Theoryland of the Wheel of Time Forums

Theoryland of the Wheel of Time Forums (http://www.theoryland.com/vbulletin/index.php)
-   Non WoT Discussion (http://www.theoryland.com/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=77)
-   -   Penn State deserves the death penalty (http://www.theoryland.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=8865)

Kimon 05-05-2016 06:48 PM

Penn State deserves the death penalty
 
Joe Paterno knew about Sandusky in 1976.

http://www.pennlive.com/news/2016/05...e_paterno.html

Ivhon 05-05-2016 08:14 PM

At this point, the death penalty just punishes innocent people

Kimon 05-05-2016 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ivhon (Post 237618)
At this point, the death penalty just punishes innocent people

In terms of the current players, who have nothing to do with the wrong-doing, yes. But they can transfer and play somewhere else.

It is, however, very difficult to feel sympathetic to the university or its fans, when they still defend and lionize Joe Paterno. Or when they have continued to fight back against both their criminal and civil liability, and against the sanctions previously handed down from the ncaa - here, inexplicably, with success. Or that after Bill O'Brien fled to the nfl, that they replaced him with another man (James Franklin) with a very checkered-past of liability in covering up sexual assaults while at the helm at Vanderbilt.

If there was ever another program that deserved the SMU treatment, it is clearly Penn State. All SMU did was pay players. Hell, half of the SEC does that. Ole Miss doesn't even bother to be coy about it. Penn State worships a man who harbored and enabled a child predator.

Kimon 05-06-2016 10:32 PM

This one is from 1971. Again, with direct obstruction by Joe Paterno.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/06/us/jer...inkId=24234146

Sandusky is in jail. Paterno has escaped justice (because he's dead - otherwise he'd be rotting in jail). Penn State is just as culpable in this as Paterno. They shouldn't be allowed to escape justice.

Davian93 05-07-2016 08:16 PM

They should find a way to bring JoePa back from the dead...just so they can kill him again.

PSU fans are still in total denial of course.

Kimon 05-08-2016 05:03 PM

On open letter from the president of Penn State...

http://news.psu.edu/story/409338/201...garding-recent

Quote:

Dear Friends:

Over the past few days, allegations have surfaced from individuals who claim to be Sandusky victims and from unidentified individuals about the alleged knowledge of former University employees. None of these allegations about the supposed knowledge of University employees has been substantiated in a court of law or in any other process to test their veracity.

I want you to know I am appalled by the rumor, innuendo and rush to judgment that have accompanied the media stories surrounding these allegations. All too often in our society, people are convicted in the court of public opinion, only to find a different outcome when all the facts are presented.

In contrast, over the last two days we have worked to be diligent in reanalyzing the record of reports and depositions to ensure that our reactions and comments are both responsible and trustworthy.

First, the allegations related to Penn State are simply not established fact. The two allegations related to knowledge by Coach Paterno are unsubstantiated and unsupported by any evidence other than a claim by an alleged victim. They date from the 1970s. Coach Paterno is not alive to refute them. His family has denied them.

Second, we cannot find any evidence, related to a settlement or otherwise, that an alleged early assault was communicated to Coach Paterno. This raises considerable credibility issues as to this press report. Others cite assistant coaches that were witnesses or had knowledge – stating it as fact in headlines and text – even in the face of a denial and clear failure to corroborate from the individuals allegedly involved. Other stories are clearly incredulous, and should be difficult for any reasonable person to believe. We should not be rendering judgments about the actions of Coach Paterno or any other former employees of Penn State based on incomplete, sensationalized media accounts.

I can think of few crimes as heinous as the sexual assault of a child. We are, as individuals and as an institution, appalled by Sandusky’s actions, and unified in our commitment to prevention, treatment and education. I encourage you to visit this link for information on Penn State’s commitment.

Unfortunately, we can’t control the 24/7 news cycle, and the tendency of some individuals in social media and the blogosphere to rush to judgment. But I have had enough of the continued trial of the institution in various media. We have all had enough. And while Penn State cannot always comment on allegations that emanate from legal proceedings, I thought it was important to let you know my reaction to the media frenzy that has ensued over the past few days. I am appalled.

Sincerely,

Eric Barron
President

Davian93 05-08-2016 07:03 PM

What a joke.

Ozymandias 05-09-2016 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kimon (Post 237641)
On open letter from the president of Penn State...

The problem with this is that it comes off as defending a sex offender. We know Sandusky, and by extension Paterno, was guilty; it's perfectly within the limits of logic to believe this new accuser. And even if not, this is an inappropriate reaction by President Barron. The balance of our sympathy must always be overwhelmingly with victims, actual and potential.

It would be one thing if this was the first were hearing of anything. But it boggles the mind that Mr. Barron can so strenuously defend the legacy of proven sex offenders. His university was complicit in the most horrifying crime possible to commit; the sooner they accept responsibility and try to honestly atone, the better for everyone involved. They're already irredeemably guilty; fighting new allegations doesn't help anything or anyone.

Nazbaque 05-09-2016 03:35 PM

Ozy, how many most horrifying crimes are there? I thought you put genocide on top of that list.

Kimon 05-09-2016 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozymandias (Post 237667)
The problem with this is that it comes off as defending a sex offender. We know Sandusky, and by extension Paterno, was guilty; it's perfectly within the limits of logic to believe this new accuser. And even if not, this is an inappropriate reaction by President Barron. The balance of our sympathy must always be overwhelmingly with victims, actual and potential.

This, as it happens, is apparently part of their original settlement payments, so they have already essentially conceded the basic veracity of the crimes...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-back-as-1971/

This fight, and the source of his "appalled" reaction, is thus purely over the further injury to the sacred memory of Joe Paterno. If they would simply give up on apotheosizing him, and instead give him a much needed damnatio memoriae, this would be far less of a story. At present, their stance has the feel of both admitting that they were victims of Sandusky, and simulaneously arguing that regardless of being Sandusky's victims, that their claim that JoePa was complicit was an even more appalling crime than what Sandusky had done to them.

Davian93 05-09-2016 08:45 PM

Happy Valley should be razed to the ground and then they should salt the earth.

Delenda Est Penn Publica!


Note: My latin is a bit rusty...been 18 years since I've used it.

Kimon 05-09-2016 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davian93 (Post 237674)
Happy Valley should be razed to the ground and then they should salt the earth.

Delenda Est Penn Publica!


Note: My latin is a bit rusty...been 18 years since I've used it.

It works, though I would have placed the subject before the gerundive of obligation. "Penn Publica" also looks suspiciously like Google Translate. I'd go with "Paternus damnandus est", though your version is obviously a nice play on Cato's famous sententia.

Davian93 05-09-2016 10:20 PM

fun story, I remembered that publica/publicae was the word for State/country, etc so I ran it through Google Translate to see if I could get the right conjugation.

Like I said...been a long time for Latin.

Kimon 05-09-2016 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davian93 (Post 237679)
fun story, I remembered that publica/publicae was the word for State/country, etc so I ran it through Google Translate to see if I could get the right conjugation.

Like I said...been a long time for Latin.

Res publica means state. Publica by itself really just means public. So you technically said "Penn Public must be destroyed". Though urging that the "Pennsylvania Res Publica delenda est" might perhaps have confused Jove and resulted in his numen being called down on the entire state of Pennsylvania.

Davian93 05-09-2016 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kimon (Post 237681)
Res publica means state. Publica by itself really just means public. So you technically said "Penn Public must be destroyed". Though urging that the "Pennsylvania Res Publica delenda est" might perhaps have confused Jove and resulted in his numen being called down on the entire state of Pennsylvania.

Oh yeah...totally forgot it was res publica.

GonzoTheGreat 05-10-2016 03:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kimon (Post 237681)
Res publica means state. Publica by itself really just means public. So you technically said "Penn Public must be destroyed". Though urging that the "Pennsylvania Res Publica delenda est" might perhaps have confused Jove and resulted in his numen being called down on the entire state of Pennsylvania.

As Rumsfeld said: "stuff happens, we don't do body counts."

yks 6nnetu hing 05-10-2016 03:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GonzoTheGreat (Post 237684)
As Rumsfeld said: "stuff happens, we don't do body counts."

I know one better, by Stalin: "One death is a tragedy. A million - statistics"



(he also said "No person - no problem")

GonzoTheGreat 05-10-2016 05:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yks 6nnetu hing (Post 237685)
I know one better, by Stalin: "One death is a tragedy. A million - statistics"



(he also said "No person - no problem")

Stalin was the more competent* statesman of the two, no doubt about that. But I'm not sure that conservative Americans would prefer him as an authority over one of their own.

* Note that I did not say "admirable". Though he might possibly win even that competition in this case.

yks 6nnetu hing 05-10-2016 05:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GonzoTheGreat (Post 237686)
Stalin was the more competent* statesman of the two, no doubt about that. But I'm not sure that conservative Americans would prefer him as an authority over one of their own.

* Note that I did not say "admirable". Though he might possibly win even that competition in this case.

it all depends on how you measure these things and what your survey group is like.

to quote another Soviet leader ( I think it was Brezhnev but I'm not 100% sure): "Politicians are the same everywhere. They promise to build a bridge even if there's no river"

GonzoTheGreat 05-10-2016 05:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yks 6nnetu hing (Post 237687)
it all depends on how you measure these things and what your survey group is like.

to quote another Soviet leader ( I think it was Brezhnev but I'm not 100% sure): "Politicians are the same everywhere. They promise to build a bridge even if there's no river"

But Stalin held on to power until after he died; Rumsfeld didn't. Stalin still has admirers, Rumsfeld doesn't.

I'm not saying Stalin was good. I am just saying that Rumsfeld was even more of a failure. Which, come to think of it, may not even be an altogether bad thing, in this particular competition.

Edited to add:
Whether one chooses to emulate Stalin or Rumsfeld in dealing with Pennsylvania State doesn't seem to matter all that much, so this is a mostly theoretical side discussion anyway.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:50 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.