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Go Back   Theoryland of the Wheel of Time Forums > THEORYLAND STEDDINGS > Forum Archives > Archived - WoT Discussion Boards > Book 12: The Gathering Storm
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  #1  
Old 10-30-2009, 12:13 AM
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Default There were things I wanted to see in this book.

I wanted to see some Ogier. More about the Book of Translation, and mainland/Gardener interactions.

I wanted to see at least a hint of the Black Tower situation. Was it me, or did Rand not even think about it at all in this book?

I wanted to see if Fain is up to anything. Really it's been far too long since we heard anything about him.

But most of all, I really really wanted more Forsaken stuff.

I don't think I'm asking for much - I didn't expect any of these things to be a primary, or even a secondary focus. But even considering that, I felt like some stuff got a little too much short shrift*.





* Too short a shrift? Needed more shrift? It just occurred to me how friggin' awkward that phrase is.


EDIT: Hm, I didn't really mean to make this its own thread. Oh well.
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  #2  
Old 10-30-2009, 12:37 AM
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Things I wished to read more of in tGS?

1. More about Sea Folk clans, Talaan, Coine, Jorin, Shalon for characters, and at least something set in the Sea Folk islands


2. I had hoped to of read a pov from Perrin, Galad, Morgase or Tam when those groups finally met up together. I wanted to see all those individual, group dynamics occur. That's one of the biggest disappointments in tGS for me. I expect a pov of that meeting, and there wasn't one given.


3. I had feared that the two Red Sitters, Tarna would not return from the Black Tower after the meeting with Taim (KoD Book). However, I did assume we'd learn a bit more than they basically disappeared and had not returned. So RJ and Brandon leave us with the view of the Black Tower as a "Black Hole" sucking in Aes Sedai and letting no one ever leave? A la hotel california (Eagles song) situation?

4. Liandrin, where is she now?


Things I didn't expect to see in tGS, and I'm fine with:

1. No Slayer pov
2. No Fain pov
3. No Elayne pov
4. No Lan


Quote:
But most of all, I really really wanted more Forsaken stuff.
Laugh, Rand willing kills an female shadow member and yet a male shadow member returns to active life each time, possibly?

- Elza killed Osan'gar...but Elza was balefired with the True Power

- Graendal likely killed Asmodean...however Graendal was balefired with the largest stream ever created in history at one time.

Kill two females channelers and get two male channeler in return?

Do both Asmodean and Osan'gar both live now?

Well, Cadsuane did suggest to Rand not to use Balefire, chuckles.
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  #3  
Old 10-30-2009, 12:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FelixPax
Do both Asmodean and Osan'gar both live now?
No. Just no.

The omission of the Black Tower was a little odd, and I agree it would've been good to see some Ogier stuff. On the other hand, almost all of what we did get was pretty good.
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Old 10-30-2009, 02:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Belazamon
I wanted to see at least a hint of the Black Tower situation. Was it me, or did Rand not even think about it at all in this book?
Egwene did. And it seems likely that's where the Blacks in the Tower went. And Egwene also has to try to rescue or avenge the sisters who went there to bond Asha'man.
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Old 10-30-2009, 09:00 AM
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How much time do you really think Rand burned back in Elza's case and even in Graendal's (if it was her) case? There are no indications that the balefire stream used on Elza was ridiculously strong (not even as much as the Rahvin one) so there is no way it burned back all the way before the Cleansing. On Graendal (if it was her), it might have burned back a few weeks but I doubt any further. Rand burned maybe 30 minutes when he took out Rahvin. What type of magnification would it have to be to achieve the months required to push Graendal back to Asmo's death?


And what the hell happened to Logain? Or as we call him, "Sir not appearing in this novel"
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Old 10-30-2009, 11:20 AM
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Default I wanted Black Tower

I figured it wouldn't appear here, but I really wanted it to. But I'm super pumped that the next book is going to be a ton of that.

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  #7  
Old 10-30-2009, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Callandor
I figured it wouldn't appear here, but I really wanted it to. But I'm super pumped that the next book is going to be a ton of that.


Towers of Midnight = BT, ToG, and SC Towers? Seems nearly certain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davian93
How much time do you really think Rand burned back in Elza's case and even in Graendal's (if it was her) case? There are no indications that the balefire stream used on Elza was ridiculously strong (not even as much as the Rahvin one) so there is no way it burned back all the way before the Cleansing. On Graendal (if it was her), it might have burned back a few weeks but I doubt any further. Rand burned maybe 30 minutes when he took out Rahvin. What type of magnification would it have to be to achieve the months required to push Graendal back to Asmo's death?
Anything beyond 24hrs would make drastic changes to the whole of Arad Doman, if you look at the prologue you'll see Graendal's orders to deny Rand Domani unity and generally frustrate his plans. Rand, in chapter one, mentions two goals: Unity in Arad Doman and a SC truce. Neither of these two happened, and we can assume that the former is definitely due, in large part, to Graendal's efforts, and the latter is uncertain, we don't know if Tuon/Fortuona was under some form of compulsion to resist Rand's taveren nature, or if it was just raw willpower.

If Graendal had been burned to before Rand arrived we'd have had a living messenger. If she had been burned before the King died, than Ituralde wouldn't have fought the SC in the first place. That theory sounds wonderful, and I'm aware you don't buy it but I'm just commenting, but it just doesn't fit if somebody thinks about it for a few moements.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davian93
And what the hell happened to Logain? Or as we call him, "Sir not appearing in this novel"
Want a guess? What we saw was a hack and slash done to a complete novel, which means that it was not written explicitly to allow for a complete, progressive story arc, which meant we have a lot of holes. Sanderson is emulating George R R Martin in this respect, and to a lesser extent Robert Jordan. Which means that we'll begin the next book with Perrin, in all likelihood, and work through his arc with Galad and then also find that Logain is back at the BT and the AS that haven't returned have been caught up in the struggle for BT control. This is all happening from about half way through TGS until after it is done.
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  #8  
Old 10-30-2009, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Want a guess? What we saw was a hack and slash done to a complete novel, which means that it was not written explicitly to allow for a complete, progressive story arc, which meant we have a lot of holes. Sanderson is emulating George R R Martin in this respect, and to a lesser extent Robert Jordan. Which means that we'll begin the next book with Perrin, in all likelihood, and work through his arc with Galad and then also find that Logain is back at the BT and the AS that haven't returned have been caught up in the struggle for BT control. This is all happening from about half way through TGS until after it is done.
I agree, I think the first goal will be sinking up the story lines and telling what happened in between for Perrin and Mat. I don't think Rand will be introduced until 1/3 to 2/5 of the way through the book. Maybe at a Reunion in Caemlyn at which point Mat goes to Ghenjei, Rand deals with Seanchan/Black tower, Perrin does whatever. Then they go fight the dark one.
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Old 10-30-2009, 01:53 PM
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What are the chances that the party that ultimately faces the Dark One consists of Rand, Mat, Perrin, Egwene, Nynaeve, Moiraine, and Lan?
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Old 10-30-2009, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wunderwaffe
What are the chances that the party that ultimately faces the Dark One consists of Rand, Mat, Perrin, Egwene, Nynaeve, Moiraine, and Lan?
It would be poetic if nothing else. It wouldn't surprise me in the least.
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Old 10-30-2009, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davian93
It would be poetic if nothing else. It wouldn't surprise me in the least.
I would be surprised if Lan survives his stand at the Gap.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Gathering Storm, Chapter 48 - Reading The Commentary
And...what was that vision that was suddenly hovering above Nynaeve's head? She was kneeling over someone's corpse in a posture of grief. The viewing was gone a moment later.

Min shook her head. That hadn't been a viewing she could interpret, so she let it pass. She couldn't waste her time trying to unravel all of those. For instance, the black knife that spun around Beldeine's head recently could mean anything.
Min doesnt understand this viewing, but it could be foreshadowing of Lan's death.
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Old 10-30-2009, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
And...what was that vision that was suddenly hovering above Nynaeve's head? She was kneeling over someone's corpse in a posture of grief. The viewing was gone a moment later.

Min shook her head. That hadn't been a viewing she could interpret, so she let it pass. She couldn't waste her time trying to unravel all of those. For instance, the black knife that spun around Beldeine's head recently could mean anything
More likely it's Rand. I thought Min had a viewing of Lan and the 7 towers and a crown or something of the sort.
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Why, Rand? why do you go to battle? What is the point?

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  #13  
Old 10-31-2009, 08:14 AM
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Also, Alivia ostensibly has to be there...
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Old 10-31-2009, 10:01 AM
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Lan will surevive some how. RJ confirmed Min doesn't see the past, only the future so the baby with the sword, the 7 towers, Nynaeve thinking she can Heal anything. I stilll sometimes thought RJ made a mistake when writing some of those viewings, but if not Lan will survive.
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