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Tamyrlin 11-01-2009 12:49 AM

Verin
 
Isa - I loved page 598 precisely because I had been speculating about Verin for over a decade...it never lessened the experience for me. Instead, it heightened it. Just like some people don't care about Asmodean, so the reveal for them will be "eh, oh". Whereas, those of us that have been tearing it apart, I imagine that will be quite the opposite.

Ivhon 11-01-2009 12:50 AM

I fully expect to read the ending and say "I knew it."

ShadowbaneX 11-01-2009 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamyrlin
"There is a very small detail in books 4-6, not sure which one that will end up playing a huge role in Towers of Midnight."

"...including one thing is secretly hidden in the books for books and books and books, and I haven't been able to find a hint that any of the fan communities have even gotten a whiff it..."

I almost think we've been going wrong already. It's a minor detail like the earring referenced, or the shape of someone's dress or eyes or something else fairly abstract, and with the emphasis (mine btw), it's something that we've seen more then once.

We've started with a few things that we haven't seen, but is there anything that's on that level, that's come up more then once?

Terez 11-01-2009 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isabel
Davian: This is a small change in what RJ normally said and did. There is a big chance if RJ would have written it, that he wouldn't have said that.
Which means we might guess part of the ending, because Brandon gave us a clue, RJ wouldn't have done.

Forgot the gasp moment already?

Davian93 11-01-2009 01:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terez
Forgot the gasp moment already?

Perhaps because it was the most meaningless "gasp" moment ever. Its not as if anyone gave a crap about the Amayor (?) anyway. Other than a lack of new Sea Folk Porcelin, who gave a crap if they all offed themselves.

Tercel 11-01-2009 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weird Harold
as cited at eWot:

LoC,Ch22 - Near the River Erinin, Chel Vanin and Mat find a burned Tinker camp with the people slaughtered. There is a message on a wagon, "Tell the Dragon Reborn."

This is the one mystery I can think of that doesn't get discussed much and what discussion there is devolves into "there's just not enough information."

I like! I think that is extremely possible to be what BS is referring to.

In the context not quoted above, Matt even thinks several rhetorical questions about what the message to the Dragon might have been and how Tinkers in the past had encountered important information, and he thinks it likely the Tinker had died before finishing writing the message. Logically though, it is unlikely the Tinker meant to write any more than what he did: If so we should expect the message to end half-way through a word or at a nonsensical stopping point.

So... Tinkers:
We know they used songs in the AoL to make plants grow. They currently search for a song. Also they have conveyed important messages at various points. eg IIRC they told Rand of a message from Jain Charin that Ishamael intended to blind the eye of the world, and the same message also from Aiel who had gone to fight the DO. Presumably Rand and his AoL memories now knows all the Songs that were used by the followers of the Way of the Leaf.

... but I can't see any connection between all of that and a dying tinker writing "tell the dragon reborn" in his own blood. We know that such a message wouldn't mean anything to Rand.

Terez 11-01-2009 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davian93
Perhaps because it was the most meaningless "gasp" moment ever. Its not as if anyone gave a crap about the Amayor (?) anyway. Other than a lack of new Sea Folk Porcelin, who gave a crap if they all offed themselves.

Well, it's not as if anyone figured it out. ;) Also, RJ said we didn't think it was a big deal because we are callous.

Belazamon 11-01-2009 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX
Speaking of using Need though, didn't Nynaeve and Elayne use Need in T'A'R to find something to fix the weather, but it originally took them to Tar Valon, but they knew that they didn't have access so they added the 'not in Tar Valon' clause? Could that be something? iirc, that topic hasn't been largely discussed.

What the hell, I'll throw my support behind this idea. That always did bug me, we never had enough information to really speculate on it, so every time it came up it was dropped pretty quickly.

Callandor 11-01-2009 01:42 AM

Tinkers are a good bet
 
I've always wondered about that Tinker caravan, but it was really a "huh, weird" instance, and then basically nothing.

Other things I can think of:

The sisters Siuan sent to re-capture Taim. Where the hell are they?

The rest of the Black Ajah that originally left the Tower? (Berylla Naron, Jeaine Caide, Rianna Andomeran are still missing.)

Who killed Sahra Covenry?

I would say that I don't think it has to be something that has been seen repeatedly. I just has to be something hidden for many books, by Brandon's wording.

Plus, isn't this a fun game by Brandon. "Yeah something from books 4-6." Let's see, that only covers from Rand taking the Stone till Dumai's Wells. Not like that covers three of the longest books in the series.

"I buried it in the sand." "Where?" "The Sahara, or maybe the Gobi, or maybe along the Pacific Ocean." Some hint!

If it is something that's been books and books, the Tinkers make damn good candidates.

http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/pimp.gif

Isabel 11-01-2009 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamyrlin
Isa - I loved page 598 precisely because I had been speculating about Verin for over a decade...it never lessened the experience for me. Instead, it heightened it. Just like some people don't care about Asmodean, so the reveal for them will be "eh, oh". Whereas, those of us that have been tearing it apart, I imagine that will be quite the opposite.

Tam: not exactly what i meant, what I am worried about ;)
Oh well ;) Have fun speculating.

Terez: the gasp moment was the consequense of the cleansing. It didnt have anything to do with the ending.

Lironah 11-01-2009 01:48 AM

Light burn me, I just found something. Might not be the piece in question, but...

LoC p. 183, paperback. Graendal meeting with Ituralde in Arad Doman. You know she wouldn't miss the chance to do something to him.

Terez 11-01-2009 01:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isabel
Terez: the gasp moment was the consequense of the cleansing. It didnt have anything to do with the ending.

If this is going to be in Towers of Midnight, then it won't either.

Terez 11-01-2009 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lironah
Light burn me, I just found something. Might not be the piece in question, but...

LoC p. 183, paperback. Graendal meeting with Ituralde in Arad Doman. You know she wouldn't miss the chance to do something to him.

Yeah, that has been discussed before. But this is only even a possibility if Graendal is by some miracle alive, and it's hard to see how it would have anything to do with the main plotlines in Towers of Midnight (Ghenjei and Black Tower).

greatwolf 11-01-2009 03:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamyrlin
"
Quote:

Originally Posted by BS
There is a very small detail in books 4-6, not sure which one that will end up playing a huge role in Towers of Midnight (might end up being in amol, but pretty sure he said ToM). This is on a scale (~example from Mistborn of a small detail~), with how that was such a minor detail touched on in book one, and ended up being the key detail that saved the day in the end. That kind of small detail

."

Well it seems he gave two search parameters here.
First, its not been covered in WoT discussions. (he's likely giving it away to enhance our enjoyment value - that might be another clue)

Second, it covers books 4-6 apparently. The wording here can easily be twisted, but we'll probably have to keep faith that in this he thought of what to say beforehand and he intended to give that clue away.

Third, it will affect the plotline of ToM in a very significant maaner. There are possibly three towers involved in ToM : The BT, the ToG and the Tower of Ravens.

Lastly, its a small detail.

So BS seems certain we can locate it with these clues. Shouldn't be too difficult too. Five or six years of discussion ought to do it. :)

E: BS's approach seems a bit different from RJ's. He's open without telling you anything. Its not wrong, its just different. And yes, we must accept that RJ is gone and BS is his own man. No less.

Enigma 11-01-2009 07:38 AM

This could be completly off base but when Mat & Rand used the twisted doorway in Tear to enter the lands of the Finns Moiraine specifically said that the presence of a Ta'veren was not a good idea and two Ta'veren were in serious danger of breaking the connection to the finn land. This was in Book 4.

Now if I'm not mistaken the pit of doom is somewhat removed from the real world, different sky etc. One might even say that the tunnel down to the pit of doom has the same function as the ter'angreal doorway. If you could get the three ta'veren there at the same time like say "three becomes one" might that not have some serious effect on the "tunnel" and remove the Do's ability to affect the world.

Why might it come out in the next book. When I beleive that Mat is over due to rescue Moiraine and she has something to tell Rand that is kind of important. Where has she been hanging out recently? In another dimension. Who better to know about bridges to another world and what can break them.

This could be completly crazy but we will see.

ShadowbaneX 11-01-2009 08:04 AM

not a bad idea Enigma, especially since the doorways also appear in book 5 and they might get a mention in book 6 as well. That fits our basic criteria.

Also, when looking at Towers we probably shouldn't dismiss the White Tower. I know that Midnight implies Black Towers, but the Tower of Ghenji is described as being gleaming Metal. Further, there's also the Seven Tower's of Malkier, and the Towers of Cairhien. Let's not ignore any Towers at this point as we might unintentionally ignore important information.

Jokeslayer 11-01-2009 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX
I almost think we've been going wrong already. It's a minor detail like the earring referenced, or the shape of someone's dress or eyes or something else fairly abstract, and with the emphasis (mine btw), it's something that we've seen more then once.

We've started with a few things that we haven't seen, but is there anything that's on that level, that's come up more then once?

I disagree with this. Look at the first quote in the first post, where it says "There is a very small detail in books 4-6, not sure which one". I think it's more likely BS just can't remember exactly where it crops up, and the "books and books and books" part just refers to the books that have passed since whatever it is was written.

So, plotlines that stretch from TSR to LOC might be a good place to start. Like if he remembers it's something the Wise Ones taught Egwene but can't remember when, so it could have been anywhere in those three books.

Anaiya Sedai 11-01-2009 08:55 AM

A couple of *small* things that came to my mind - don't ask me why, or what they might mean.

Herid Fell's note to Min: I can't remember which book we saw it in first, but it's small, and it keeps being mentioned, not just that Min is using it as bookmark, but also what it said. Maybe there's something there?

Something I saw in someone's signature here on TL, about the 'finn prophecy to Rand "to live you must die".. The 'finn speak the old tongue, which isn't exactly Rand's mothertongue. I like this idea because I noticed the death/Moridin thing on the Horn of Valere and was shot down for it, but what if Rand mistranslated their profecy a little, obviously not knowing about Moridin at the time?

*goes back to her crazy corner to work her shiney little brain* :D

ShadowbaneX 11-01-2009 09:05 AM

"to live you must become Moridin"? Interesting. Certainly a different way of looking at it.

1Powerslave 11-01-2009 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anaiya Sedai
A couple of *small* things that came to my mind - don't ask me why, or what they might mean.

Herid Fell's note to Min: I can't remember which book we saw it in first, but it's small, and it keeps being mentioned, not just that Min is using it as bookmark, but also what it said. Maybe there's something there?

Something I saw in someone's signature here on TL, about the 'finn prophecy to Rand "to live you must die".. The 'finn speak the old tongue, which isn't exactly Rand's mothertongue. I like this idea because I noticed the death/Moridin thing on the Horn of Valere and was shot down for it, but what if Rand mistranslated their profecy a little, obviously not knowing about Moridin at the time?

*goes back to her crazy corner to work her shiney little brain* :D

Here comes my sig. :)
Yeah, a little crazy perhaps. But why not, I like it. Though one thing that might speak against it is that RJ was disgusted when proposed that "death took him" meant that Moridin killed Asmo. Still like my thought.
What I mean to suggest by my sig is that Rand was really told by the Finns that he needed to merge (what the earthquake removed) with Moridin.

Another suggestion to this great brainstorming thread is Moiraine's wishes from the Finn. Yes, I believe she got wishes. They are never discussed. Because 1) most people think she didn't get any wishes. 2) We have no way of knowing what she wished exactly.

But! We can speculate. And Moiraine is a soldier. The reason she stayed behind could be that she used all her wishes to support and help Rand. Such a wish could be a plot provoker in ToM.


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