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  #141  
Old 12-07-2009, 01:43 AM
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While I agree with Rand channelling the TP through Mordin, I have been thinking of alternatives. One that I came up with was reasoned out by ommissions and supositions. However it does fit with the known facts as we understand them.


Rand did not channel the TP. He channeled the Scooby Snack Power of Awsomeness from the Creator.

Reasons:

1. RJ likes balance and we have yet to see a counter to the TP.

2. If Rand did channel the TP then Mordin should know it since it went through him, or the link atleast. Mordin did not come after Rand when that occured. One would assume that he would since access to the TP would shift the power balnce between them greatly.

3. We have not seen any black flecks on Rands eyes. The only description he gives is that it is like being being under water.

I know that there is litle chance of this occuring. Heck, Bela killing Asmodean has more creadible evidnece than this. But as I said I am thinking of alternatives....incase there is on in the books.
  #142  
Old 12-07-2009, 02:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tercel View Post
2. We know that the Dark One did not grant Rand permission to channel the True Power. (stated by Brandon Sanderson at a Signing)
Turns out he did not say that:

Quote:
Originally Posted by some guy
The Gathering Storm Book Tour, Mysterious Galaxy, San Diego 15 November 2009 - Writo reporting

Oy,

I was at that signing, I was literally right next to Brandon as he answered this question, and that is far from his exact wording.

The response was more accurately something like: So far as we know, no one may channel the True Power without the Dark One's permission. Semirhage certainly seemed to think she was betrayed.

There was never a comment about Rand not having permission.

I'd take all of the Q&A by that guy with a bit of a grain of salt... He seemed very much to be looking to hear things that agree with his own opinions, not so much just trying to take in some truth from Brandon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BWS & Tamyrlin
Driving Mr. Sanderson (from Half Moon Bay to San Jose), 21 November 2009 - Matt Hatch reporting

Matt: There was some confusion about Rand and the Dark One’s permission, so for clarification’s sake, did Rand have the Dark One’s permission to use the True Power?

Brandon: I have not answered that. If anyone says that I have, I have not. What I have said specifically is, this is recording [meaning that Matt has audio of this conversation - Terez]: generally one must have the Dark One’s permission to use the True Power. Semirhage believed that the Dark One had betrayed her by letting Rand use it. It is good that you have asked this so I can make sure on the record that is the answer I have given.
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  #143  
Old 12-07-2009, 12:28 PM
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I would have agreed it was possible except for her sense of betrayal. Plus you would think if the TP were being drawn through her she would know about as soon as Rand reached for it and stop it. Her reaction indicates that she was even more surprised than Rand and was not herself in contact with the TP, even as a conduit.
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  #144  
Old 12-07-2009, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by jason wolfbrother View Post
I would have agreed it was possible except for her sense of betrayal. Plus you would think if the TP were being drawn through her she would know about as soon as Rand reached for it and stop it. Her reaction indicates that she was even more surprised than Rand and was not herself in contact with the TP, even as a conduit.
I seriouslydoubt that he drew the TP through Semirhage, but it would fit with Moghedien's warning about the collar turning the tables on the bracelets and taking charge.
tsr Ch 54:
Put the collar on a man who channels, and a woman wearing the bracelets can make him do whatever she wishes, true, but it will not stop him going mad, and there is a flow the other way, too. Eventually he will begin to be able to control you, too, so you end with a struggle at every hour. Not very palatable when he is going mad. Of course, you can pass the bracelets around, so no one has too much exposure, but that does mean trusting someone else with him. Men are always so good at violence; they make wonderful weapons. Or two women can each wear one bracelet, if you have someone you trust enough; that slows the seepage considerably, I understand, but it also lessens your control, even if you work in perfect unison. Eventually, you will find yourselves in a struggle for control with him, each of you needing him to remove your bracelet as surely as he needs you to remove the collar."
I think there may be a remote possibility that Rand's "eventually" was a lot shorter than expected -- like only a few seconds of intense emotion and strong will?
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  #145  
Old 12-07-2009, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Weird Harold View Post
I seriouslydoubt that he drew the TP through Semirhage, but it would fit with Moghedien's warning about the collar turning the tables on the bracelets and taking charge.
Two comments. 1) (I believe) the sad bracelets only OP-link the users. Rand was able to channel the TP, because that was not part of the bracelets function (inhibiting the channeling of that power). 2) (I believe) that TP linking is not possible. That is not its nature. You can channel as much as you are allowed to. No linking. Note: The "link" with Moridin is not the same as a OP link. That is a possible "permission" link.
  #146  
Old 12-07-2009, 02:35 PM
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I believe that Shai'tan could have turned on the shut-off valve whenever he wished. Except, he didn't. I think the event was inadvertant, and spontaneous. I also think that it would have been impossible save for the Moridin-Rand connection.
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  #147  
Old 12-07-2009, 06:12 PM
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Unless the point is specifically that the DO did NOT want to turn off the valve. It may have been spontaneous, but probably without notice. If the DO is truly not playing the game the way it is being thought to be played, then it may have completely served his purposes to have Rand and Moridin linked and Rand draw the TP.

Or would that be unrolled the TP?
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  #148  
Old 12-07-2009, 08:19 PM
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Like I said way back in the thread...yeah, it's bordering on certain that the link with Moridin is what gave access to the True Power. That doesn't mean that the Dark One wouldn't approve, and it also doesn't mean that the whole shebang wasn't planned to some degree.
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  #149  
Old 12-08-2009, 05:25 AM
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It seems rather unlikely that he drew it through Semirhage, to be honest:
Quote:
Originally Posted by TGS, Chapter 29, Into Bandar Eban
That other force called to him, sang to him, tempted him. So much power, so much divine wonder. But it terrified him. He didn't dare touch it, not again.
Then, of course, there is the fact that he still held the TP after having balefired Semirhage with it (he took care of Elza after he'd disposed of the Forsaken). But I am sure that the "it was through Semi" supporters can find a way of working around this little problem.
  #150  
Old 12-08-2009, 01:14 PM
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Ugh, am I the only on left that believes Rand got access directly from the DO?

That is much more sinister and I believe helpful to the plans of the DO.
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  #151  
Old 12-08-2009, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by One Armed Gimp View Post
Ugh, am I the only on left that believes Rand got access directly from the DO?
I doubt it, but to most of us it just seems like bending over backwards to try to find an explanation other than the one that makes the most sense.
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  #152  
Old 12-08-2009, 05:57 PM
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On first reading I had sort of taken it that Rand got permission from the Dark One. I also am not sure I buy this stuff about that face being Moridin's. I wouldn't be surprised if it was, but I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't, either.

Is it true that the channeling sickness didn't really begin until he crossed balefire with Moridin?

If so I wonder if there might be something to the idea that now every time Rand channels the One Power, it draws the Dark One's attention as much as naming him...because now he has a link with the Dark One's champion.

Another thing is...I thought I noticed this as I was reading TGS...but after that scene where he channels the TP for the first time, don't you notice several times where Rand might be channeling or first grasping hold of the One Power, and he doesn't have that channeling sickness?

Like, what about the scene where Rand is talking to Tam. I don't think he was holding Saidin the whole time. I think he grabbed hold of it when he got really mad, yet he didn't seem to go through a sickness that approached the one notable one that he labeled the worst he's gone through.

I'm hazy on the timeline. When did he come out of that stedding and a look of ecstasy was on his face? Was it before the collar incident? Or after. If after, note he again didn't seem to go through any sickness. I wonder if he was channeling the TP since it's so addictive.

Maybe channeling the True Power cured the channeling sickness. Maybe the sickness itself was the Dark One's eye on Rand every time he channeled, and he was trying to nudge him into using the True Power.

Last edited by ckparrothead; 12-08-2009 at 05:59 PM.
  #153  
Old 12-08-2009, 06:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frenzy View Post
And perhaps Rand will re-seal the Bore with the TP, so there's nothing to taint.
the problem with this is that the DO is the only connect for the TP. so if rand goes to channel it to seal him he'd just cut him off from it. DO: "you've had enough"
rand: "oh please... i needs my fix"
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  #154  
Old 12-10-2009, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hippie-joe View Post
the problem with this is that the DO is the only connect for the TP. so if rand goes to channel it to seal him he'd just cut him off from it. DO: "you've had enough"
rand: "oh please... i needs my fix"
I look at it like the True Power is the Dark One, and the Dark One is the True Power. One and the same.
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  #155  
Old 12-10-2009, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
And perhaps Rand will re-seal the Bore with the TP, so there's nothing to taint.
is the TP single or double ply? if it's double, maybe it will be gentle enough to not irritate the DO and rand can use it to seal the DO's bore. or at least wipe the old seals away. they've got to have left one helluva set of 'roids on the DO's bore.
  #156  
Old 01-16-2010, 01:14 AM
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Default Nature of the True Power

Has the question ever been asked, "Is the True Power split up like the One Power?" If it is split, do we know if a man could see what a woman weaves with it and woman a man's? I don't recall reading a scene in which a woman is allowed to touch the TP.

I think there has to be something like this with the TP. When Rand cleansed the taint (and from RJ clarifing more later) the two halves of the OP were combined together but they could not touch each other.

I know that RJ said the taint on Saidin and the evil of Shadar Logoth were like the opposite ends of a magnet, but also the same. The way I understand the cleansing, once there was enough of the taint to get around the repulsion side of the Shadar Logoth evil, the two attracted each other and it sucked the rest of the taint right off Saidin. But the effect was like mixing an acid and base together - big explosion.

Now certainly I don't think the way to defeat the DO is like cleansing Saidin, but I think there is a missing componet that will be used in either resealing the bore, or in making a new prision. Of course there is the great unknown factor of Fain with the dagger.
  #157  
Old 01-16-2010, 02:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fermatsfermata View Post
Has the question ever been asked, "Is the True Power split up like the One Power?"
No, because one of the exciting things about the discovery of the True Power in the first place, before the Bore was drilled, was that it (singular) could be used by both men and women.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fermata
If it is split, do we know if a man could see what a woman weaves with it and woman a man's? I don't recall reading a scene in which a woman is allowed to touch the TP.
When Aran'gar channels, Moghedien immediately jumps to the idea that she is channeling saidin, after a short skip over the only other possibility, that she was channeling the True Power. The latter was discounted because Moghedien assumed that Aran'gar was a Third-Ager and could not possibly have been granted the privilege. She never considers inverted weaves, strangely, but also, RJ intimated in interviews that you can't sense when anyone is using the True Power, at least not by any way we have seen yet.

Apparently, anyone can sense the True Power around Shayol Ghul, or at least anyone who can channel—the Bore was drilled at the thinness in the Pattern where the True Power could be sensed—but anyone who tried to channel it there would be burned to a cinder. The Forsaken are reluctant to hold the Power long after their gateways close, but there is no actual danger in channeling the One Power there, other than the danger of making the Dark One think you are up to something with it.
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