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  #1  
Old 10-27-2009, 12:54 PM
Tamyrlin Tamyrlin is offline
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Default TGS - The Small Clue Concerning Asmodean's Killer

Brandon told me that he put a small clue as to Asmodean's killer in this book. Let's find it folks.
  #2  
Old 10-27-2009, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Tamyrlin
Brandon told me that he put a small clue as to Asmodean's killer in this book. Let's find it folks.
Hmmm...interesting. It must have been really small. Perhaps I'll catch it on my reread.
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  #3  
Old 10-27-2009, 12:55 PM
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-What about how Meidani removed Verin's body? Can give a small clue as how to the body of Asmo disappeared.

-Could he mean that by killing Graendal, it decreases the chance Graendal killed Asmo?
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  #4  
Old 10-27-2009, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Isabel
-What about how Meidani removed Verin's body? Can give a small clue as how to the body of Asmo disappeared.

-Could he mean that by killing Graendal, it decreases the chance Graendal killed Asmo?
That could be it. Was anyone stunned by Graendal's abrupt passing. So much build up throughout the books and she was just gone in a split second.

EDIT: Should we mark the title as SPOILERS, Tam?
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Old 10-27-2009, 12:58 PM
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Default First Thought - Major TGS Spoiler

Because I'd like it to be true. Brandon's use of the word "small" could be ironic...as in, Rand using balefire on Graendal's domain...heh, small.

As in - "it ain't her".

Of course, this assumes Graendal's death...which remains suspect for the time being.
  #6  
Old 10-27-2009, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tamyrlin
Because I'd like it to be true. Brandon's use of the word "small" could be ironic...as in, Rand using balefire on Graendal's domain...heh, small.

As in - "it ain't her".

Of course, this assumes Graendal's death...which remains suspect for the time being.
Seemed pretty cut and dry to me. Rand was certain of it.
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  #7  
Old 10-27-2009, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Davian93
That could be it. Was anyone stunned by Graendal's abrupt passing. So much build up throughout the books and she was just gone in a split second.
I thought that was kind of cool and logical (when you think about it). You don't give your enemies a chance.
So I thought it was realistic
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  #8  
Old 10-27-2009, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Isabel
I thought that was kind of cool and logical (when you think about it). You don't give your enemies a chance.
So I thought it was realistic
Yeah, me too. Rand's plan was vicious to say the least...likely a result of the darkness around him at that point.
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  #9  
Old 10-27-2009, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Tamyrlin
Because I'd like it to be true. Brandon's use of the word "small" could be ironic...as in, Rand using balefire on Graendal's domain...heh, small.

As in - "it ain't her".

Of course, this assumes Graendal's death...which remains suspect for the time being.
Well, I would say 99% Graendal is dead. There are very small ifs and what ifs.
And ofcourse someone else could have known Asmo is dead and killed by Graendal. Like Moridin or the DO. So I don't exclude Graendal yet, but I am happy that it has become less likely.
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  #10  
Old 10-27-2009, 01:12 PM
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Default Well

There have to be a few ways she could still be alive.

First, couldn't she have created a compulsion that fell away on its own? She's not an idiot. Why would Rand send this decoy of sorts in? She knew that Rand found her, therefore she could have surmised that he knew about the compulsion...so what be so obvious in its use if she didn't have some type of plan for the decoy and for her escape? In other words, she thinks "he will come after me as long as he thinks I'm alive"...convoluted for sure, that she could reason it all out and set up this person's compulsion to fall away, while escaping...

Wait!!!

Is there any way she could have made herself into Rand's decoy? Holy s*** that would be a great twist. I need to go back and read that part.
  #11  
Old 10-27-2009, 01:13 PM
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Maybe its possible. That would be too funny if she was using an inverted Mirror of Mists there. Ballsy move to say the least though.
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Old 10-27-2009, 01:18 PM
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Default It's a fun theory - so I'll write it up! :)

It would be amazing. But not a crazy gamble. He found me. He knows I'm using compulsion. He sent this person in expecting me to use him. He won't stop looking for me now. Unless...
  #13  
Old 10-27-2009, 01:24 PM
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I'd join that faction.
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Old 10-27-2009, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Tamyrlin
It would be amazing. But not a crazy gamble. He found me. He knows I'm using compulsion. He sent this person in expecting me to use him. He won't stop looking for me now. Unless...
I just reread it again. I don't think its possible for it to be Graendal in disguise. How would she make the compulsion weaves disappear in her own her own head? She can't channel her own brain afterall.

However, we don't know WHO specifically Compelled Graendal. Not for sure anyway. Its possible that Graendal used a proxy to channel the weaves and escaped while Rand was building up his Balefire beam (something that wasn't instantaneous for whatever reason). Or she had the Compulsion net dissipate somehow.
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Old 10-27-2009, 02:06 PM
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Default Fake Compulsion

The more I think about it, the more sense it makes. Rand is quite clear. He believes Graendal will know it is a ruse by him. Then, she would have to ask, if he knew she was there, why didn't he attack? Because he thinks that she will run if he attacks. Therefore, he sent his envoy, to check if I was "in the building". Why would he do that? Because he planned a large enough attack that would prevent me from escaping. What is he waiting for? He is waiting for his servant to return whom he will check for signs that I was there. So, if I want him to pull off his attack, I have to add compulsion to this servants mind...or better yet, I can pretend to be his servant, Mask of Mirrors, inverted threads, fake compulsion, and find out what his real plans are, he'd never expect me not to run
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Old 10-27-2009, 02:09 PM
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How would one fake that weave though? It would still involve channeling on herself...in a way that should be impossible. I'm more inclined to think she slipped away somehow.
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Old 10-27-2009, 02:14 PM
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Or she could use a loose Compulsion weave on the servant, one that will unravel in a short while. Next, she runs like hell.
She hopes the ruse will work, but if not, it doens't matter.
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Old 10-27-2009, 02:18 PM
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Default Master of Compulsion

I don't think it's a hard sell to imagine that Graendal has learned a way to add fake weaves that mimic the sensation of real weaves of compulsion when someone delves. Now, I don't think Graendal expected what happened, however Rand gives her time to respond by instructing Nynaeve what to check for after he balefired.

Even the text, when you imagine it being Graendal, is quite hilarious - "I lady of the castle down there was quite friendly--she is an ally, my Lord. You have nothing to fear from her! Very refined, I must say."

I agree - it's far fetched, but certainly fun.
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Old 10-27-2009, 02:20 PM
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Default However

She wouldn't expect Balefire...so what is the ruse? Plus, if it was real, from what we saw Nynaeve do, removing it isn't something simple, unless it was fake in the first place.

I don't know.
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Old 10-27-2009, 03:01 PM
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I'm going to have to say, after reading the scene twice to make sure, that I'm positive it was Graendal. So she is toast, ihmo.

What is interesting is that delay of balefire. We always assumed it was instant every time. Not so much here. So how would someone who accidentally stubbled upon Asmo have time to cast it?

I think it was Jordan who said he planned to put the asmo reveal in the character's pov, so I do think this finally eliminates Graendal as a suspect. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
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