially after that great convention.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:02 AM
There's a huge difference between VP and the Main Guy though. Another point, Palin doesnt have to debate Biden on Foreign Policy...that's what McCain is there for.

This was a smart pick.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:04 AM
It looks smart, but when it gets down to it... with her being investigated right now...

And Palin does have to debate Biden. There is a VP debate where foreign policy is a main topic.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:05 AM
Some reactions... taken from here. (http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/8/29/104243/090/219/578464)

Chuck Todd (NBC)



Joe Scarborough (MSNBC)



I think Obama's speech last night put McCain over the edge, he was desperate. Had to appeal to the base. But he picks someone with hardly any political experience, no name recongnization, someone who is facing an ethics investigation by her own legislature, and has an infant child at home...

Here's an explanation of Spammers Mudslinging:

On July 11, 2008, Governor Palin dismissed Walter Monegan as Commissioner of Public Safety and instead offered him a position as executive director of the state Alcoholic Beverage Control Board, which he subsequently turned down.[44][45] Monegan alleged shortly after his dismissal that it may have been partly due to his reluctance to fire an Alaska State Trooper, Mike Wooten, who had been involved in a divorce and child custody battle with Palin's sister, Molly McCann.[46] In 2006, before Palin was governor, Wooten was briefly suspended for ten days for threatening to kill McCann's (and Palin's) father, tasering his 11-year-old stepson, and violating game laws. After a union protest, the suspension was reduced to five days.[47]

Governor Palin asserts that her dismissal of Monegan was unrelated to the fact that he had not fired Wooten, and asserts that Monegan was instead dismissed for not adequately filling state trooper vacancies, and because he "did not turn out to be a team player on budgeting issues."[48] Palin acknowledges that a member of her administration, Frank Bailey, did contact the Department of Public Safety regarding Wooten, but both Palin and Bailey say that happened without her knowledge and was unrelated to her dismissal of Monegan.[48] Bailey was put on leave for two months for acting outside the scope of his authority as the Director of Boards and Commissions.

In response to Palin's statement that she had nothing to hide, in August 2008 the Alaska Legislature hired Steve Branchflower to investigate Palin and her staff for possible abuse of power surrounding the dismissal, though lawmakers acknowledge that "Monegan and other commissioners serve at will, meaning they can be fired by Palin at any time."[49] The investigation is being overseen by Democratic State Senator Hollis French, who says that the Palin administration has been cooperating and thus subpoenas are unnecessary.[50] The Palin administration itself was the first to release an audiotape of Bailey making inquiries about the status of the Wooten investigation.[48][51]

Wooten and the police union alleged that the governor had improperly released his employment files in his divorce case. However, McCann's attorney released a signed waiver from Wooten demonstrating that Wooten had authorized the release of his files through normal discovery procedures.[52][53]



Yep, for cleaning up her corrupt state, her corrupt good ol boys legislature is fighting her attacks on them. Yeah, that sucks.

Zaela Sedai
08-29-2008, 11:07 AM
And with that pick I may actually go vote now. I Would have stayed home had he picked Romney. McCain adn crew was VERY smart in picking a woman.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:07 AM
It looks smart, but when it gets down to it... with her being investigated right now...

And Palin does have to debate Biden. There is a VP debate where foreign policy is a main topic.

She seems smart enough...she'll be fine...hell anyone with the internet, google and wikipedia can debate that stuff...Half the people on this site could easily debate Biden on it.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:07 AM
I'm ordering my McCain/Palin bumper sticker tonight...it'll go right next to my Veterans for McCain one.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:09 AM
She seems smart enough...she'll be fine...hell anyone with the internet, google and wikipedia can debate that stuff...Half the people on this site could easily debate Biden on it.
Are you serious? Biden has spent most of his adult life waist deep in foreign relations. He is going to destroy her and her outdated, stale conservative views. You have to remember, she is going to have to defend Iraq. Not a fun job...

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 11:09 AM
This is a very intersting choice.

She is rabidly coservative which may alienate a lot of women who analyze her stance on issues.

On the other hand, she is a woman and those Hillaryites that JUST want to see a woman on a ticket will be swayed.

Most importantly, it takes the experience issue off the table, or should.

There are, I understand, some ethics issues with her...not sure what they are, but if they develop that is the last thing Republicans need.

She has a Down's Syndrome child, which the Republicans will almost certainly parade to get sympathy votes. Biden can't be too tough on her or he will be seen - or portrayed - as beating up a woman after all of his pro-woman legislation.

It will be much more difficult to work the Independent angle, since Palin is hard-core base-right conservative. So in many ways the gamble is going to be will the same strategy that the Republicans have used for the last 8 years work again. And it might. Rick Davis is a Rove disciple and is running a Rove campaign.

We'll see how it pans out. Big gamble, though, I think.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:19 AM
Are you serious? Biden has spent most of his adult life waist deep in foreign relations. He is going to destroy her and her outdated, stale conservative views. You have to remember, she is going to have to defend Iraq. Not a fun job...

Why? Last I checked we're winning in Iraq. IRE (do you like that nickname better than Spammer btw?), there's a difference between conservative and stale. I'm sure McCain's people can bring her up to speed enough for debate sound bites on foreign policy.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:21 AM
Her ethics issues are that she's too tough on corruption and graft...hardly a negative thing in the voters eyes.

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 11:23 AM
If her child is Down's, I can totally understand her personal decision to be pro-life. Most mothers with those children are. (Hell, I'd probably turn my coat at that point on that issue.) As long as she doesn't try to regulate MY choices, she'll be fine.

Brita
08-29-2008, 11:25 AM
Wait a minute, wait a minute!

This Woolen character got a 5 day suspension after tasering an 11 year old!

WTF!

My misgivings about the amount of power unions hold increases...

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 11:25 AM
What I am concerned about as an Obama supporter is that the Republicans are going to turn this into a sympathy campaign.

We have already seen the POW card thrown around left and right as a response to any criticism he might get. I worry that this thing will turn into "how can you criticize a war hero and the mother of a down's syndrome child?" thing. And I do believe it will go that way. Split and divide politics from the right.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:28 AM
Why? Last I checked we're winning in Iraq. IRE (do you like that nickname better than Spammer btw?), there's a difference between conservative and stale. I'm sure McCain's people can bring her up to speed enough for debate sound bites on foreign policy.
Obama has been calling for a timeline for a long time, showing great judgement. The Iraqi government has requested one, and even the Bush Administration is recently trying to get one set, but McCain still thinks it is a horrible idea? Try to defend that judgement.

Oh, and she can do her soundbites while Biden speaks with substance. I will love that debate.

And I see no difference between conservative and stale. Conservatives continually stubbornly do the same old thing, and the country is tired of it.

And you can call me whatever you want. It's my fault for coming up with such a weird screen name that I will take whatever beating I get with nicknames. :D

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:28 AM
So she has a sick kid...so what? I hardly think that came into it.

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 11:29 AM
If her child is Down's, I can totally understand her personal decision to be pro-life. Most mothers with those children are. (Hell, I'd probably turn my coat at that point on that issue.) As long as she doesn't try to regulate MY choices, she'll be fine.

She will, Gil. She - as well as McCain - an anti-choice vp for an anti-choice president in an anti-choice party is not going to defend Roe v Wade.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:30 AM
So she has a sick kid...so what? I hardly think that came into it.
Then you don't know the Republican party...

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 11:30 AM
Hutchison does. But she's even less party line than McCain in that respect.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:34 AM
And you can call me whatever you want. It's my fault for coming up with such a weird screen name that I will take whatever beating I get with nicknames.

I was just trying to come up with something shorter to type and maybe less offensive. ;)

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:34 AM
Then you don't know the Republican party...

I think it was more that she was young, female and had a spotless record...and is an arch conservative...a sick kid was just gravy.

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 11:38 AM
I will be very disappointed if they use the kid as gravy. He shouldn't have anything to do with the election.

Brita
08-29-2008, 11:39 AM
I was just trying to come up with something shorter to type and maybe less offensive. ;)

LOL!

ire –noun intense anger; wrath.

Not offensive at all :p

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:40 AM
I will be very disappointed if they use the kid as gravy. He shouldn't have anything to do with the election.

I doubt it'll be directly used...she may be painted as a caring mother who understands adversity blah blah blah

"I understand what its like to have a sick family member and worry about healthcare..."

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:40 AM
LOL!

ire –noun intense anger; wrath.

Not offensive at all :p


LOL...wasn't even thinking about that...just using the first 3 letters. Maybe IRER?

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 11:41 AM
Just stick with Spammer, changing it now would just be confusing.


After all, just look at Muttley.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:43 AM
Just stick with Spammer, changing it now would just be confusing.


After all, just look at Muttley.

Who?

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:43 AM
Yeah, between Intense Anger and Spammer, I've got to go with Spammer... :D

Now, if IRE mean Intensely Wise and Handsome, I could swing it, but since it doesn't... :D

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 11:46 AM
To Cary: I agree that both sides are using it as a racial comparison not political. Its not "Historical" unless you consider his skin color. I'll be very happy when we run out of "Firsts" when it comes to race and sex in politics...I mean that in the positive way not a negative way. It shouldn't matter but sadly it still does to many people.

Premonition, Dav?

Actually this scares me. I really don't want a woman in that position who is pro-life. I myself am pro-choice. Men can go on and on about the issue. If it's a women, she may hold more sway. What if she makes it her "pet" issue?

In another thread we talked about doctors and pharmacists witholding birth control and the morning after pill. The pro-life stance, supported by a woman vp, could have a big effect on a lot of issues.

Oh, back to Dav's premonition. This is another of those "firsts". McCain went and found his "first" to match Obama's "first".

I don't know nearly enough about Palin to know if she'll be able for the position. All I've heard/read so far is "Palin is hard-core base-right conservative", to steal a great line from Ivhon. :D

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:51 AM
Back to Palin's legal troubles... an article from the Anchorage paper.

http://www.adn.com/monegan/story/478090.html

JUNEAU -- Alaska legislators on Monday voted to spend up to $100,000 to investigate Gov. Sarah Palin's controversial firing of former state Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan.

The decision came from the Legislative Council, a bipartisan panel of state senators and representatives.

The committee itself will not conduct the probe. Rather, it will hire an independent investigator to explore whether Palin, her family or members of her administration pressured Monegan to fire an Alaska state trooper involved in a rough divorce from Palin's sister.

Monegan contends he did feel such pressure, and the question for the investigator will be whether Monegan might have lost his job for failing to dismiss trooper Mike Wooten.

Palin has denied applying any pressure or otherwise abusing her power as governor.

Sharon Leighow, the governor's spokeswoman, said Palin "doesn't see a need for a formal investigation," but is willing to answer questions.

"The governor has said all along that she will fully cooperate with an investigation and her staff will cooperate as well," Leighow said.

The governor was not available for comment Monday afternoon, as she was flying from Anchorage to the capital.

Palin abruptly fired Monegan on July 11 and later explained she wanted to take the Department of Public Safety in a different, more energetic direction. She replaced him with Chuck Kopp, the former Kenai police chief. But Kopp resigned Friday over questions about a reprimand he received after a sexual harassment complaint lodged against him in Kenai.

The Legislative Council is a panel of lawmakers who tend to legislative business when lawmakers are not meeting in regular session.

On Monday, the council voted 12-0 to spend up to $100,000 "to investigate the circumstances and events surrounding the termination of former Public Safety Commissioner Monegan, and potential abuses of power and/or improper actions by members of the executive branch."

Although absent from the council meeting Monday, Sen. John Cowdery, R-Anchorage, took part in the hearing via teleconference; he did not cast a vote. Cowdery, who is under federal indictment on bribery and conspiracy charges, formerly was chairman of the Legislative Council but resigned last week, citing health problems.

Council members on Monday confirmed Sen. Kim Elton, D-Juneau, as the new chairman, and he said he'll be the one who signs the contract with the person hired to do the Monegan investigation.

The council tapped Anchorage Democratic Sen. Hollis French, a former state prosecutor, for the task of managing the contractor conducting the investigation.

Elton and other lawmakers said they knew of several good candidates -- inside and outside Alaska -- who could do the job.

"I can think of at least two people who would be great," said Elton, declining to name names.

Elton told his fellow council members he hopes the investigation can be done "for a lot less" than $100,000.


The council didn't specify when the investigator will be hired or when the probe will end. The motion it passed just says the investigator will submit a report "in a timely manner."

French told the council the investigator will go to work gathering evidence and then could come back to lawmakers if "some people just won't talk." The House and Senate judiciary committees could then issue legislative subpoenas to compel testimony.

"It is the intent of the Legislative Council that the investigation be professional, unbiased, independent, objective, and conducted at arm's length from the political process," the council motion says.

Supporters as well as detractors of the Republican governor generally agreed the legislative investigation is needed into the circumstances leading up to Monegan's dismissal.

"There's a big question about what happened. The public wants to know what happened," said Fairbanks Democratic Rep. David Guttenberg, a Legislative Council member. "There's something that doesn't quite smell right. The governor's not going to appoint a special prosecutor to look at whether she's abused power."

Guttenberg said Palin didn't help matters with her long, rambling press release a week ago in which she and some of her top aides tried to refute Monegan. The press release was titled "Palin Responds to Latest Falsehoods."

Sen. Gene Therriault of North Pole, leader of the small Republican Senate minority that generally has backed Palin's policies, said he expects the governor will cooperate, and if she's cleared, the investigation could strengthen her.

"Unfortunately, with partisan politics and talk shows and bloggers, there's probably just as much noise as substance," he said. "Hopefully, what the investigator can do is sift through it and see if there's any legitimacy."

Senate President Lyda Green, a Wasilla Republican and member of the Legislative Council, said the investigation is "absolutely" needed.

"I'm hoping for a clean bill for everybody -- that everyone has acted honorably," said Green, who has butted heads with Palin politically.

Green said she expects the investigator will need perhaps a month to determine whether subpoenas are needed to compel testimony from uncooperative witnesses.

Elton said he'd like the see the whole affair wrapped up before the holidays, and "well before" the new Legislature is seated.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 11:52 AM
Apparently Cary. I never expected this.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:54 AM
Apparently, Palin doesn't find the VP job to be productive at all.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12969.html

If Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin got the job as running mate for Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.), count her as one of the most surprised.

In an interview just a month ago, she dissed the job, saying it didn’t seem “productive.”

In fact, she said she doesn’t know what the vice president does.

Larry Kudlow of CNBC’s “Kudlow & Co.” asked her about the possibility of becoming McCain's ticket mate.
Palin replied: “As for that VP talk all the time, I’ll tell you, I still can’t answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the VP does every day? I’m used to being very productive and working real hard in an administration. We want to make sure that that VP slot would be a fruitful type of position, especially for Alaskans and for the things that we’re trying to accomplish up here for the rest of the U.S., before I can even start addressing that question.”

Her evident distaste for the office would be part of her appeal: It would show McCain is running an anti-Washington, reformist campaign.

But it also points to a huge negative for her: It robs Republicans of their most effective argument against Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) — that he lacks experience.

Before Palin’s election in December 2006 as the state’s first woman governor, she served terms on the city council of Wasilla, Alaska (population 6,700), and two terms as the mayor/manager of Wasilla.

Note the article also mentions it takes away McCain's main arguement against Obama... I'm liking this pick more and more. :D

Crispin's Crispian
08-29-2008, 11:55 AM
Who?
No, no. It's "woof." Owls say "who".

Sinistrum
08-29-2008, 11:57 AM
And I see no difference between conservative and stale. Conservatives continually stubbornly do the same old thing, and the country is tired of it.

Kind of like how I see no difference between liberals and foolishly idealistic or completely detached from reality? :p

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 11:58 AM
Kind of like how I see no difference between liberals and foolishly idealistic or completely detached from reality? :p
Why not? :D I really do love the way you word things. :D

Sinistrum
08-29-2008, 12:02 PM
Why not? I really do love the way you word things.

At least you're being a good sport when someone pokes back at you. Which is more than I can say about more than a few others around here. :D

Brita
08-29-2008, 12:12 PM
On Monday, the council voted 12-0 to spend up to $100,000 "to investigate the circumstances and events surrounding the termination of former Public Safety Commissioner Monegan, and potential abuses of power and/or improper actions by members of the executive branch."

Ummmmm.....spend 100,000 dollars on vague accusations of improper actions, yet let a man go with a 5 day suspension for tasering an 11 yr old boy....

Am I the only one who is more concerned with a police officer still on duty that tasered a boy and uttered death threats?

I guarantee you if I used 18 guage needle from work to stab a child I would not have my job still.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 12:14 PM
At least you're being a good sport when someone pokes back at you. Which is more than I can say about more than a few others around here. :D
I have no fight with you. :D I know I can be foolish, but I embrace it. :D

Frenzy
08-29-2008, 12:27 PM
I guarantee you if I used 18 guage needle from work to stab a child I would not have my job still.
You need a better union.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 12:32 PM
From what I understand she's also against Polar bears and wolves being protected and wants to allow hunting of both...the more I read about her, the less I care for the choice.

Go Undecided!!!

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 12:32 PM
Look, they are introducing Sarah Quayle right now... :D

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 12:34 PM
From what I understand she's also against Polar bears and wolves being protected and wants to allow hunting of both...the more I read about her, the less I care for the choice.

Go Undecided!!!
Are you serious? Hunting of Polar Bears? :mad: :mad: :mad:

She just became Public Enemy Number One in my book. :mad:

Brita
08-29-2008, 12:35 PM
You need a better union.

Ha!

Highjack post: We are governed by the College of Nurses- which protects the safety and wellbeing of patients. They have the right to revoke my license to practice nursing- and the union has absolutely no power over this.

This is the way it should be when people are in a position of power over other people- there needs to be a governing body that is the watchdog over public safety. Physicians have it, pharmacists have it etc. Police most certainly should have it! This case just proves the point.

Anyway, I can tell people don't want me to highjack their US Politics thread as they are doggedly ignoring me, so carry on with the Republican vs. Democratic banter.... :)

Sinistrum
08-29-2008, 12:35 PM
Are you serious? Hunting of Polar Bears?

She just became Public Enemy Number One in my book.

What? I hear polar bear bbq is really good...

Davian93
08-29-2008, 12:37 PM
http://www.adn.com/polarbears/story/413710.html

Palin's is suing because it affects the Alaskan Oil industry (you know the guys her husband works for)

No Conflict of Interest there.


Damn you Mac...I may have to end up voting for Obama because of this pick.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 12:39 PM
http://www.defenders.org/newsroom/press_releases_folder/2007/03_27_2007_judge_asked_to_shut_down_wolf_bounty_pr ogram.php


This is just as brutal as what was done to the bison in the 19th century. This lady is sick.

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 12:46 PM
~pinches Sini~ :p

Polar Bears & Wolves :(

I don't like that at all. Can someone find anything about her feelings on the indigenious people of Alaska. They have the highest rate of homelessness, on purpose. They still live off the land, and as far as I know the laws protect that right.

(I'm at work, and I'm not working much... I need to get back to it before my boss raises his eyebrow at me again.)

Davian93
08-29-2008, 12:53 PM
Well her husband is an Inuit...I would think she likes them well enough...or at least more than Polar Bears.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 01:20 PM
What? I hear polar bear bbq is really good...
If I knew an animal you liked I would twist that on you, but since I don't...well... I don't like BBQ. There. Take that! :D

That is pretty sick though. :mad:

Davian93
08-29-2008, 01:22 PM
If I knew an animal you liked I would twist that on you, but since I don't...well... I don't like BBQ. There. Take that! :D

That is pretty sick though. :mad:

I can't support someone who stands for the things she does. Her stance on social issues is terrifying to say the least and as person who is an ardent supporter of the environment, her ideas are repulsive.

Sorry Mac...but you lost my vote.

~swallows hard~

~gets a tad sick~

Go...Obama?!?


Hell has definitely frozen over.

Crispin's Crispian
08-29-2008, 01:25 PM
Ummmmm.....spend 100,000 dollars on vague accusations of improper actions, yet let a man go with a 5 day suspension for tasering an 11 yr old boy....

Am I the only one who is more concerned with a police officer still on duty that tasered a boy and uttered death threats?

But he asked for it (http://www.adn.com/politics/story/476430.html):

TASING THE STEPSON

One day -- maybe a year or two before the investigation -- Wooten showed his stepson his Taser. He had just been to Taser instructor school. Wooten told Sgt. Wall that the boy was fascinated and pleaded to be tased.

"So we went in our living room and I had him get down on his knees so he wouldn't fall. And I taped the probes to him and turned the Taser on for like a second, turned it off. He thought that was the greatest thing in the world, wanted to do it again," Wooten told the investigator. The boy flinched but nothing more, he said. The boy was about 11 at the time.

In his interview with troopers, the stepson said it hurt for about a second, according to Wall's report. The boy said he wanted to be tased to show his cousin, Palin's daughter Bristol, that he wasn't a mama's boy. The probe left a welt on his arm, he said. His mother was upstairs yelling at them not to do it, the boy said.

As Bristol remembered it, the jolt knocked the boy backward, the trooper report says. She said she was afraid.

The probes are attached by thin wires to the Taser cartridge. In the field, an officer fires the probes into a suspect's skin or clothing and the suspect receives a jolt of electricity for five seconds, said Steve Tuttle, a spokesman for Taser International, which makes the devices. They are only incapacitated during that time. In demos, the probes might be taped to a person so that they don't accidentally strike an eye or injure the volunteer, he said. If the Taser is fired for just a second, it would feel like your funny bone was hit but the quick jolt wouldn't knock you over, Tuttle said.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 01:26 PM
LOL...only in Alaska...if true that's one tough kid...he's the coolest. I mean seriously in the world of an 11 year old boy that's some serious street cred.

Crispin's Crispian
08-29-2008, 01:27 PM
I can't support someone who stands for the things she does. Her stance on social issues is terrifying to say the least and as person who is an ardent supporter of the environment, her ideas are repulsive.

Sorry Mac...but you lost my vote.

~swallows hard~

~gets a tad sick~

Go...Obama?!?


Hell has definitely frozen over.

I think this is going in someone's signature...

Anyway, polar bears and wolves are a nuisance in Alaska. They're cute and stuff, but you guys don't have to live with them going through your garbage, killing your chickens, or threatening your kids.

Or that's what they would tell you, anyway, if you asked the hunters.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 01:29 PM
Feel free to...I'll put it in mine but I already have a long sig...


McCain just slapped every moderate and independent supporter he has with this pick...its such an obvious attempt to get the female vote.

Sinistrum
08-29-2008, 01:33 PM
I don't like BBQ. There.

Heathen. :p Yanno that is a shootin offense here in Texas.

Brita
08-29-2008, 01:35 PM
Posted by Muttley: But he asked for it:

Ah- so it wasn't done in anger. That teaches me to get my panties in a knot without looking at the facts :)

I still think it is inappropriate and poor judgement, but not as scary. This is a good response I think:

"This discipline is meant to be a last chance to take corrective action," Grimes wrote. "You are hereby given notice that any further occurrences of these types of behaviors or incidents will not be tolerated and will result in your termination."

And Dav- doing mushrooms or smoking a joint would also be good street cred for an 11 year old- doesn't mean the adults responsible for the child should give it to him :p

Davian93
08-29-2008, 01:40 PM
And Dav- doing mushrooms or smoking a joint would also be good street cred for an 11 year old- doesn't mean the adults responsible for the child should give it to him :p

Trust me...this is way cooler.

Brita
08-29-2008, 01:42 PM
Trust me...this is way cooler.

Ya- I know....

Ishara
08-29-2008, 02:19 PM
I found out this afternoon on the tv in the elevator at work - my first thought was that McCain's camp was extraordinarily clever with the pick. Personally, she makes my blood run cold.

I can't see he being elected simply because people want a woman in power - that's as silly as saying people will vote for Obama simply because he's black, with nothing to do with his policies and ideas.

Also, the fact that she advocates hunting polar bears and wolves is turning people off of her faster than the fact that she's so right wing and conservative? Really?

Davian93
08-29-2008, 02:22 PM
I wouldn't trust her to be one heartbeat away from the Presidency...she's go no real experience...running alaska for 2 years...seriously that means nothing to me...ALaska is barely even a state.

pops taer
08-29-2008, 02:23 PM
She's a politician!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sinistrum
08-29-2008, 02:24 PM
I can't see he being elected simply because people want a woman in power - that's as silly as saying people will vote for Obama simply because he's black, with nothing to do with his policies and ideas.

I think maybe you give the average voter more credit than I do on such things...

Brita
08-29-2008, 02:46 PM
I can't support someone who stands for the things she does. Her stance on social issues is terrifying to say the least and as person who is an ardent supporter of the environment, her ideas are repulsive.

Sorry Mac...but you lost my vote.

~swallows hard~

~gets a tad sick~

Go...Obama?!?


Hell has definitely frozen over.

No comment from Spammer yet- I think he may have fainted with joy and surprise. You really should have warned him to sit down before you posted this. :D

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:03 PM
I'm friends with someone in Alaska on another board. She says Palin has a rep of being no nonsense and down-to-earth. And frankly asking for it or not, tasering an 11 year old is not a good idea.

To quote my friend:

This session her son had his military graduation or ceremony and the house and senate wanted her to do the state of the state address during that time. She said no she was going to her son's deal, they responded with well the house can make it but the senate can't so you'll have to reschedule, she responds with, well looks like I'll just be addressing the house this year. Both house and senate were present.

And I think it's black bears are a nuisance in Alaska, not polar bears, though I'll check with my friend. Wolves are considered a nuisance all over the Pacific northwest.

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 03:08 PM
I agree with Sini. I think there will be a good number of women who vote for McCain simply because Palin is a woman.

The woman who did the add for him saying that she used to support Hillary but supports McCain now had absolutely NO idea that he is against equal pay for equal work and against a woman's right to choose.

Terez
08-29-2008, 03:11 PM
Oh, back to Dav's premonition. This is another of those "firsts". McCain went and found his "first" to match Obama's "first".
Not quite. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geraldine_Ferraro)

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:15 PM
And I think it's black bears are a nuisance in Alaska, not polar bears, though I'll check with my friend. Wolves are considered a nuisance all over the Pacific northwest.


Nuisance, in my book, is not a good reason for killing them. We are technologically advanced, there must be another way to deter them from being a nuisance.

How can you be pro-life, and pro-killing "nuisances"?

(Not picking on you, Gil)

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:15 PM
Thank you, Terez, I knew there was something wrong with that statement, but I'd forgotten Ms. Ferraro.

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:16 PM
Never said I agreed with the nuisance category either. But my friend regards black bears like you and I do raccoons and armadillos.

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:18 PM
Not quite. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geraldine_Ferraro)

Oh yeah... I almost remember that. I remember Ronnie "ray-gun". It really confused me when I was little. I kept seeing sci-fi movies in my head. Of course I was 7 or 8 years old...

It's still a "first", if Obama wins he'll be the first african american president, if McCain wins, Palin will be the first woman vp. :p

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:22 PM
But not the first woman VP nominee.

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:23 PM
I don't kill raccoons or armadillos. I have raccoons and possums that continuously sneak in through my cat door to raid the cat food.

I sprayed amonia in the trash can to keep the raccoons away, and I also turn on a radio in the garage, set to talk radio to deter them. I also put the cat food away at night, wich means that every morning at 6:30, Bear wakes me up yowling for his food.

I still am not about to kill them. I did kick one the other night, as it was running out the cat door. Pretty stupid on my part, I coulda lost a tow! But I was bit miffed.

Terez
08-29-2008, 03:24 PM
It's still a "first", if Obama wins he'll be the first african american president, if McCain wins, Palin will be the first woman vp. :p
Well, then it would be a first. But for now, it's nothing new or special, except for the Republican party. Hardly a "first to match Obama's". :p

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:24 PM
But not the first woman VP nominee.

Yup, that's what Terez just pointed out and I agreed with.

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:31 PM
From my friend in Alaska:

I don't think so, I vote so they can be hunted. They are predators who can overrun an area and kill off a lot of the caribou or moose, animals that a lot of the villages subsistence hunt and live off of all year. We're talking about villages with no road access, only means in and out is by bush plane, no running water, no electricity etc. If they don't subsistence hunt people will die.
The only measure that's been put up in the state regarding hunting is aerial hunting, we don't allow individuals to hunt and fly on the same day, i.e. chase a wolf in a float plane, land hunt it and kill it on the same day. Further, the Big Game Guide Board polices sport hunting like nobody's business, they are one of my clients.

If that's their reasoning... I can see where they're coming from.

And Cary, you know darned well I don't do anything against the armadillo uprooting my garden and nesting under my neighbor's bushes, despite Bryan joking about taking det cord to the damned thing for ruining everyone's front yard.

Brita
08-29-2008, 03:38 PM
Armadillo's and Possums are a nuisance, but relatively harmless to people as far a death goes.

Black bears very rarely attack people, but they can. Trust me, you don't want black bears digging in you garden with your 5 year old swinging on the swing nearby.

That being said, we usually live trap bears and release them at least an hour from residential areas. My father-in-law has to do this at least once a year, usually more. So even with dangerous animals, there are alternatives.

Wolves...well, they leave us alone, and we leave them alone. It just works all around.

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:40 PM
And Cary, you know darned well I don't do anything against the armadillo uprooting my garden and nesting under my neighbor's bushes, despite Bryan joking about taking det cord to the damned thing for ruining everyone's front yard.

ROFL - first I've heard about that problem. I was not implying you would kill the critters. Just saying I won't do it.

You know, about the bears and wolves, I can understand how it causes a problem. Now if those villages, dont' have running water, electricity, etc. Is is too much to ask that they use the pelts for clothing, and eat the meat? I hate to think of the waste. I hope they are hunted humanely, I hope the strict guidelines are followed.

The bounty on the wolves (and the fact that they have to chop of the leg and take it in...) makes me think that guidelines will be ignored. How can you know where that front leg is from? In the controlled area or not?

I dont' like sports hunting, I dont like killing things cause they are a nuisance. A danger, yeah I can agree with killing, but not wasting. I like the idea of trapping and relocating MUCH better.

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:55 PM
Armadillo's and Possums are a nuisance, but relatively harmless to people as far a death goes.


Armadillos carry leprosy.


I don't agree with the nuisance thing, but it boils down to Native American/Inuit rights. And yes, they probably do use the whole animal.

Brita
08-29-2008, 03:57 PM
Armadillos carry leprosy.

Ewww.

Although leprosy is highly treatable, whereas death from bear mauling not so much. :p

Gilshalos Sedai
08-29-2008, 03:58 PM
Although leprosy is highly treatable


Yeah, cause that's why there's still a leper colony in Northern Louisana.

Brita
08-29-2008, 04:11 PM
Yeah, cause that's why there's still a leper colony in Northern Louisana.

For real? Because

MDT remains highly effective and patients are no longer infectious after the first monthly dose. It is safe and easy to use under field conditions due to its presentation in calendar blister packs. Relapse rates remain low, and there is no known resistance to the combined drugs.

Maybe they isolate themselves because of the deformities?

Leprosy is curable; however, the deformities and nerve damage associated with leprosy are often irreversible. (http://www.healthatoz.com/healthatoz/Atoz/common/standard/transform.jsp?requestURI=/healthatoz/Atoz/ency/leprosy.jsp)

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 04:18 PM
I believe the colony you are referring to is closed:

Wiki says (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carville,_Louisiana): Carville (pop. 1108) is an unincorporated village in Iberville Parish, Louisiana that is 16 miles south of Baton Rouge on the Mississippi River. Carville is the hometown of political personality James Carville and was in fact named after his grandfather, the postmaster. It is also the location of the National Hansen's Disease Museum, which records the history of the U.S. Public Health Service Hospital there, which for a hundred years treated leprosy (now called Hansen's Disease) patients. The hospital has been closed, but several of the buildings remain.

Crispin's Crispian
08-29-2008, 04:31 PM
Gil, I'm sure that polar bears are a nuisance, but there all 100 miles north of where anyone lives so it doesn't happen much. ;) And wolves aren't really a nuisance in the PNW as much as in the Rockies and slightly west. There is a small population that has made its way into eastern Oregon, and there is some controversy about them (because, being wild predators, they'll kill livestock if they can).

Black bears are nuisances pretty much where they are, because they're so damn smart and usually hungry.

As for killing them...I generally dislike killing things for sport, but I suppose Alaska's economy wouldn't do so well otherwise.


How can you be pro-life, and pro-killing "nuisances"?

Obviously it's pro-human life, except in the case of the death penalty (or some other scenarios I can imagine).

And I was being sarcastic about the nuisance factor--I'm sure they kill polar bears for sport and their fur more than population control.

Crispin's Crispian
08-29-2008, 04:33 PM
I agree with Sini. I think there will be a good number of women who vote for McCain simply because Palin is a woman.

The woman who did the add for him saying that she used to support Hillary but supports McCain now had absolutely NO idea that he is against equal pay for equal work and against a woman's right to choose.
That's the demo they're going for. In her speech she made remarks about women finally "shattering the glass ceiling," so she's going to make a solidary pitch.

There's such a drastic difference in politics between her and Hillary though that I wonder how much difference it will make. People that are engaged enough to vote will usually figure out that you don't vote for the Pres. just based on who the VP is, let alone her sex or race.

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 05:00 PM
Im not sure.

On the one hand, she looks very much like a paper candidate. Lots of surface gloss (and yes, so far every Republican guest commentator has mentioned the child with Downe's Syndorme) with her story, but not much there.

Im amused to see how all of a sudden the experience issue has shifted to executive experience and that Palin now has more experience than Obama and Biden combined (McCain, too, by that silly measure). In fact everything I hear now has the "executive" modifier in it.

She is more right than McCain. Anti-choice even in cases of rape and incest.

On the other hand, this motivates the evangelicals. It has totally shifted focus from Obama's speech. She is very attractive (and looks have always been a big help in politics). And if moderates and even left-of-center women buy into the "compassionate mother" thing, it could be a very long 4 years for America.

Terez
08-29-2008, 05:04 PM
She is more right than McCain. Anti-choice even in cases of rape and incest.
Yup, that is about as conservative as it gets.

Cary Sedai
08-29-2008, 05:09 PM
Just read this article:

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics/AP/story/664595.html

Campaign contributions Palin collected earlier in her political career could also provide fodder for Democratic campaign ads, tying her to an Alaska Republican political scandal from which she has tried to distance herself.

Palin raised at least $4,500 for her unsuccessful 2002 campaign for lieutenant governor from executives of VECO Corp., an oil services contractor at the heart of a massive influence-peddling investigation. Alaska Republican Sen. Ted Stevens is accused of accepting more than $250,000 in home renovations and gifts from VECO executives and failing to disclose them on his annual financial statements; the senator says he is innocent.

Palin received $500 each from nine VECO executives in December 2001, including then-CEO Bill Allen, who last year pleaded guilty to federal conspiracy, bribery and tax charges and agreed to cooperate in the corruption investigation.

Oh and this one, too:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2008147009_apidveepstakespalinidaho2ndldwritethru. html

She graduated from the University of Idaho with a journalism degree in 1987.

Sei'taer
08-29-2008, 05:25 PM
well, I've read through all 8 pages on this, and looked at all the links that have been posted (Ire, if you don't quit with the huffington post links, I'm going to totally switch to fox news links...exclusively). I like Palin. Will she make me vote for McCain...at this point, no she won't. Could that change...maybe, but it's not looking so good. I have serious issues with McCain that a VP pick can't change. I'm doing some research on some things (did you know polar bear and wolf hunting are legal in Canada with some restrictions, but no more than a regular deer hunt?) and I'll let you know how I feel about he after I do it.

I do have some problems with her stances on global warming and gay marriage and I will probably find others that I don't like. Is she perfect? No, but for me she is better than McCain, Obama, and Biden. Thats me though.

I like how people jumped on the woman for her politics, even to the point of calling her Sarah Quayle. It's obvious she's not stupid and she does lack in experience, but she's not running for president either. SHe seems to be fighter and from the articles I can find on her in Alaska and other places she is more bipartisan than I would be in the same position. She's working on a natural gas pipeline in her state and seems to be in agreement with T. Boone Pickens as far as the energy problem goes. I'm saying that there are some good things out there if you look for them. Obama has a few good points, Biden has one good point and McCain as at least one and maybe two:D .

I just think some people jumped on and off the bandwagon and started bashing her simply because she's a conservative...I'd say find something like her policies to bash her on and look into them before you do that.

~walks away muttering~ .........Sarah Quayle...might as well go on about BO and Ayers the same way...this from a guy who was trying to dog me for making fun of the way he talks. bandwagoneers........

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 05:56 PM
ST

Im "bashing (and I suspect you are not talking about me)" her strictly upon her politics.

I do not think that the Republicans would make the Quayle mistake again - even if McCain has only met her twice. She is clearly intelligent and can speak - unlike J Danforth. I completely disagree with the majority of her politics and specifically on a make or break issue for me personally which is that she wants to flat out outlaw any form of abortion at any time. I cannot support that at all.

As far as the Vice President is concerned. 9 vice presidents have moved to the Presidency due to the death or resignation of the President. That is actually a decent percentage.

In this particular election, I think the VP nominees are more important than usual because I think the Presidential candidates both stand a very high risk of dying in office - one from natural causes, the other from an assassin's bullet. Therefore, the VP candidate for both candidates is more important than usual this year. Someone who "isn't too interested (her words)" in what is going on in Iraq, has not been involved in anything to do with foreign policy and has only limited experience in domestic policy is a very big question mark - particularly if McCain were to pass early in his term (I don't think it will take TOO long to get up to speed...but more than 2 months, certainly).

tanaww
08-29-2008, 06:00 PM
You know, about the bears and wolves, I can understand how it causes a problem. Now if those villages, dont' have running water, electricity, etc. Is is too much to ask that they use the pelts for clothing, and eat the meat? I hate to think of the waste. I hope they are hunted humanely, I hope the strict guidelines are followed.

I would almost guarantee that these villages (who, as my friend said) are subsistence hunters will use every single useable part of whatever animal they're hunting. I didn't read the link but if they have to bring in part of a leg, it's because there's nothing usable - or very little- on the leg of a wolf.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 06:08 PM
Was it necessary to parade the down syndrome baby at the speech earlier today? I mean really?!? Its already ridiculous. She's completely unqualified to be a heartbeat away from the Presidency.

Sei'taer
08-29-2008, 06:23 PM
Was it necessary to parade the down syndrome baby at the speech earlier today? I mean really?!? Its already ridiculous. She's completely unqualified to be a heartbeat away from the Presidency.

So, it was bad form for Obama to have his kids on stage at the convention? I didn't hear her mention DS a single time when she was introducing her kids or husband. She did make reference to her oldest son going to Iraq though...

Sodas
08-29-2008, 06:41 PM
Rofl. This just shows how bad McCain's judgement really is. He has been going on and on this whole month about picking someone who could step in and be C'n'C, and then goes and picks someone with no foriegn policy curiosity or experience at all.

And don't think Hillary voters will be fooled so easily. The ones that would have voted McCain will vote McCain anyway. In fact, I think some Hillary voters will resent what Palin said today about Hillary actually hurting the women's cause. In fact, this seems like a big slap in the face to put an unqualified individual who is under major investigations in her home state and say it's historic.

Davian93
08-29-2008, 06:43 PM
So, it was bad form for Obama to have his kids on stage at the convention? I didn't hear her mention DS a single time when she was introducing her kids or husband. She did make reference to her oldest son going to Iraq though...


When she called herself a Hockey Mom I puked a little bit in my mouth.

Crispin's Crispian
08-29-2008, 07:36 PM
When she called herself a Hockey Mom I puked a little bit in my mouth.
I agree with ST about her child. Every candidate does that with their kids, and so far it's only everyone else that's making an issue out of Down's Syndrome. Was she supposed to leave the child at home so as not to incite criticism?

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 09:03 PM
Evidently she flip-flopped on the bridge to nowhere issue. In 2006, she reportedly was all for it and felt the need to take advantage of the congressional delegation (aka the pork in the barrel). Only when the heat came down on some of the ethics things did she change position and veto it.

Sei'taer
08-29-2008, 09:43 PM
Evidently she flip-flopped on the bridge to nowhere issue. In 2006, she reportedly was all for it and felt the need to take advantage of the congressional delegation (aka the pork in the barrel). Only when the heat came down on some of the ethics things did she change position and veto it.

Would you rather a flip, or a hardhead who keeps going for something that is wrong..aka present admin?

Rofl. This just shows how bad McCain's judgement really is. He has been going on and on this whole month about picking someone who could step in and be C'n'C, and then goes and picks someone with no foriegn policy curiosity or experience at all..

143 days.


The truth is that Bill is right on this. No one is ready for the presidency. Some are better prepared than others, but none are truly prepared. Thats not one of my criticisms of Obama. I just don't like his policies.

Sei'taer
08-29-2008, 09:53 PM
I agree with ST about her child. Every candidate does that with their kids, and so far it's only everyone else that's making an issue out of Down's Syndrome. Was she supposed to leave the child at home so as not to incite criticism?

Here's my bet, SDog. Sooner or later someone is going to crticize her for having the audacity to have a baby at the age of 44. They will probably say she should have been more responsible at that age knowing that she was at a much higher risk of having a child with DS. As someone who has a handicapped child, I applaud her for having the cajones to go for it.

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 09:56 PM
Wow Davian, I just recovered from your revelation. :D

No, I've spent a long time now reading up on her, and she is very, very conversative, so of course I dislike her. It clearly was a desperation pick for McCain to get attention, and try to get people to watch his convention. But I believe the American people are smarter than that, and will see right though this shallow and dim-witted political power play trick of a VP.

Heathen. Yanno that is a shootin offense here in Texas.
Bring it on. I think you Texans are all talk. :D

EDIT: Sei, okay, okay, I'll limit the Huff Post links... :)

Sei'taer
08-29-2008, 10:00 PM
from the AP. (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/O/OBAMA_PALIN?SITE=FLTAM&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT)

Obama camp hits, then praises McCain's VP choice

By CHARLES BABINGTON
Associated Press Writer

BEAVER, Pa. (AP) -- Barack Obama's spokesman fired off a fast criticism of Republican John McCain's new running mate Friday, but the Democratic candidate himself quickly stepped in to offer her congratulations and praise.

Obama, who is eager to win over female voters who backed his rival Hillary Rodham Clinton in the primaries, blamed the mixed messages about McCain's choice, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, on campaign aides with a "hair trigger."

He and his running mate, Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware, followed up with congratulatory phone calls to Palin.

McCain made his surprise announcement moments before Obama flew from Denver with Biden and their wives. Fresh off Obama's nomination acceptance speech before 84,000 people Thursday night, the foursome launched a three-day bus tour of crucial industrial states, which began with a visit to a biodiesel fuel plant near Pittsburgh.

As the plane was lifting off from Denver, Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton issued a statement calling Palin an abortion-rights opponent and "the former mayor of a town of 9,000 with zero foreign policy experience."

Soon thereafter, with the plane over the Midwest, a spokeswoman gave reporters on board a much kinder statement from Biden and Obama.

"Her selection is yet another encouraging sign that old barriers are falling in our politics," their statement said. "While we obviously have differences over how best to lead this country forward, Gov. Palin is an admirable person and will add a compelling new voice to this campaign."

After touring the steamy biodiesel fuel plant in Monaca, Pa., Obama offered reporters still another comment on Palin.

He has not met her, he said, but "she seems like a compelling person. Obviously a terrific story, personal story. And I'm sure that she will help make the case for the Republicans. Unfortunately, the case is more of the same," an allusion to his theme that McCain will continue Bush administration policies.

Palin's selection, Obama said, "is one more indicator of this country moving forward. The fact that you've got a woman" as the "vice presidential nominee of one of the major parties, I think, is one more hit against that glass ceiling."

Clinton often says she made "18 million cracks in the glass ceiling," a reference to the number of votes she won in primaries as she sought to become the nation's first female president.

Asked why Burton's statement had been far more critical of Palin, Obama said, "I think, you know, campaigns start getting these hair triggers. And the statement that Joe and I put out reflects our sentiments."

In his telephone call to Palin, Obama "told her she would be a terrific candidate," campaign spokesman Robert Gibbs said later. "He also wished her good luck, but not too much luck."

Spokesmen said Biden also called Palin to congratulate her.

When Obama named Biden his running mate earlier this month, McCain congratulated the Delaware senator while many of his surrogates criticized Biden. Since then, the barbs between Obama and McCain have grown sharper.

In Monaca, Obama, Biden and their wives stopped at an industrial warehouse where chicken fat is converted to tractor fuel. The visit made two things clear: Western Pennsylvania, where Clinton easily bested Obama in the primary, will be hotly contested in the fall campaign, and energy will be a top campaign issue, because the two parties disagree over which new energy sources should be pursued hardest.

At an evening rally with several thousand people in Beaver, floodlights bathed a bunting-draped bandstand where Obama repeated several of his themes from Denver.

He noted that McCain has vowed to purse Osama bin Laden "to the gates of hell."

"Well, he should start by going to where Osama bin Laden actually lives," Obama said, in mountain caves "between Afghanistan and Pakistan."

----------------------------------------

So he did the classy thing...good for him!

irerancincpkc
08-29-2008, 10:05 PM
I almost stopped reading at the very beginning.

By CHARLES BABINGTON
Associated Press Writer

The guy is a joke. The AP has become a joke. As Keith Olbermann said, this guy needs to find a new job.

But anyway, yes, it was nice of Obama to contact her as soon as he could. They more than likely had never talked before. :D

Ivhon
08-29-2008, 10:35 PM
I almost stopped reading at the very beginning.



The guy is a joke. The AP has become a joke. As Keith Olbermann said, this guy needs to find a new job.

But anyway, yes, it was nice of Obama to contact her as soon as he could. They more than likely had never talked before. :D

You know Im with you on this election and everything, Spammer. But you kinda have to take Keith Olberman with a wee grain of salt. Not that he is less responsible than faux news, but he definitely has his spin. :D

That being said, it seems pretty clear that the RNC or Rupert Murdoch has paid some money for the AP.

@ ST.

I have no problem with a candidate or politician changing his or her considered opinion over time. However, when the shift is abrupt and in response to the deal falling apart, it strikes me as not entirely genuine. Thereby being only one very small step - if anything - better than the stubborn wrongheadedness of the administration. It certainly calls into question the anti-corruption credentials that she is being touted as having. I.E. I find it a bit more than vaguely hypocritical pending deeper investigation.

Sei'taer
08-29-2008, 11:12 PM
@ ST.

I have no problem with a candidate or politician changing his or her considered opinion over time. However, when the shift is abrupt and in response to the deal falling apart, it strikes me as not entirely genuine. Thereby being only one very small step - if anything - better than the stubborn wrongheadedness of the administration. It certainly calls into question the anti-corruption credentials that she is being touted as having. I.E. I find it a bit more than vaguely hypocritical pending deeper investigation.

Point taken.

Terez
08-29-2008, 11:24 PM
Wow Davian, I just recovered from your revelation. :D
It was inevitable from the day he started pretending to be you...

irerancincpkc
08-30-2008, 09:14 AM
You know Im with you on this election and everything, Spammer. But you kinda have to take Keith Olberman with a wee grain of salt. Not that he is less responsible than faux news, but he definitely has his spin. :D

That being said, it seems pretty clear that the RNC or Rupert Murdoch has paid some money for the AP.

I know, but on this case, he was head on. The AP has been a problem for a while now. KO may be a bit more... dramatic... about it then others, I guess... :D

And Terez... :rolleyes: Though if we have to put up with this MSND, why can't I be the original?

Terez
08-30-2008, 09:58 AM
why can't I be the original?
Well, you are, aren't you? It's not my fault you registered the Davian name before the Spammer one. ;)

Davian93
08-30-2008, 12:03 PM
Well, you are, aren't you? It's not my fault you registered the Davian name before the Spammer one. ;)

HEY! I...um We take offense at that.

irerancincpkc
08-30-2008, 01:25 PM
HEY! I...um We take offense at that.
Yes we do! We won't have it.

Sodas
08-30-2008, 03:06 PM
The AP's reporting of this election has been horrible. Luckily, their subscriptions are being canceled at a record rate.

The truth is that Bill is right on this. No one is ready for the presidency.
There is not ready and NOT FREAKING READY.

Palin has been Governer of a population of 600,000 for not even 18 MONTHS!

That is way different than Obama's 14 years in Federal and State service.

And if you listen to Bill then, you should listen to him now when he says Obama is ready to lead.

Worst Vice-Presidential Nominee in U.S. History
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-j-elisberg/the-worst-vice-presidenti_b_122491.html

Sei'taer
08-30-2008, 03:51 PM
The AP's reporting of this election has been horrible. Luckily, their subscriptions are being canceled at a record rate.


There is not ready and NOT FREAKING READY.

Palin has been Governer of a population of 600,000 for not even 18 MONTHS!

That is way different than Obama's 14 years in Federal and State service.

And if you listen to Bill then, you should listen to him now when he says Obama is ready to lead.

Worst Vice-Presidential Nominee in U.S. History
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-j-elisberg/the-worst-vice-presidenti_b_122491.html


whatever. Huffington post. You wanna talk about AP and you're gonna put a huffington post link on here? Wait, lemme find a link to what Rush Limbaugh said...that won't be biased at all either...jesus h christ

irerancincpkc
08-30-2008, 05:29 PM
whatever. Huffington post. You wanna talk about AP and you're gonna put a huffington post link on here? Wait, lemme find a link to what Rush Limbaugh said...that won't be biased at all either...jesus h christ
Did you read the article? It was great and factual.

Sodas
08-30-2008, 06:41 PM
whatever. Huffington post. You wanna talk about AP and you're gonna put a huffington post link on here? Wait, lemme find a link to what Rush Limbaugh said...that won't be biased at all either...jesus h christ
Fine, how about articles from Alaskian newspapers?

the Daily News-Miner in Fairbanks:

Sen. John McCain's selection of Gov. Sarah Palin as his vice presidential running mate was a stunning decision that should make Alaskans proud, even while we wonder about the actual merits of the choice.... Alaskans and Americans must ask, though, whether she should become vice president and, more importantly, be placed first in line to become president.

In fact, as the governor herself acknowledged in her acceptance speech, she never set out to be involved in public affairs. She has never publicly demonstrated the kind of interest, much less expertise, in federal issues and foreign affairs that should mark a candidate for the second-highest office in the land. Republicans rightfully have criticized the Democratic nominee, Sen. Barack Obama, for his lack of experience, but Palin is a neophyte in comparison; how will Republicans reconcile the criticism of Obama with the obligatory cheering for Palin?

Most people would acknowledge that, regardless of her charm and good intentions, Palin is not ready for the top job. McCain seems to have put his political interests ahead of the nation's when he created the possibility that she might fill it.

the Anchorage Daily News:
It's stunning that someone with so little national and international experience might be heartbeat away from the presidency.

Gov. Palin is a classic Alaska story. She is an example of the opportunity our state offers to those with talent, initiative and determination...

McCain picked Palin despite a recent blemish on her ethically pure resume. While she was governor, members of her family and staff tried to get her ex-brother-in-law fired from the Alaska State Troopers. Her public safety commissioner would not do so; she forced him out, supposedly for other reasons. While she runs for vice-president, the Legislature has an investigator on the case.

For all those advantages, Palin joins the ticket with one huge weakness: She's a total beginner on national and international issues.

Gov. Palin will have to spend the next two months convincing Americans that she's ready to be a heartbeat away from the presidency....

Sei'taer
08-30-2008, 07:28 PM
There is not ready and NOT FREAKING READY.


It was great and factual.

Do you two seriously want to get into an argument about who is ready for the presidency by comparing a presidential nominee with a vice-presidential nominee? Or would you rather just get off of that and go back to comparing McCain to Obama? I'm good either way.

Sodas
08-30-2008, 11:31 PM
Do you two seriously want to get into an argument about who is ready for the presidency by comparing a presidential nominee with a vice-presidential nominee?
Yes.

During a time of two wars (or more), economic downturn and growing instability worldwide - who is behind that 72 year old man with melanoma matters.
Or would you rather just get off of that and go back to comparing McCain to Obama? I'm good either way.
Seems like you're not comfortable with Palin. It doesn't matter if it's the Huffington Post or Charles Krauthammer (R-Fox News All Star), there is a consensus that this was a dumb pick.

Here seems to be her foriegn policy experience...
http://www.grizzlybay.org/SarahPalinVikings.jpg

Davian93
08-31-2008, 10:08 AM
So that's what Alaskans look like...Hmm.

~crosses Alaska off places to move~

Ivhon
08-31-2008, 10:15 AM
So that's what Alaskans look like...Hmm.

~crosses Alaska off places to move~

Thats only Alaskan vikings. They are a dangerous bunch, prone to rape and pillage, but given the vastness of the state and the low population your chances of actually being sodomized by this bunch are only roughly similar to that of the big one hitting SoCal while you are there.

irerancincpkc
08-31-2008, 01:46 PM
I figured once the excitement of the pick was over, people would figure out what Palin is. But it is happening already.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/08/31/america/31women.php

Some, particularly women leaning toward a Republican ticket or who share Palin's staunch anti-abortion views, see it as a winning choice that they can happily embrace. But others, particularly the undecided women McCain is trying to reach, say this is the wrong woman, lacking experience and on the wrong side of the issues, like abortion, the Iraq war and the environment, that matter most to them.

Some Clinton stalwarts took offense, saying they felt as if McCain had decided that, for women disappointed that they could not vote for Clinton, any woman would do. "It's an insult," said Jan Roller, a Clinton delegate from Cleveland, as she arrived home from the convention. "You have to be qualified for the job."

Davian93
08-31-2008, 05:23 PM
How is she NOT qualified...she took her son to Hockey practice every day for years...and she's a woman...and she likes guns...did I mention she's a lifetime member of the NRA?!? How can anyone say she's not qualified...

Bryan Blaire
08-31-2008, 07:34 PM
Yeah, he should have gone with Kay Bailey Hutchison. Guess we get to keep her for Governorship though (hopefully) this way.

I'm voting for: The rest of you can have the US if you want. I want Texas to go back to being part of Mexico now.

Sodas
08-31-2008, 07:38 PM
I want Texas to go back to being part of Mexico now.
So long and thanks for all the fish!

;)

Bryan Blaire
08-31-2008, 07:39 PM
And all the oil we now get to sell you at OUTRAGEOUS prices. :D ~said in a bad, outrageous French accent~

Sinistrum
08-31-2008, 07:43 PM
Dude that picture so makes me want to vote for her. Some of those Viking chicks are kind of hot...

JSUCamel
08-31-2008, 08:53 PM
I like the viking in the bottom left, the one who's centuries ahead of his time. Nice glasses, Erik the Rayban.

Sodas
08-31-2008, 11:16 PM
And all the oil we now get to sell you at OUTRAGEOUS prices. :D ~said in a bad, outrageous French accent~
We got plenty of sunshine and wind here in California ;)

Besides, buying from Texas is just as bad as buying from a 3rd world country or France.

Ishara
09-02-2008, 09:29 AM
So no chatter on the fact that her 17 year old daughter is knocked up?

Davian93
09-02-2008, 09:30 AM
So no chatter on the fact that her 17 year old daughter is knocked up?

There's another thread on that subject....the one Titled "Obama declares knocked up daughter off limits" or something to that effect.