art by =saintchase

Theoryland Resources

WoT Interview Search

Search the most comprehensive database of interviews and book signings from Robert Jordan, Brandon Sanderson and the rest of Team Jordan.

Wheel of Time News

An Hour With Harriet

2012-04-30: I had the great pleasure of speaking with Harriet McDougal Rigney about her life. She's an amazing talent and person and it will take you less than an hour to agree.

The Bell Tolls

2012-04-24: Some thoughts I had during JordanCon4 and the upcoming conclusion of "The Wheel of Time."

Theoryland Community

Members: 7653

Logged In (1): imichelinirandy,

Newest Members:johnroserking, petermorris, johnadanbvv, AndrewHB, jofwu, Salemcat1, Dhakatimesnews, amazingz, Sasooner, Hasib123,

Theoryland Tweets

Forums

Home | Chat | Old Forums(Yuku)


Go Back   Theoryland of the Wheel of Time Forums > THEORYLAND STEDDINGS > Forum Archives > Archived - WoT Discussion Boards > Book 12: The Gathering Storm
User Name
Password

 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-04-2009, 06:30 PM
1Powerslave's Avatar
1Powerslave 1Powerslave is offline
Hero of the Horn
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sweden
Posts: 649
1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold1Powerslave is a splendid one to behold
Send a message via ICQ to 1Powerslave Send a message via MSN to 1Powerslave Send a message via Yahoo to 1Powerslave
Default Healing the Bore (post tGS version 1b)

The first part of this theory is located here:
http://www.theoryland.com/vbulletin/...ead.php?t=2234

This is just a bit of expansion on that theory, taking into account Padan Fain and a few other points.
(Also it is a response to a post in this thread:
http://www.theoryland.com/vbulletin/...ead.php?t=2511)



Quote:
Originally Posted by Tercel
On a general level I agree that the idea of Nynaeve discovering a way to "heal" the Pattern seems generally the right sort of thing. However:
- I don't think it will be the same weave as is used to heal humans. Though she might well be able to extrapolate from what heals humans and heals severing
- It doesn't account for "belief and order give strength"
- It doesn't account well for Ta'veren
- It doesn't account for Padan Fain
Yeah, the exact same Healing weave that she always uses might not be it. Different ailments should require (somewhat) different remedies; is a thing that some Yellows were discussing (or was it Nynaeve) at some point in the Salidar camp, iirc. Why is Healing always the same weave, etc.

"Belief and order give strength", I think, means that the more order (as opposite to the general chaos sown by the Shadow plans and actions) and belief (in the cause against the Shadow, in the Dragon Reborn) the stronger the Pattern is. Thus not "busying" the ta'veren, and their effect of correctiveness on the Pattern can be concentrated on the thinness of the Pattern that lies at Shayol Ghul. Similarly "order", refers to all threads/people in the Pattern aligning to as single purpose/weaving/PATTERN. I.e. order is an actual pattern, chaos is unravelling of a pattern.
So yeah, my theory didn't touch on this part of Fel's note. This is how I interpret it in favor of my theory though. This could definately be one (if perhaps not the only) "power source" for the energy required for a healing.

Padan Fain

I don't think Fain is a match to the full blown force of an entity such as the Dark One. But as stated his evil is the anti-evil of the Dark One (I think this is a safe assumtion derived from the Cleansing, where the Taint of both evils destroyed one another). And the Dark One is only touching the world; he is not completely or even much at all, free, even when the Seals are removed, I think. But maybe Fain is a match to the influence the Dark One has on the Pattern when the Seals are removed.

I think that Fain's role might be to delay the Dark One, to keep him busy, while the Healing of the Bore occurs.
The Dark One is very angry with the fact that he cannot step outside of time. The Healing would need time to be performed. If the Dark One would miss a window of opportunity to counterstrike or influence events, then he'd be just as trapped by time as if Balefire had been used on someone. He cannot step outside of time. And he cannot undo an event that has already occured.

So in context of my Healing the Bore theory, that might be where Fain comes in. I even toyed with the idea that Rand would be able to turn Fain back towards the Light after a fashion. So he can have his revenge on the Shadow. Ishamael it was (wasn't it?) that did something to him, perhaps Lews Therin can undo that. There is a saying that "no one is so far gone to the Shadow that they cannot come back to the Light". I don't think this saying has any examples in the book, where this actually happened. Maybe Fain can be the one.

Something Fel said:
Fel pointed out an inherent contradiction, namely that the prison needs to be completely intact when the Wheel of Time turns and the Age of Legends comes again, so the Aes Sedai of that time can create the Bore once again. He also mentions that the Dark One needs to have been forgotten by this time as well.

This suggests that a simple weave of the power will not do to seal away the Dark One. A Healing fits nicely with this. But... it wont be a final win for the Light of course. Then again, Rand has just realized that they still get to live again and love again so long as this cycle continues. Ideas that the Light will win a final win goes against this idea of Healing the Bore, if one also think this is what Fel says needs to occur.

Ok, that's it for now.
__________________
Aelfinn to Rand: "To live you must *garbled due to the earthquake caused by Rand's ta'veren presence* Moridin"
"Before I let the Dark One have you, I will destroy you myself." -- Moiraine
  #2  
Old 11-04-2009, 09:07 PM
fdsaf3's Avatar
fdsaf3 fdsaf3 is offline
Elder
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 969
fdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant futurefdsaf3 has a brilliant future
Default

Hey everyone, first post here!

I want to expand on your idea with a few other ideas. I really like the idea of "Healing" the pattern since we've seen how much the world needs to be Healed - it seems to fit with the difference in the current Age versus the Age of Legends. The current Age might be summarized as squabbling children; the references to this supposed immaturity abound, especially among the Forsaken. The world seems to be splintered, and in desperate need for unification.

The age of Legends, on the other hand, seemed to have been united. Aes Sedai were united, nations seemed to be united, races seemed to get along, etc. Maybe because they were united they could afford to push and probe - that's how the Dark One was found, it was "drilled" into by Lanfear.

Anyway, I'm way off topic. Sorry about that.

Another thing we've seen is the necessity for unification not only on a macro scale, but on a micro one as well. Rand needed Nynavene to cleanse the Taint, Nynavene (a woman) was needed to fully Heal Logain's access to the Power, etc. There is an obvious yin-yang balance between men and women that Robert Jordan has been hammering into our heads from the first time we heard about the 100 Companions - all male. Maybe that act was what split the world into being female-centric (at least in terms of the Power), and maybe the Dragon needs to unify men and women in order to win the Last Battle.

Maybe the Pattern will be "healed" when men and women unite again.

One last note: Sorry for any typos I made. I promise I'm a good poster, I'm just coming off a 12 hour work day and my brain is fried. It's not easy spelling those names from memory!
  #3  
Old 11-04-2009, 09:37 PM
JSUCamel's Avatar
JSUCamel JSUCamel is offline
Hero of the Horn
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Windy City
Posts: 3,264
JSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant futureJSUCamel has a brilliant future
Send a message via AIM to JSUCamel Send a message via MSN to JSUCamel Send a message via Yahoo to JSUCamel
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdsaf3
Hey everyone, first post here!

Awesome! We love new people. Great stuff for a first post! Introduce yourself on the New User forums so we can get to know you a bit better

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1PS
There is a saying that "no one is so far gone to the Shadow that they cannot come back to the Light". I don't think this saying has any examples in the book, where this actually happened. Maybe Fain can be the one.
There are a few examples that I can think of, Ingtar being the most obvious and first to come to mind. But otherwise.. good stuff.
__________________
---

"Nice try, Jack!" - Robert Jordan (to Camel)
"Camel must be the coolest TLer ever, by now." -GLotD

A grilled cheese eaten more than five minutes later is just no good. -Crispin



 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:01 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.