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SauceyBlueConfetti
06-03-2014, 02:03 PM
One of my longstanding issues with the internet, and TL, has been when bullying and in-fighting gets out of control. What happened in Wisconsin is terrifying, as it is being in part attributed to a forum that could for all intents and purposes be OURS. They focus on horror stories, etc, but their is crossover with fantasy, sci fi, zombies, etc which could draw similar crowds.

The gist of the CNN story (http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/03/justice/wisconsin-girl-stabbed/index.html?hpt=hp_t1) is two 12 year old girls planned for months to commit a (unsuccessful)murder to gain credence with an imaginary internet poster-turned-meme called Slenderman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slender_Man). The forum creator posted a response here = creepypasta.com (http://www.creepypasta.com/) { the website is crashing due to traffic }basically saying the kids completely misunderstood the site and he has no fault in the sad matter.

Horrifying. The internet is such an anonymous place. We tend to forget, or overlook, that incredibly screwed up people wander in, look around, and build a world in their minds about what and who they THINK we are all about.

Thoughts?

SauceyBlueConfetti
06-03-2014, 02:05 PM
here is the CreepyPasta response...I am posting the full note as the website keeps crashing and I am wondering if he will/might change the note due to intense media interest and police investigations:


From CreepyPasta.Com:

Statement on the Wisconsin Stabbing

June 3, 2014 at 3:08 AM



Iíve recently been alerted to the horrific events that took place in Wisconsin.

Iíve received both messages of concern and blame, and while it seems that the Creepypasta Wiki is bearing the brunt of media attention and finger-pointing, I feel itís necessary for me to make a statement.

First and most importantly, my condolences go out to all the families involved. I cannot even imagine how painful and confusing and awful this has to be for them. I donít have children, but I can imagine how my mother would feel if something like this happened to me, and it absolutely breaks my heart to even consider her having to go through that. The families of the young ladies who committed this crime also have my heart going out to them Ė I know this canít be easy for them as well, and Iím sure theyíll have to deal with mistargeted backlash and anger even while they try to get through such a trying time themselves. So when I say that I extend my deepest sympathies and my prayers to those affected, I hope that you understand that I mean it. I know that words can seem hollow or come off as mere lip-service to the cynical, but itís the truth.

Of course, the next thing I want to talk about is this site and the creepypasta phenomenon at large as Iím sure that many people are here because they want to know precisely what is being blamed for this event.

Creepypasta comes from the word copypasta, which itself is a play on the ďcopy and pasteĒ function. They were short, creepy stories that people spread around the internet for fun. This website is one of the many Creepypasta communities that accept submissions; people write their paranormal stories, I read them and decide which ones I personally like enough to post, and visitors read them and post comments Ė usually from the perspective of how the author can improve as a writer. I think that, more than other Creepypasta websites, we focus more on being a writerís community. We have a spin-off site dedicated to getting feedback (donít use so many ellipses, please donít write romance stories about serial killers, please remember to proofread Ė that sort of thing) for authors who ask for blunt community critique and I try to do community promos for writers who self-publish or work on other projects like movies, anthologies, comics, and so on.

Creepypasta is not solely dedicated to horror and murder or revenge fantasies, despite what some media outlets claim. They come up, of course Ė but so do ghosts, zombies, angels, mythology, urban legends, conspiracies, lost civilizations, aliens and sci-fi, vengeful deities, as well as real-world struggles, sorrows, and dangers. Itís a wide umbrella of inspiration, to be sure, but Iím sure that anyone who has ever browsed the horror or paranormal or sci-fi sections of a library or bookstore has noticed just how vast the possibilities are within those genres.

I think that most of you will understand when I say itís hard to justify pinning blame on an entire genre of writing. Unless youíre okay with blaming the worldís ills on Stephen King or H.P. Lovecraft, I donít believe that it makes sense to say paranormal writing or an interest in the macabre should be blamed or even used as an indicator of a ďsickĒ person (as a few emails have already felt the need to call both myself and all the authors here). The human race has long held and encouraged a fascination with things that go bump in the night.

So while I understand and accept that some people will blame us as a way to channel their anger and grief, I simply cannot agree. While I cannot speak for the owners and operators of the hundreds of wikis, websites, and YouTube channels that exist in the Creepypasta fandom, I believe that the community members here are aware that as the admin of this specific website, I truly care about the people who visit this website. Itís for that reason that Iíve tried to take steps to keep this from becoming a mere shock site and turn it into a place where we could foster the interest of reading and writing. Obviously, we cater to people who find interest in the paranormal and all the weird and creepy things that exist in the universe, but I believe placing blame solely on an interest in reading/writing about horror, paranormal, myths, urban legends, etc for a tragedy would be off the mark. Hundreds of thousands of people read scary stories, play horror video games, watch TV shows about ghost-hunting and all other varieties of the macabre and creepy (Hannibal and Dexter come to mind as recent wildly-popular shows that one could argue romanticized killing far more than this site ever could) and if we could truly blame any violent crimes solely on one specific form of entertainment as the trigger Ė well, I suppose it would be a relief as weíd be able to expunge said cause and clear the world of such awful happenings.

However, the fact of the matter is it canít be that simple. Most people donít watch Hannibal and turn into serial killers. The popularity of the Paranormal Activity franchise did not cause a spike in violent crimes. I play Skyrim as a pickpocketing rogue, but Iíve never so much as stolen a pack of gum, nor have I murdered anyone. You can insert countless examples here of people enjoying popular culture without acting it out in real life, so I hope that you see my point.

This isnít to say that I believe that anything goes with regards to entertainment. Iíve mentioned it quite often in the comments here, as well as in the FAQ and on our writing review sister site, but I do draw the line with what Iím willing to accept and post as entertainment on my website. Iíve tried to contact writers who sent in things that troubled me Ė particularly teens who were clearly writing out their own unhealthy, violent revenge fantasies Ė and tried to direct them to websites or hotlines where they could find someone to talk to if they were having trouble. For the sake of both my own sanity and that of my readers, I have policies about flat-out rejecting things that I believed glorified abuse or suicide. I know that we live in a culture where, for example, sexual violence is considered so entertaining that one of the top-rate TV shows is entirely dedicated to a new assault every week (Law & Order SVU) and I believe it would be dishonest to say that things like that donít contribute to people becoming desensitized. We recently had a conversation in the comments about ďfridgingĒ women in stories Ė the tendency for authors to violently kill off a woman in order to give a male character a backstory or motivation Ė and I absolutely believe that such a phenomenon, for example, does betray the internalized misogyny that tends to be prevalent in entertainment. I know that Iíve derailed a bit, but I suppose my point here is that I do believe any entertainment creators do have a responsibility to look at their work and decide what attitudes theyíre normalizing or even promoting. So please donít take what Iím saying here as my dismissing entirely any concerns about the premise of this website!

In this specific scenario, Iíll be honest: I have tried to keep Slenderman stories limited here. Iím aware that he and Jeff the Killer have become absurdly popular recently, with fans expanding upon their origins (in Slendermanís case, he was created on the SomethingAwful web forums many years ago in an attempt to cooperatively create new folklore Ė an experiment that has apparently been quite successful). Stories about Slenderman and his proxies are not the central focus of this website. I am not intimately familiar with all the various additions and expansions to his ďlegendĒ that have cropped up all over the internet Ė to be frank, I did not find him particularly interesting and as such Iím really not going to be very helpful with explaining the details of his popularity and stories to all the people who most certainly have questions. I know that might seem ridiculous given that I run a website dedicated to a meme thatís become Ė for some Ė synonymous with Slenderman, but itís the truth. Iíve been trying to encourage writers here to break out from the serial killers and Slenderman cliches that tend to overrun the Creepypasta fandom, though my motivation was less that I believed Slenderman was harmful (the Jeff the Killer fangirls and spin-offs, I did find somewhat troubling Ė Iíve mentioned before that I feel romanticizing serial killers is not really something I feel comfortable with promoting via publishing all the Jeff love stories and self-inserts that people tried to submit; the only Jeff spin-off I did let through was one that I felt had a decidedly non-romantic view) but more because I view this website as a place for people to become better writers and readers. You can visit the post where I talked about wanting to start an Ďinspirationí book club to spur originality and creativity in our writers (via reading stories about things like the women who successfully climbed K2 and what that sort of experience both required from them as people as well as giving the readers exposure to the fascinating world of mountaineering), or maybe some of the comments where Iíve scolded kids for not wanting to improve their vocabularies. Iíll admit it: I have an agenda here, and that agenda is to get people to read and write!

But if I may be so bold, I donít believe that itís the fault of Slenderman or horror writing in general that this happened. I remember reading scary stories and watching slasher movies when I was a child and young teenager and while they certainly gave me nightmares, they did not instill within me a desire to murder my friends. For someone to make the jump from reading a creepy story that is Ė at least on this website, once again, I canít speak for all creepypasta websites Ė being presented as 100% fiction into actually using it as a motive to plot and murder another human being Ė something else has to be going on there.

We live in a culture with a very unhealthy relationship with mental illness. People with mental health issues are frequently dismissed (people who deal with anxiety, depression, etc have almost certainly experienced people telling them that their problems donít exist and that they should ďbootstrapĒ and just ďget over itĒ), shamed and bullied (consider Miley Cyrusí tweets where she mocked Sinead OíConner for acknowledging her own struggle with mental illness and asking for help), and often ignored or denied necessary treatment because people either choose to look the other way when they see symptoms or their attempts to help are met with resistance because the sufferer has internalized all the negative cultural messages about having and admitting to mental illness.

Iím not going to make any judgement here about the culpritís families, teachers, etc. I am obviously not privy to their daily lives and interactions and I donít believe that the suffering families should have their privacy violated in order for the rest of the world to write pithy Facebook statuses about what the families should have/could have/would have done in their place.

My point here is just this: if you are finding yourself suffering from any sort of mental health issues Ė depressing, extreme apathy, anxiety, etc Ė and/or having trouble dealing with anger, violent/destructive impulses, self-harm, the desire to hurt others, and so on Ė please know that there is no shame in admitting this to people and asking for help. Itís not fun to deal with issues like that, and you donít have to go it alone. There are so many people out there who wonít judge you or hate you for having problems and will do their best to help you find the treatment that will help you feel better! Sometimes itís enough just to have someone who cares enough to listen so that you donít have to bottle everything up. Some issues are caused by simple chemical imbalances Ė nothing you could possibly be blamed for Ė and finding the right medication and/or therapy under the guiding hand of a trained professional will help so much that you find yourself feeling like the weight of the world has lifted from your shoulders. Disordered thinking can be terrifying and stressful and I just want to reiterate: if you think you might be suffering from any sort of mental health issue, know that you are not alone and that you can find help. I encourage you to take that step and talk to your parents, a guidance counselor, your favorite teacher, your doctor, a friend that you trust, family members, even a friendís parent if you donít feel comfortable talking to your own Ė reach out and do your best to find the right solution for YOU. Donít worry about the people who think mental illness is a joke or not real; theyíre not the ones who matter in this situation Ė YOU DO. Your mental health is of higher importantance than the other peopleís ignorance!

If youíre worried that someone you know may be suffering from such issues, please talk to them. Many mental illness sufferers do so in silence because they feel too suffocated by the cultural stigma surrounding therapy or counseling to take the step on their own. If youíre a parent, pay attention to and listen to your child. I know that, as adults, itís so easy for us to write things off as ďsilly teenage issuesĒ or ďphasesĒ that will pass, but itís important to remember that kids and teenagers are people too and not exempt from all the issues, problems and emotions that come with it. Make sure they know that they can come to you about anything Ė I remember having friends that were afraid to go to their parents when they were depressed because they thought theyíd get in trouble! If you believe that your child is having problems and is unwilling to talk to you, consider asking a trustworthy friend or theirs or a teacher that they trust to help look out for them. Basically, build a support network and make sure that itís functional so that people donít fall through the cracks when theyíre having problems.

For all the readers who are school-age, please do the same for your friends. If you have a friend who you feel might be suffering from disordered thinking Ė whether itís the extreme anger, racism and misogyny that the UCSB shooter displayed on YouTube or some friends that are so obsessed with Slenderman that they start talking about killing for him Ė please tell someone that you trust about it.

I suppose my overall message is this Ė look out for one another, and please donít partake in behaviors like shaming people for admitting to their problems or trying to get help. I also want to say that if I phrased anything here in a way that is offensive to people who suffer from mental illness, I apologize as that was not my intention Ė I am just struggling to clearly express how badly I want people who are hurting to get help and feel better.

Lastly, Iíll admit that my intention for this website was not to cater to young teenagers. I discovered Creepypasta right after highschool myself, and sort of assumed (and was backed up via Google analytics) that the audience here was generally highschool, college, and above. To me, I feel thatís an age range where reading creepy stories shouldnít really pose a problem Ė moreover, it seemed pretty normal as I remember lots of nights in highschool with a group of people watching scary movies together, or going camping and telling each other ghost stories. For me, that produced a lot of fun memories.

However, for the really young kidsÖ while I donít believe that creepy stories will cause them to become evil or sick, I do think it could scare them and/or make them very anxious! And if your child has issues with violent or destructive or depressive issues, itís really important to make sure that theyíre not interacting with things that will exacerbate that. Iíll quote the Chief involved with this case here, because I think he is completely right:

ďParents should not be allowing their children to have unrestricted or unmonitored internet usage Ėwhether it be on their computer on their smart phone on their PlayStation. All of those accesses to the outside world,Ē Chief Jack said.

I grew up when the internet was still pretty new, and I had safe browsing and not giving out information and all that hammered into my head from the time I was allowed to start logging on. My mother was also very vigilant about my internet use and paid a lot of attention to what I was doing online, who I was talking to, etc. I know that nowadays itís probably more difficult as so many more devices can connect to the internet beyond just computers, but itís still really important to pay attention to what your kid is doing online. Iím sure that Iíll have some community members calling me a traitor for this, but Iíve talked to quite a few of your concerned parents who found the site in their kidís browser history and, upon hearing their concern, I helped walk them through blocking this website. I donít take offense to a parent deciding that this website is inappropriate for their kid in any way Ė you know your children far better than I do, after all.

I know that a lot of parents arenít nearly as technology-adept as their kids, but here are some ways to make sure your kid doesnít visit specific sites that trouble you and/or how to check up on what your kids are doing on their phones/computer:

How to block a website @ DigitalTrends
Information about checking up on your kidsí activities online @ PCWorld

Of course, technology is always changing and if your kids are creative or savvy, they may find ways to get around the tactics outline in the above links. They are not magic bullets by any means; the best thing you can do is stay involved and pay attention.

Out of respect to the victim and so that this statement can stay at the top of the page, I will take a break from posting new stories for awhile. People who had their stories scheduled for the next few days will be contacted and alerted of the situation; they will be first in the posting queue when things have calmed down.

To answer some questions that Iíve received: I do not plan to shut down this website as I completely believe that we as a community arenít to blame here; further, Iíve received too many messages from readers, parents, and teachers who felt that this was a great place for age-appropriate reading and writing development to feel okay with stopping. For this reason, I do still plan to go ahead with the book club project this summer. If you plan on taking part in the book club aspect and youíre under 18, please do check with your parents to make sure theyíre okay with the various selections. So far the line-up consists of Into Thin Air by Jon Krakauer (with Savage Summits by Jennifer Jordan as secondary choice for people who have already read Into Thin Air or people who want to read multiple books on the topic), The Mothman Prophecies by John A. Keel (secondary option TBA), and Cults, Conspiracies, and Secret Societies by Arthur Goldwag (secondary book to be TBA). I put these out there so that any concerned parents can look into them before deciding whether to allow their kids to take part in a summer book club/discussion with these books at the forefront. I think that most of these books should be okay for older teens on, but obviously that decision is really for the individual parents to make.

Additionally, I will be keeping comments closed on this post as well as taking the contact form offline for awhile. While I appreciate the supportive and concerned messages Iíve received so far, I hope that you will direct your positive thoughts, prayers and energies to the families involved in the actual incident. They deserve your empathy and support far more than I do. And please, please, please do not do anything that will increase their suffering via trolling or nasty comments Ė this is not an us against them battle. Even if you feel loyalty to this website or the creepypasta genre overall, keep things civil and respectful wherever you discuss this awful situation and donít lash out at the victims because you feel that something you love is under fire. Iíve tried my best to keep the comments here a bullying-free zone and I hope you all know how much I would disapprove if any of you treated this event like a joke or an excuse to troll/harass people who are just trying to figure out why such a terrible thing happened. People will disagree and believe that this website did absolutely cause the attack, but just because you disagree with someone it doesnít make it okay to troll them. I know I sound preachy here, but given some of the attempted comments that Iíve seen already, clearly some of you need a reminder that itís not okay to behave like that.

The website may experience outages due to the higher traffic caused by the media reports, as to be frank we were already operating on the very edge of what our hosting plan allows for even before the increased attention. Please know that Iím not trying to pull a PUAHate-style scrub-and-deny if this happens; I think itís important that people are able to see that Creepypasta isnít actually a group of murder-promoting serial killer fetishists or a Slenderman cult in the hopes that, for once, people will pay attention to the actual issues surrounding this tragedy (given how much misogyny/rape culture has been downplayed in media coverage of the Elliott Rodger case or rock music and video games frequently became hot topics in the wake of school shootings rather than mental health and gun accessibility, such misdirection is unfortunately something that will almost certainly happen) rather than finding something else to blame so that they can bury their heads about the larger societal issues that these ever-increasing occurrences imply.

Once again, the families of those affected have my thoughts and prayers, and I hope that you will all join me in extending your sympathy, empathy and respect to them in their time of need and beyond.

Nazbaque
06-03-2014, 04:29 PM
Well mainly this is another case of shit happened and it has to be someone's fault. There is something in human beings that keeps insisting that the world is organized rather than chaotic. So everything has to be someone's fault and as the modern western culture is practically build from the mindset that no one has to be responsible for anything, no one actually believes themselves to be guilty of anything as a result of neglect. All bad things are someone else's fault and they meant to do it.

My thoughts in short:

1) Sometimes things happen for so many different reasons added together that it ends up being either everyone's fault or no-one's.

2) A great many things could be diverted if people were willing to take responsibility for more than just themselves. Yes you can point out that the problem is that some people refuse to even be responsible for themselves, but it is in truth a combination of the two.

DahLliA
06-04-2014, 05:02 AM
My 2 cents:

You can't stop doing stuff on the internet because some crazy person might wander in and decide to kill someone.

Just as you can't make video games illegal just because some lunatic decides to start shooting people.

The only people at fault here are the two girls and maybe their parents. I don't have kids myself and I plain suck at interacting with kids, but I would think that the parents should notice something before the stabbing starts.

GonzoTheGreat
06-04-2014, 05:07 AM
Solution to this: do not ever allow people to meet other people.
Short of that, all that can be done is try to minimize this kind of thing; total prevention is not possible.

If it hadn't been the Internet which brought these two wackos together, then it could have been a Bible Study Group, or a moonshine production club, or whatever other reason for exchanging prejudices* people can come up with.

* Note: I suspect that not quite all moonshine lore is a matter of prejudice, that some of it has some foundation in reality. I'm not actually sure of that, though.

Ishara
06-04-2014, 08:29 AM
I think that overall, the internet is a beautiful place, and for me, the good far outweighs the bad. Eevn if we just limit it to *this* site, we have had couples who never would have otherwise met, get married and have babies. There are new human lives walking around on this very Earth, because of the internet - and Tam.

How can that be anything but beautiful?

Davian93
06-04-2014, 08:49 AM
Maybe 12 year olds shouldnt have unmonitored internet access...maybe their parents should, I dont know, actually parent.

Uno
06-04-2014, 08:51 AM
Maybe 12 year olds shouldnt have unmonitored internet access...maybe their parents should, I dont know, actually parent.

Maybe, but if you discover that your kid is reading what are essentially ghost stories online, do you automatically conclude that there's something amiss?

Davian93
06-04-2014, 09:05 AM
Maybe, but if you discover that your kid is reading what are essentially ghost stories online, do you automatically conclude that there's something amiss?

Probably not but I'd imagine that's not all they were up to and it really sounds like some absentee parenting was occuring.

Would it have prevented this? Maybe, maybe not. Sometimes kids are just fvcked up in the head regardless of what you do. I simply dont understand giving a 12 year old (and younger) child unfettered access to the internet.

Uno
06-04-2014, 09:15 AM
Probably not but I'd imagine that's not all they were up to and it really sounds like some absentee parenting was occuring.

Would it have prevented this? Maybe, maybe not. Sometimes kids are just fvcked up in the head regardless of what you do. I simply dont understand giving a 12 year old (and younger) child unfettered access to the internet.

Myself, I can't imagine that twelve-year-olds are still unable to distinguish between fantasy and reality. It's been a quarter of a century since I was twelve, of course, but I really thought kids that age had a modicum of sense. Admittedly, I know very few children.

GonzoTheGreat
06-04-2014, 10:06 AM
Myself, I can't imagine that twelve-year-olds are still unable to distinguish between fantasy and reality.
Some Creationists and some Global Warming deniers are adults, which (supposedly) means that they are older than 12. So age is no bar to credulity.

Sei'taer
06-04-2014, 10:26 PM
When I was twelve we were all going to die in a nuclear war.

All I wanted to do was see real live boobies. Killing someone was not on the list, as far as I can remember.

GonzoTheGreat
06-05-2014, 04:31 AM
All I wanted to do was see real live boobies. Killing someone was not on the list, as far as I can remember.
I suspect it's a bit different for girls.

fdsaf3
06-05-2014, 01:34 PM
Myself, I can't imagine that twelve-year-olds are still unable to distinguish between fantasy and reality. It's been a quarter of a century since I was twelve, of course, but I really thought kids that age had a modicum of sense. Admittedly, I know very few children.

Maybe a good first step is to stop generalizing everything to the point of useless abstraction. Do some 12-year-olds fail to recognize the difference between reality and imagination? Sure. Do most children fail do to so? I don't have empirical evidence to support my claim, but I doubt it.

When tragedies happen, a lot gets said about how various categories of people (young, male, white, whatever) participate in or enjoy various activities (music, video games, whatever), and somehow, because that individual did something atrocious, the specious conclusion is drawn that those activities are contributing to the accelerating decline and collapse of modern society.

It's bullshit.

Individuals with individual problems do atrocious things. That's true. Maybe our society could (or should?) do a better job monitoring these people and helping them. That might be true as well. But, in my opinion (and I'm not a sociologist, psychologist, or any other -ologist), drawing conclusions from isolated acts of individuals with significant mental and emotional problems is pointless.

Figbiscuit
06-10-2014, 08:29 AM
I suspect it's a bit different for girls.

Not all girls.

Also, I don't have an informed opinion on what happened, but I treat the internet like don't choose to look at something and then complain when it offends you. Maybe this website was an aid to kick off whatever these girls did, but as has been said, they're 12. Maybe they shouldn't have had unlimited access to the internet, maybe the parents should have been more informed about what their kids were browsing. Maybe it's not that simple, and that's why there are huge campaigns about promotion of internet safety. Maybe it's just the way humanity is heading.

yks 6nnetu hing
06-10-2014, 09:25 AM
I actually read the entire post; some thoughts:

1. while certain content is meant for a certain age group, and even if you put verification procedures on your site to ensure no 12-year-old would accidentally stumble across something they're not supposed to... I happen to know from experience that nothing will stop a clever 12-year old. Still, it would probably be a good idea - and perhaps this is already done, it wasn't clear from the post - if Creepypasta were to put up a minimum age range (say, 16 or something) - just to alert the kids and their parents were at least more aware.

2. I find it very generous that he's helped concerned parents block his own website. And that he posted a general link for anyone interested to do just that.

3. People do REALLY BAD things for seemingly no reason at all sometimes. We like to rationalize and categorize but at the end of the day, if someone wants to commit murder, they'll find a way.

4. What Ishara said. I used to catch the occasional Dr. Phil show and was always amazed at the horror stories regarding "strangers you meet on the Internet". This is diametrically opposite from my own experience. I mean, sure there are creeps everywhere. But really, the chances of meeting one online are just as big as the chances of meeting one offline. Just... don't be naÔve and gullible, use your brain and you'll be fine. Seriously, some people get ripped off just walking down the street (my uncle. ahem.)

5. "scolded kids for not wanting to improve their vocabularies" Good.

6. tangent, but I found the point about "fridging" females interesting. Particularly considering the recent misogynous shooting.

Davian93
06-10-2014, 09:52 AM
But really, the chances of meeting one online are just as big as the chances of meeting one offline. Just... don't be naÔve and gullible, use your brain and you'll be fine. Seriously, some people get ripped off just walking down the street (my uncle. ahem.)

I think the problem is that lots of people simply dont have brains. Think about the average person and how stupid they are...then realize that 50% of people are dumber than that. (thank you George Carlin).

The funny/sad thing about dumb people is that they don't think they're dumb. They think they're just as smart if not smarter than anyone else as they simply cannot comprehend what it means to be smart. I'd imagine the average IQ/percentile score on TL is significantly above average (probably in that 130-150 range most likely) so we dont really have a ton of "dumb" people here and it shows.

But people be dumb...really, really, dumb.

yks 6nnetu hing
06-10-2014, 10:07 AM
(probably in that 130-150 range most likely) I'm 115. Though, to be fair, if they'd calculated only with my arithmetic score I'd be about 40. Seriously, the examiner looked at me and said "how do you FUNCTION?"

The trick is: know what you don't know. Then again, most people don't know or - even worse - won't admit what they don't know and that tends to complicate things.

But people be dumb...really, really, dumb.
agreed.

Davian93
06-10-2014, 10:33 AM
115 puts you ahead of 84.1% of people on the bell curve....so think about that. You are smarter than 4 out of every 5 people around you and by a pretty big margin a lot of the time.

Scary, eh?

yks 6nnetu hing
06-10-2014, 10:36 AM
115 puts you ahead of 84.1% of people on the bell curve....so think about that. You are smarter than 4 out of every 5 people around you and by a pretty big margin a lot of the time.

Scary, eh?

3+5= pink because aliens up sunflower

Yes, it's terrifying.

Nazbaque
06-10-2014, 11:05 AM
Well the IQ system isn't exactly a reliable way of comparison among us since we are a multinational group. Mine is 135 (>99%) by finn mensa standards. Is it indicative of better or worse intelligence than the same score in other countries and by how much? Then there is the whole efficiency vs. actual time in use question. IQ tests only measure the former.

Still I do think that everyone here is of well above avarage intelligence. Sometimes your beliefs are naive or overly cynical, a few of you are real idiots at times and I myself can be huge jerk when I feel like it, but I never think of any of you as unintelligent. As for the question of ranking, I consider myself intelligent enough to take other intelligent people seriously be they more or less intelligent than myself.

GonzoTheGreat
06-10-2014, 12:27 PM
The funny/sad thing about dumb people is that they don't think they're dumb. They think they're just as smart if not smarter than anyone else as they simply cannot comprehend what it means to be smart. I'd imagine the average IQ/percentile score on TL is significantly above average (probably in that 130-150 range most likely) so we dont really have a ton of "dumb" people here and it shows.
Nitpick: I've known a guy who showed that even with a 140+ IQ (he became a Mensa member while I knew him) it is possible to be quite dumb in some (maybe many, didn't know him that well to say one way or another) ways. I let him borrow a von Dšniken (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Von_Dšniken) book, and in hindsight that wasn't particularly smart. It took me a few weeks to point out enough weak spots to make him start to doubt the accuracy of the ideas from that book.

Nazbaque
06-10-2014, 12:41 PM
Nitpick: I've known a guy who showed that even with a 140+ IQ (he became a Mensa member while I knew him) it is possible to be quite dumb in some (maybe many, didn't know him that well to say one way or another) ways. I let him borrow a von Dšniken (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Von_Dšniken) book, and in hindsight that wasn't particularly smart. It took me a few weeks to point out enough weak spots to make him start to doubt the accuracy of the ideas from that book.

This would be one of those quality of brain vs quantity of use situations.

Daekyras
06-16-2014, 06:32 AM
I don't think IQ really comes into a situation like this.

My IQ is relatively high but I must admit that in some areas I feel like a complete idiot. That's genuine by the way.

Maybe its my scientific leanings that account for it but a lot of philosophy just goes over my head. Oh sure, I can learn off neat little responses and talk the good talk about various things but I simply don't understand what I am talking about.

Once I had a twenty minute debate with a dean of Philosophy in my college about Thomas Aquinas. Afterwards, he told a mutual friend that he couldn't decide if I was a genius or a retard!

What has this got to do with the OP you may ask- well, it is very relevant. Being intelligent doesn't stop the internet from "making" you do things.

The Internet does not "make" you do anything.

Reading stories or looking at images do not "make" you do bad things.

What these girls did was horrible. What they had been reading and writing was horrible also but the real question here is not where did they get the idea from but:

"why did they feel they were justified in what they did?"

That is not the nets fault. That is not creepypasta's fault. It is the fault in the girls themselves and the parenting and education processes that led to that point.

yks 6nnetu hing
06-16-2014, 07:47 AM
I don't think IQ really comes into a situation like this.

My IQ is relatively high but I must admit that in some areas I feel like a complete idiot. That's genuine by the way.

Maybe its my scientific leanings that account for it but a lot of philosophy just goes over my head. Oh sure, I can learn off neat little responses and talk the good talk about various things but I simply don't understand what I am talking about.

Once I had a twenty minute debate with a dean of Philosophy in my college about Thomas Aquinas. Afterwards, he told a mutual friend that he couldn't decide if I was a genius or a retard! true enough. My abysmal arithmetic ability is balanced by a better than average spatial reasoning and logical reasoning ability. I'm also fairly good with abstracts - so for example, I can do logarithms or calculate vectors because those are more spatial and logical than arithmetic concepts.

What has this got to do with the OP you may ask- well, it is very relevant. Being intelligent doesn't stop the internet from "making" you do things.

The Internet does not "make" you do anything.

Reading stories or looking at images do not "make" you do bad things.

What these girls did was horrible. What they had been reading and writing was horrible also but the real question here is not where did they get the idea from but:

"why did they feel they were justified in what they did?"

That is not the nets fault. That is not creepypasta's fault. It is the fault in the girls themselves and the parenting and education processes that led to that point.

Definitely.