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ShadowbaneX 11-02-2009 07:49 AM

not compulsion then, but something similar, something mind breaking. All this time with him doing stuff like this is a minor detail, the implication of which has largely been ignored.

One Armed Gimp 11-02-2009 09:20 AM

What about Avendesora? I could see the tree being something we glossed over. Oh wow, the Tree of Life, lets move on. Anyway, we know Avi is heading there, all signs point to a song being found and sung and I think Avendesora could play a big part in the fight against the blight. I can see it now, lines of weaponless Aiel, Tinkers and Ogier singing saplings to grow and fight the corruption of the blight.

bowlwoman 11-02-2009 10:06 AM

What about Min's viewings in the first chapter of TSR? Not all of those viewings dealt with the WT split and subsequent fighting. Sheriam's viewing of her face battered and bruised didn't come to fruition until much later in the series.

I've always wondered about the "apple-cheeked Accepted" that Min views right before Sheriam. It's most likely that she's Theodrin, from the description we get of her when she initially tries to help Nyn break her block:

Quote:

Originally Posted by TSR, Chapter 1
Another Accepted came to replace one already there, and to Minís eyes bars floated in front of her apple-cheeked face, like a cage.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoC, Chapter 8
Of course, the apple-cheeked Domani woman was not Aes Sedai. Back in the Tower, Theodrin would have been raised to the shawl already, but here she had been raised to something more than Accepted, less than a full sister.

Why are there bars in front of her face? We know that currently, as of TGS, she's missing along with the other AS from the Rebel camp on the BT mission. What if she's being held in some sort of prison by Taim and/or other Asha'man? Not sure what significance this would play, but it could point to exposing Taim and his cohorts, or it could be indicative that the A'M have some way to overpower a group of women channelers, because if Theodrin retained her ability to channel, why would she be imprisoned?

ShadowbaneX 11-02-2009 11:14 AM

I wonder if Aviendha will be the one to bring back singing after seeing/learning it after her trip through the glass columns.

WinespringBrother 11-02-2009 11:24 AM

Speaking of the corruption of the lands after Rand's first wound, were his followers also corrupted? It was at the same time that Masema became fanatical, and that may have only grown worse over time, spreading through the Dragonsworn.

Also, a small detail about the Tinkers may be the fact that they were on the way to see Rand in Cairhien when they were killed, since Mat was going the opposite direction south to Tear. And obviously, the message was such a small detail to Mat since it slipped his mind when Rand showed up to send him to Salidar.

Tree Brother 11-02-2009 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Callandor
Another bit from one of those chapters is something that would relate to the Finn: why the hell did Mat get the ashandarei?

As someone else pointed out, the ashandarei could simply be a sign of the bargain.
Quote:

Thus is our treaty written; thus is agreement made.
Thought is the arrow of time; memory never fades.
What was asked is given. The price is paid.
The I think the doorways themselves also represented the compact. I believe there was discussion that with the doorway destroyed, the 3 wishes agreement is no longer in effect. Which would mean bargaining would be more difficult.

ShadowbaneX 11-02-2009 12:48 PM

or in the alien minds of the *'finns somehow the ashanderai was part of one of the other wishes. Perhaps it somehow has to do with his life being free of Aes Sedai (although this could also be part of marrying Tuon, I doubt Seanchan attitudes towards channelers will change overnight, marrying her could very well be part of keeping his life free of Aes Sedai) or it could have something to do with the holes in his head being filled (his knowledge seemed to tell him how to best use the weapon) or just him getting out in some obscure way.

thisiscooling 11-02-2009 03:31 PM

is it possible?
 
that the detail has something to do with 13 black aes sedai turning someone?

its something that is mentioned over and over, but nothing has really come of that yet.

Terez 11-02-2009 03:35 PM

Nah, that was introduced in book 3. We're looking for something introduced in books 4-6.

Enigma 11-02-2009 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bowlwoman
Why are there bars in front of her face? We know that currently, as of TGS, she's missing along with the other AS from the Rebel camp on the BT mission.

Where were we told what AS from the rebels went to the Black Tower? I was not aware that Theodrin was one of those sent. I though she was suppost to be spying as an almost AS looking for a Sitter's protection, not off to bond dangerous Asha'man.

bowlwoman 11-02-2009 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enigma
Where were we told what AS from the rebels went to the Black Tower? I was not aware that Theodrin was one of those sent. I though she was suppost to be spying as an almost AS looking for a Sitter's protection, not off to bond dangerous Asha'man.

Yes, Egwene hears the news from Romanda:

Quote:

Originally Posted by TGS, Chapter 45
"Mother," Romanda said, "I have made the inquires you requested. There has been no contact with those sent to the Black Tower. Not a whisper."

"Does this strike you as odd?" Egwene asked.

"Yes, Mother. With Traveling they should have been there and back by now. They should have at least sent word. This silence is disturbing."

Disturbing, indeed. Even worse, that delegation contained Nisao, Myrelle, Faolain and Theodrin. Each of the women had sworn fealty to Egwene. An unsettling coincidence. The departure of Faolain and Theodrin was particulary suspicious. Supposedly, they had gone because they had no Warders, but the sisters in the camp didn't consider those two full Aes Sedai--though nobody would dare say such to Egwene directly.

Why those four, out of the hundreds of Aes Sedai in the camp, been placed in the delegation? Was it mere coincidence? It stretched plausibility. But what did it mean, then? Had someone intentionally sent away those loyal to Egwene? If so, why not send Siuan? Was this perhaps Sheriam's work? The woman had confessed to several things before her execution, but this hadn't been one of them.

Either way, something was happening with those Asha'man. The Black Tower would need to be dealt with.


Crispin's Crispian 11-02-2009 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX
or in the alien minds of the *'finns somehow the ashanderai was part of one of the other wishes. Perhaps it somehow has to do with his life being free of Aes Sedai (although this could also be part of marrying Tuon, I doubt Seanchan attitudes towards channelers will change overnight, marrying her could very well be part of keeping his life free of Aes Sedai) or it could have something to do with the holes in his head being filled (his knowledge seemed to tell him how to best use the weapon) or just him getting out in some obscure way.

I was going to say that the ashanderei has basically served its purpose in tying Mat to the Seanchan. However, since the Towers of Midnight are in Seanchan this might be relevant.

Enigma 11-02-2009 04:02 PM

I missed that in the first rush to finish the book. Must read it again a bit slower this time.

I wonder if the two leaders of the Hall sent Faolain and Theodrin into danger as they would see it at the BT as a reward for spying on them?

Trutino 11-02-2009 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tree Brother
As someone else pointed out, the ashandarei could simply be a sign of the bargain.


The I think the doorways themselves also represented the compact. I believe there was discussion that with the doorway destroyed, the 3 wishes agreement is no longer in effect. Which would mean bargaining would be more difficult.

It always just seemed like such an elaborate way to leave a note. Also a really nice present to give someone you just hanged. I don't know if the ashandarei is "the" detail, but if it is a sign of the bargain, I don't know why it had to be that particular gift. Why not a commemorative plaque? ;)

Crispin's Crispian 11-02-2009 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trutino
It always just seemed like such an elaborate way to leave a note. Also a really nice present to give someone you just hanged. I don't know if the ashandarei is "the" detail, but if it is a sign of the bargain, I don't know why it had to be that particular gift. Why not a commemorative plaque? ;)

They just had it laying around, and it was too tall for them to use effectively. In other words, Mat was re-gifted.

jana 11-02-2009 11:39 PM

Tam asked two questions for me tonite that I got while thinking of this thread.



1. Is anyone mindtrapped that we don't already know about?

I don't think the answer was recorded, but IIRC he said something like "RAFO, because something related to that comes into play later in the series"

and

2. Did Slayer enter ToG in tSR?

He replied that it's RAFO because it might be important later, and that he had to ask that specific question when he started writing the books.

Matoyak 11-04-2009 04:49 AM

When was the Ogier Book of Thingy mentioned? The one that has the theory about "taking the Ogier out of this world" floating around? Was that mentioned in books 4-6? I know it was brought up on TL, but it has been pretty much ignored for millennium.

Mat had it correct on the tinker thing, IMO. I think it was simply a tragic case of "death before important detail written down". There have been a few good cases of someone dieing before giving the final bit of info. (Harid Fel among them). Maybe we will find out what it was, but it won't be from where we expect.

Tinkers' song is a pretty good detail, but hardly hidden. It is mentioned in every book with a tinker in it, pretty much.

I'm leaning towards Ogier being a possible answer, whether my idea about their Book being correct or not. I think the last major Ogier thingy was in books 4-6. In an unrelated side-note, when did ole Loial last appear again and what was he doing?

Also, I think I got spoilerd on the Mistborn series while reading this thread. Damn.

Terez 11-04-2009 04:51 AM

I believe it has been verified that we are not on the right track.

Matoyak 11-04-2009 05:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terez
I believe it has been verified that we are not on the right track.

Who? There are lots of "we"s in this thread :p

Terez 11-04-2009 05:24 AM

We meaning everyone in this thread.


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