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Davian93
10-19-2015, 06:30 AM
In Canada at least. Apparently, they are heavily expecting Harper to lose (which is just sad)...and some guy named Trudeau to become PM. I am proud that our northern neighbors have not fallen into the trap that the US often goes into with political dynasties. This Trudeau fella seems like a self-made man who has done it all on his own.

My only knowledge of the race was the epic campaign commercials I saw while on holiday on PEI last July so that was fun. Apparently, per the commercials, Trudeau is young, likes legalized pot and has good hair or something.

So, clearly qualified.

Khoram
10-19-2015, 08:10 AM
Harper better lose. 10 years of his being PM is way too long. Mulcair just bothers me - maybe it's the way that, during the debates, he would always look into the camera, no matter who was talking. It was almost like he wouldn't acknowledge the other leaders. I don't understand why Duceppe came back. He retired, and yet because the Bloc didn't have a leader, he chose to come back, which i really don't understand.

And yeah, Trudeau has great hair. Ergo, he should win. :D

connabard
10-19-2015, 09:18 AM
At this point, anyone would be better than Harper.

And all elected government officials should be chosen by how handsome they are, and great hair is a large part of that.

GonzoTheGreat
10-19-2015, 09:53 AM
Can't the Canadians simply elect Trump, or do they also have such a silly "you must (not) be born in Hawaii" type rule?

Davian93
10-19-2015, 10:35 AM
At this point, anyone would be better than Harper.

And all elected government officials should be chosen by how handsome they are, and great hair is a large part of that.

But the Conservative commercials told me he's just not ready?!?

They wouldn't lie!

connabard
10-19-2015, 01:35 PM
Can't the Canadians simply elect Trump, or do they also have such a silly "you must (not) be born in Hawaii" type rule?

No, but we do have a rule as I just learned from John Olivers LWT, that no one who is not Canadian is allowed to incite Canadians to either vote or not vote, and can be subject to a penalty of either a $5,000 fine, or 6 months jail time, or both.

Which is hilarious

Khoram
10-19-2015, 01:36 PM
Which hair would you prefer? Trudeau's? Or Trump's?

Terez
10-19-2015, 03:34 PM
No, but we do have a rule as I just learned from John Olivers LWT, that no one who is not Canadian is allowed to incite Canadians to either vote or not vote, and can be subject to a penalty of either a $5,000 fine, or 6 months jail time, or both.

Which is hilarious
Isn't your election committee or whatever you call it not allowed to incite Canadians to vote? One of my Canadian friends has been posting about that on Facebook for months. "Since they aren't allowed to remind you to vote, I will!"

Rand al'Fain
10-19-2015, 06:50 PM
But who do you vote for when you don't like any of the (incompetent) candidates?

ShadowbaneX
10-19-2015, 07:00 PM
The Liberals since they're the closest to center (and there's also Justin's hair).

Kimon
10-19-2015, 08:58 PM
The Liberals since they're the closest to center (and there's also Justin's hair).

Looks like things are going well for the Liberals so far.

It is somewhat sad from an outsider's perspective that Canada can split the vote between two left of center parties and still stand a good chance of beating the right - even if, as during the past decade, not always. If we had both Hillary and Bernie running as two separate parties against the Republicans, the right would be both ecstatic and guaranteed a victory. It is somewhat amusing that Canada has the same issue in its plains as we do in ours. Although I've never gotten the impression that Manitoba, Saskatchewan, or Alberta are anywhere near as hillbilly or biblethumpy as all of our south and prairies.

Edit:

CBC is already projecting a Liberal government.

Khoram
10-19-2015, 10:29 PM
https://i.imgur.com/4BXBqGo.png

Terez
10-19-2015, 10:45 PM
Looks like things are going well for the Liberals so far.
Only 14 seats from an outright majority. Yay Canada.

Khoram
10-19-2015, 11:00 PM
Now... The question that is on everybody's mind: can I finally get into the military? XD

Terez
10-19-2015, 11:22 PM
Looks like it's done. And Harper is resigning altogether.

ShadowbaneX
10-19-2015, 11:25 PM
Now... The question that is on everybody's mind: can I finally get into the military? XD

More important question: just how awesome was that Star Wars trailer? This will rival the Matrix for most times watched in the theater.

Oh, and the Jays won...yay...I suppose.

Additionally, ding dong the witch is dead.

As for the plains being bastions of Conservative thought, well, lots of rural/agrarian types...and oil to boot in Alberta. They don't have Bible belt levels of zealotry, but they are probably more religious than the other parts of the country.

Great Lord of the Dark
10-19-2015, 11:34 PM
Spent my last day working for the worst government ever. Tomorrow I start with a new worst government ever.
I love this game.

Brita
10-20-2015, 09:44 AM
My only major disappointment with the Liberal platform is that they aren't planning to scrap bill C-51. Otherwise I am pleased, and just forever thankful the Conservatives are no longer running the country.

I feel like for the first few terms of Harper's leadership he was held in check by virtue of a minority government, and we as a country didn't really understand what he was capable of. But with the past 4 years of majority rule his true platform was revealed: and boy was it un-Canadian! Environmental protections erased, racism encouraged, refugees abandoned, citizen rights eroded, the CBC gutted, First Nation issues ignored, Scientists muzzled... the list goes on and on. Big sigh of relief that he is gone and that some of the damage can hopefully be reversed. Trudeau has promised to reverse most of it (except for bill C-51), and I am hopeful he will. He has majority, so no excuses Justin ;)

GonzoTheGreat
10-20-2015, 11:06 AM
Are all male Canadians nowadays called "Justin"?
There's Bieber, Trudeau, and I wouldn't know of any counter-examples.

connabard
10-20-2015, 11:17 AM
My only major disappointment with the Liberal platform is that they aren't planning to scrap bill C-51. Otherwise I am pleased, and just forever thankful the Conservatives are no longer running the country.

I feel like for the first few terms of Harper's leadership he was held in check by virtue of a minority government, and we as a country didn't really understand what he was capable of. But with the past 4 years of majority rule his true platform was revealed: and boy was it un-Canadian! Environmental protections erased, racism encouraged, refugees abandoned, citizen rights eroded, the CBC gutted, First Nation issues ignored, Scientists muzzled... the list goes on and on. Big sigh of relief that he is gone and that some of the damage can hopefully be reversed. Trudeau has promised to reverse most of it (except for bill C-51), and I am hopeful he will. He has majority, so no excuses Justin ;)

I don't have any hope this stuff will change because Politicians never seem to make things better... but I can't imagine it getting any worse than it was with Harper

Davian93
10-20-2015, 11:55 AM
Are all male Canadians nowadays called "Justin"?
There's Bieber, Trudeau, and I wouldn't know of any counter-examples.

I'm pretty sure Khoram and SBX are also both named Justin. At least in my mind they are.


Congrats on knocking off Harper, Canadia. :)

Khoram
10-20-2015, 11:57 AM
I'm pretty sure Khoram and SBX are also both named Justin. At least in my mind they are.


Congrats on knocking off Harper, Canadia. :)

Sure. Whatever you want to believe, Dav. :rolleyes:

Davian93
10-20-2015, 01:48 PM
On a serious note, this election seems like a pretty massive landslide...akin to the 1996 UK election where Labour swept to power after over a decade of Tory rule. Looks like the Conservative party pretty much imploded.

ShadowbaneX
10-20-2015, 02:01 PM
I'm pretty sure Khoram and SBX are also both named Justin. At least in my mind they are.


Congrats on knocking off Harper, Canadia. :)

First off my name isn't Justin.
Second, random anecdote: my brother, who is also not named Justin, was given the nickname Justin at his former place of employment because someone there decided he looked like one...

ShadowbaneX
10-20-2015, 02:03 PM
Spent my last day working for the worst government ever. Tomorrow I start with a new worst government ever.
I love this game.

New day dawns...and it's worse than the one before. That said I think this new worst government is a better worst government ever than either Harper's or Mulcair's would have been, so there's that.

Nazbaque
10-20-2015, 02:11 PM
I'm pretty sure Khoram and SBX are also both named Justin. At least in my mind they are.


Congrats on knocking off Harper, Canadia. :)

Like lupus' real name is Sheila and Zombie Sammael's is Bruce?

Davian93
10-20-2015, 02:25 PM
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c7/Opinion_Polling_during_the_2015_Canadian_Federal_E lection.svg

Can any of the Canucks explain what caused the NDP to essentially collapse?

Was it Trudeau's hair?

Brita
10-20-2015, 02:33 PM
I am just stating a baseless opinion not rooted in any actual fact- but I honestly think the 70 % of Candadians that are considered progressive were so desperate to not split the Left Vote (and so desperate to vote Harper out) that a lot of people voted with whichever left sided party was ahead in the polls and thus the most likely to oust Harper.

The NDP had just won a surprising provincial victory in Alberta just before the election was called so left leaners turned their hopeful eyes to the orange. But it was an artificial peak, quickly giving way to the tried and true Liberal Party. We are not an adventurous lot (in politics anyway), and so it didn't take long for everyone to be convinced that the Liberals were our best chance. ABC: Anyone But Conservative.

Khoram
10-20-2015, 02:34 PM
I think that's the most plausible explanation (regarding Trudeau's hair). :p

Davian93
10-20-2015, 02:36 PM
From a political standpoint, how far apart are the Libs and NDP as parties? Why are they split in the first place?

Khoram
10-20-2015, 02:43 PM
I've never really given it much thought, but I'm pretty sure the NDP is slightly more left-leaning than the Liberals. What's funny is that Mulcair used to be a Liberal MP.

Kimon
10-20-2015, 03:56 PM
I've never really given it much thought, but I'm pretty sure the NDP is slightly more left-leaning than the Liberals. What's funny is that Mulcair used to be a Liberal MP.

Just seems impractical unless there are firm doctrinal differences. Many dems here really would prefer a Green or Socialist Party option, hence the level of support for Bernie, but still always vote dem (and hence why Bernie is running as a dem), as splitting the vote here guarantees victory for the other side. Hence Wilson getting elected when Teddy Roosevelt and Taft split the Republicans. Or Clinton when the Elder Bush and Perot split the conservative vote. It can happen here even when the split is minute - as when Nader siphoned off just 1-2% of Gore's vote, resulting in the Younger Bush's presidency.

This is also why we on the left all hope that the Tea Party will eventually go fullblown-crazy and split off from the Republicans...

Terez
10-20-2015, 04:33 PM
From a political standpoint, how far apart are the Libs and NDP as parties? Why are they split in the first place?
I believe the main difference is economic policy, though there is a lot of overlap. In most countries, "liberal" means neoliberal or libertarian on economic policy. That includes "free trade". One of the major policy differences between the Liberals and NDP in this election was TPP. Liberals support it; NDP opposes it. But naturally, only activists care about it.

Kimon
10-20-2015, 04:49 PM
I believe the main difference is economic policy, though there is a lot of overlap. In most countries, "liberal" means neoliberal or libertarian on economic policy. That includes "free trade". One of the major policy differences between the Liberals and NDP in this election was TPP. Liberals support it; NDP opposes it. But naturally, only activists care about it.

I'd consider myself liberal, and I oppose the TPP. I'm more concerned with protecting what little is left of American manufacturing and manufacturing jobs than exporting them for the sake of slightly cheaper products and slightly higher profits for corporations. And that doesn't strike me as an outlier position for a democrat. Opposition to free trade is quite widespread even amongst the elected dems, it is for instance why Obama needed the support of the republicans to pass it, as his own party, and most of their supporters, despise the free trade agreements. I just don't see it as reason enough to turn against the dems and vote for the Greens. Though I did come very close to voting for Nader over Gore for this and similar reasons. That election underscored the danger of voter purity. I'm less aligned with the dems than the Greens, but the Greens can't win.

Brita's explanation of what likely happened certainly makes sense, and seems a similar reaction to what happened here because of Nader, and why the Greens haven't been, nor likely ever will be a force here.

ShadowbaneX
10-20-2015, 05:17 PM
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c7/Opinion_Polling_during_the_2015_Canadian_Federal_E lection.svg

Can any of the Canucks explain what caused the NDP to essentially collapse?

Was it Trudeau's hair?

Nah, it was the Quebecois. In the last election French were pissed at both th Liberals and the Conservatives so they voted NDP en-mass. Someone went and got registered because a friend did and only found out the day after the electiom that she was now a Member of Parliament...she was the assistant manager at one of the bars at my alma mater. She didn't even speak French.

As for the difference between the Liberals and the NDP well, I'd say that the Liberals are more Centrist whereas the NDP is full left.

I suppose you could call the NDP is the mirror of the Republicans and the Liberals are the mirror of the Democrats.

Terez
10-20-2015, 05:22 PM
I'd consider myself liberal, and I oppose the TPP.
That's because you're an American liberal. We use the term differently than most countries. Or rather, we combine labor and/or socialist economic policies with liberal social policies. Canada's Liberals do that to an extent but they're liberal in the classical sense when it comes to things like free trade, and probably some types of regulatory practice. They're not nearly as neoliberal as our Republicans, who take things to extremes (i.e. all taxes are bad, all regulation is bad, all trade restrictions are bad, etc.). In other words, Canada is overall more labor/socialist than we are, so their Liberals aren't so liberal when it comes to economic policy.

Try to tell the average Republican they're a liberal, and they'll think you're stupid, but in that sense, it's true. Simpler to call it laissez faire economics (i.e. who are we to try to prevent the oligarchs from ruling the world; surely it will be better than government bureaucracy).

...I just don't see it as reason enough to turn against the dems and vote for the Greens. Though I did come very close to voting for Nader over Gore for this and similar reasons...
Well, our system isn't really comparable. If the Liberals hadn't gotten an outright majority, they could have formed a coalition government with the NDP to keep the conservatives out of power. We don't have that option. Of course, we also don't have the assurance that whoever is elected president will have Congress on their side; in Canada the boss is determined by who controls Parliament.

Brita
10-20-2015, 05:35 PM
Nah, it was the Quebecois. In the last election French were pissed at both th Liberals and the Conservatives so they voted NDP en-mass. Someone went and got registered because a friend did and only found out the day after the electiom that she was now a Member of Parliament...she was the assistant manager at one of the bars at my alma mater. She didn't even speak French.
.

That is part of it for sure, and Mulcair's totally reasonable and rational stance on the Niqab "issue" didn't help the NDP in Quebec- but that doesn't fully explain why they were leading at the beginning (which was long after the 2011 rebellion) and fell so far behind by the end.

yks 6nnetu hing
10-21-2015, 01:01 AM
Like lupus' real name is Sheila and Zombie Sammael's is Bruce?

and how you're called Pekka.

Nazbaque
10-21-2015, 04:39 AM
and how you're called Pekka.

As a matter of fact my first name happens to be very common in Finland, though it is not Pekka.

The Unreasoner
10-21-2015, 05:26 AM
As a matter of fact my first name happens to be very common in Finland, though it is not Pekka.

Suomi-sama?

yks 6nnetu hing
10-21-2015, 06:07 AM
As a matter of fact my first name happens to be very common in Finland, though it is not Pekka.

Let's see, what other Finnish guy's names do I know...

Kari?
Juha or Juho?
Kalle?
Jussi?
Eero?

ok, fine, I give up. Flarknargan. that's a good Nordic (in this case, Icelandic) name. you're Flarknargan Nazbaque

Nazbaque
10-21-2015, 08:15 AM
Let's see, what other Finnish guy's names do I know...

Kari?
Juha or Juho?
Kalle?
Jussi?
Eero?

ok, fine, I give up. Flarknargan. that's a good Nordic (in this case, Icelandic) name. you're Flarknargan Nazbaque

Amusingly enough you guessed my father's first name, Juha. My second name happens to be Juhani which is a variant of that. As for my first name I should say that its variants are common in a lot of European countries.

yks 6nnetu hing
10-21-2015, 08:33 AM
nah, Flarknargan, I already got it :D

ShadowbaneX
10-21-2015, 09:04 AM
That is part of it for sure, and Mulcair's totally reasonable and rational stance on the Niqab "issue" didn't help the NDP in Quebec- but that doesn't fully explain why they were leading at the beginning (which was long after the 2011 rebellion) and fell so far behind by the end.

Perhaps they thought Trudeau had a better chance to win. It doesn't matter what they thought they were going to do a couple of months ago. The reason why they fell off was because Quebec went red instead of orange. Why they went red is another matter though.

Davian93
10-21-2015, 09:13 AM
Perhaps they thought Trudeau had a better chance to win. It doesn't matter what they thought they were going to do a couple of months ago. The reason why they fell off was because Quebec went red instead of orange. Why they went red is another matter though.

Its the hair...

ShadowbaneX
10-21-2015, 09:26 AM
Its the hair...

It is very nice hair though.

Nazbaque
10-21-2015, 11:08 AM
nah, Flarknargan, I already got it :D

No it's... waiiiit a minute... yks, are you teasing me?

Brita
10-21-2015, 12:41 PM
It is very nice hair though.

Much nicer than his dad's.

Davian93
10-21-2015, 01:40 PM
Much nicer than his dad's.

Well, they say good hair skips a generation so his grandfather must have had really awesome hair.

Khoram
10-21-2015, 02:12 PM
This post is just a confirmation that I cannot confirm or deny the state of Justin Trudeau's grandfather's hair.

Terez
10-21-2015, 02:46 PM
Perhaps they thought Trudeau had a better chance to win. It doesn't matter what they thought they were going to do a couple of months ago. The reason why they fell off was because Quebec went red instead of orange. Why they went red is another matter though.
Because he has a French name?

ShadowbaneX
10-21-2015, 06:35 PM
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!


AH-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.


*ahem*cough*cough*


No (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FLQ).

Davian93
10-22-2015, 07:44 AM
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!


AH-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.


*ahem*cough*cough*


No (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FLQ).

So they went red because they knew that pissing off a Trudeau would end badly for them? Basically, the French surrendered en masse?

Which, really isn't too much of a stretch I suppose.

ShadowbaneX
10-22-2015, 07:50 PM
So they went red because they knew that pissing off a Trudeau would end badly for them? Basically, the French surrendered en masse?

Which, really isn't too much of a stretch I suppose.

I can't entirely speak to it, but I'm reasonably sure that they didn't elect the son of the guy that declared martial law in Quebec to put down a seperatist terrorist group because their surname is French.

Khoram
10-22-2015, 08:13 PM
It's clearly because of the hair. That's the only reasonable explanation for it.

I honestly can't say why there was such a big shift from orange to red. In my riding, we had an NDP candidate who won last election, and did very well for us. But this time through, it was a Liberal who got elected - whose son, funnily enough, I went to high school with. I haven't heard a good explanation for why we switched so quickly.