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-   -   The Faces of Nakomi (http://www.theoryland.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=4439)

Tamyrlin 11-04-2010 10:17 AM

Heh
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ArtK (Post 122226)
Based on her actions, Verin could well be a Hero of the Horn, if perhaps one not often heard of in stories.

Nakomi as Verin/Hero of the Horn...now that would be something.

Xelun 11-04-2010 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamyrlin (Post 122251)
Nakomi as Verin/Hero of the Horn...now that would be something.

Though there's really no way for Verin to be dead and thus back in T'A'R at the point when Aviendha runs into Nakomi.

Tamyrlin 11-04-2010 03:05 PM

Hah - oops
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Xelun (Post 122315)
Though there's really no way for Verin to be dead and thus back in T'A'R at the point when Aviendha runs into Nakomi.

I was responding more to the Verin/Hero, shouldn't have tagged Nakomi on there. :)

The Angry Druid 11-04-2010 04:49 PM

I'm with Terez, the part where Naomi says the has an issue with babbling sealed it for me.

Gandelail 11-07-2010 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamyrlin (Post 121693)
Linda (and anyone else) am I missing any other ideas as to Nakomi's potential identity?

You might as well throw Hoid in that list, Tam ;)

Tamyrlin 11-07-2010 11:31 AM

Actually forgot to mention that I asked
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gandelail (Post 123984)
You might as well throw Hoid in that list, Tam ;)

Brandon said no. :)

drakenwulf 11-07-2010 01:49 PM

arg... I had this really long post, which was rambling, then managed to clicky the wrong button. I've got a theory on this Nakomi thing. About how she is a manifestation of the pillars ter angreal thinga majig set in place by the aol/as. (beats on keyboard for deleting long post)

1Powerslave 11-07-2010 02:01 PM

My initial reaction was Forsaken out to put the Aiel against Rand, sow dissension among the Light. That is still my thought, however weak a plot I think that would be. Sadly. Weak because Avi is too easily manipulated for it to be any fun. Weak because, same old same old, just kill them already. That would do the greatest damage. ;)

Terez 11-07-2010 02:55 PM

A friend just sent me this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokomis

Interesting!

Tercel 11-07-2010 08:01 PM

When reading the book, at the start of the scene I was quickly convinced that Nakomi was Verin due to her mannerisms and personality.

Then as the scene progressed and Nakomi increasingly showed a sophisticated and complete comprehension of Aiel thinking and Aiel ways I began to doubt my belief that it was Verin. I know Verin lived in the Aiel camp for a long time, but Nakomi demonstrates a very very comprehensive understanding of Aiel thinking beyond what I would have expected Verin to have.

At the end of the scene I was thus left confused... was it Verin or wasn't it? And after reading this thread and the other Nakomi thread, I think the point "why would Verin care about the role of the Aiel after the last battle?" is a very good one. On the other hand, those who point to the phrasing of Nakomi's words about Rand being the Dragon rather than the Car'a'carn have a good point that this implies Nakomi isn't Aiel.

So I think it is either Verin or Amys, or there's some funky time-travel going on. At the moment all my money is on Verin.

Terez 11-07-2010 08:15 PM

Verin's motives need not be all that clear since we have only had 4 POVs from her in the entire series, none of them full chapters. Also, we do know that her very first conversation with an Aiel covered all of these points, so it's not all that unreasonable to assume that she had further thoughts on that point. She might have also gone through the Rings herself.

I believe that Verin's POV in the TPOD prologue fully supports the knowledge of the Aiel necessary to pull off this scene.

Davian93 11-07-2010 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terez (Post 124314)
Verin's motives need not be all that clear since we have only had 4 POVs from her in the entire series, none of them full chapters. Also, we do know that her very first conversation with an Aiel covered all of these points, so it's not all that unreasonable to assume that she had further thoughts on that point. She might have also gone through the Rings herself.

I believe that Verin's POV in the TPOD prologue fully supports the knowledge of the Aiel necessary to pull off this scene.

I think our options are either Verin or someone/something we've never seen before. The evidence points to Verin.

Tarion 11-07-2010 08:21 PM

If its Verin, is the meeting in T'A'R? Because there are several things going on that imply that the world is changing around Aviendha. Coals on the fire increasing in number, food cooking too quickly and then being better than stands to reason and perhaps even Aviendha's suspicions being dampened.

This could be explained by inverted weaves and hiding the ability to channel, but we've never seen anything from Verin to indicate she has those abilities, have we?

"I cannot answer your question, apprentice, for it is not my place to give this truth" makes me think something else is going on.

Anyway, I'm not necessarily set against it being Verin. I just think that if its Verin, I'd like to know some more about what's going on there.

Terez 11-07-2010 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarion (Post 124318)
If its Verin, is the meeting in T'A'R? Because there are several things going on that imply that the world is changing around Aviendha. Coals on the fire increasing in number, food cooking too quickly and then being better than stands to reason and perhaps even Aviendha's suspicions being dampened.

This could be explained by inverted weaves and hiding the ability to channel, but we've never seen anything from Verin to indicate she has those abilities, have we?

It's not confirmed, but Egwene lifted the restriction when Moghedien escaped in ACOS, and Cadsuane used those weaves when they captured Semirhage, so there's no reason to think she didn't know them. She was at least aware of their existence from the Cleansing when she faced Graendal.

Quote:

"I cannot answer your question, apprentice, for it is not my place to give this truth" makes me think something else is going on.
I figured that she was just making an excuse for not telling where she was from. She wants Aviendha to think she's Aiel, after all.

Terez 11-07-2010 08:59 PM

Another bit of evidence for Verin that didn't quite sink in until just now - when Nakomi showed up, Aviendha embraced the Source, and thought about how proud she was that she had done that instead of reaching for nonexistent spears. Then Nakomi made it clear that she meant no harm, and Aviendha felt foolish.

This is almost an exact mirror of the first time Egwene met Aviendha. Egwene embraced the Source, and Aviendha told her that they meant her no harm. Egwene felt foolish.

In both cases, the person making the assurances could channel, and in both cases, the defensive person was unaware that the other could sense her holding the Power.

It could work for any other channeling woman, but I think there is a certain amount of resonance for Verin, considering these early encounters with the Aiel who came to find Rand.

Davian93 11-07-2010 09:08 PM

I just read the section again...it definitely "feels" like Verin.

If one were to start a Faction (~coughs~, Terez, ~coughs again~), I would join.

Terez 11-07-2010 09:28 PM

Oh yeah, factions. *goes make*

Vicious Circle 11-07-2010 10:05 PM

Amys?
 
My initial thought was "It's Amys in a inverted Mirror of Mists". She told Avi which way to go, she knew what Avi"s mom liked to cook, since she was her sister. She may have deliberately changed her way of speaking, Dragon, not Car'a'carn, to keep Avi from recognizing her way of speaking, since they knew each other so well. Sounds like a Wise One may have known they needed her to go through twice and needed to give her hope to hang on to. This really doesn't sound so convoluted in my head.:)

Terez 11-07-2010 10:16 PM

It was Lian who was sister to Aviendha's mother. 'My sister-mother, Lian, is sister-wife to Amys.' I suppose I can see how that would be confusing.

To me, Amys seems more straightforward than that. She has no reason to think that a random woman in the Waste would get more respect from Aviendha than Amys herself.

thisiscooling 11-07-2010 10:45 PM

All I know is I highly doubt it is a random new person. I feel like it is way too late in the game to say "oh look some ancient aiel" or "look a hero we have never heard of"

If so then it is just unfair. :(


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