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Go Back   Theoryland of the Wheel of Time Forums > THEORYLAND STEDDINGS > Forum Archives > Archived - WoT Discussion Boards > Book 13: Towers of Midnight
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View Poll Results: Rate Towers of Midnight vs. The Gathering Storm
I liked ToM more than TGS. 95 49.22%
I liked them equally. 48 24.87%
I liked TGS more than ToM. 46 23.83%
I didn't care for either book. 4 2.07%
Voters: 193. You may not vote on this poll

 
 
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  #1  
Old 10-28-2010, 10:12 PM
Tamyrlin Tamyrlin is offline
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Default Rate ToM vs. TGS

I know some have read the book. And since I'm not allowing for spoiler discussions, I thought it might be nice to get a poll going as to what those of you that have read it felt about the book compared to The Gathering Storm.

Last edited by Tamyrlin; 10-28-2010 at 10:20 PM.
  #2  
Old 10-29-2010, 03:27 AM
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ToM is my favorite book co Number 1 with The Shadow Rising.

I couldn't sleep after reading it.

Well, I pulled an allnighter and had to work the next day so I couldn't sleep anyway but you get the idea.

It is just so damn EPIC. The last half of the book is just crazy, crazy, crazy good.

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  #3  
Old 10-29-2010, 03:33 AM
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So far, from what I've read, I'm enjoying ToM more than tGS.
  #4  
Old 10-31-2010, 05:16 PM
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I voted TGS, but that is not to say that I didn't enjoy ToM a helluva lot.
  #5  
Old 10-31-2010, 11:14 PM
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I put TGS over ToM but I want to qualify that by saying TGS was one of my favorite books in the entire series and that Rand on the mountain was probably the strongest and most important scene/ending of any of the books. It is no insult to ToM as it is a fantastic read.

There are no lags really in the book...its a great great read. You won't be able to put it down.
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Old 11-01-2010, 04:51 AM
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Since the nadir that was Crossroads..every book has gotten better than the last.

I have absolutely confidence that aMoL will be the best in the series and that it won't end the way I think it will end.
  #7  
Old 11-01-2010, 12:56 PM
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I liked Towers of Midnight a lot more than The Gathering Storm but less than any of the first five books of the series. So I'd say it's the sixth best book of the entire lot. Better than anything since The Fires of Heaven though, and given that I first read that back in 1994, I am mostly satisfied although, admittedly, a little underwhelmed. I never thought it would be as good as The Shadow Rising but I thought it might be possible it could enter the top three given the glowing reviews before I read it.
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Old 11-01-2010, 01:48 PM
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Default Agree

That TOM was the second best book behind TGS. PArt of the reason though was that TOM mirrored the best parts of TGS:

1. Future/Past of the Aiel shown in Rhuidean

2. Slayer vs. Perrin in Tel'aran'rhiad

3. Supergirls vs. Forsaken in Tel'aran'rhiad

4. Mat and the snakes and foxes

5. Itarulde's fight for survival and holding as long as possible until reinforcements arrived paralleled the battle of the Two Rivers

6. Needing to destroy a waygate to prevent trollocs paralleled by the need to destroy a portal stone to prevent trollocs

7. Bubble of evil - axe attacks parallels bubble of evil knife attacks

Any other parallels?
  #9  
Old 11-03-2010, 02:48 AM
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I can't decide yet. I don't like depressing books and there were two things that depressed me. But the more I re-read the happy parts and try to forget the sad parts the easier it will be to decide :P
  #10  
Old 11-03-2010, 01:16 PM
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I hate the time line issue even more with this copy.

I don't believe I saw a mention of the way women were dressed except for Faile and the removal of gold belts from her belongings.
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Old 11-04-2010, 01:15 PM
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Thumbs up Towers, for certain

Just finished last night, and I loved it. For me, the number of unresolved plot lines was reaching past the juggling bounds and into spaghetti; plus there's the timeline, which - let's be honest - was like listening to multiple conversations simultaneously.

Towers brought that all back together; tying up so many of the loose threads and realigning the timelines.

The second reason I liked Towers so much more: Rather than chapters of philosophical debate and narration, we've seen a strong focus on action. While I understand that this appeals in part because of my gender, it's also given the story a momentum that's been lacking at times. I appreciated that - instead of drawing out one thread to allow for buildup - the story jumped from perspective to perspective so frequently that the suspense and anticipation of each was allowed to increase naturally, keeping me on the edge of my seat for each while still being totally drawn into the one I was currently on.

Altogether, I'm now back to anxiously waiting for March of 2012.
  #12  
Old 11-04-2010, 01:28 PM
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While there were many enjoyable parts, I voted for tGS.

For me, there wee too many cringeworthy moments from our main cast of characters. Though this has been a problem throughout the books, it really bothered me this time.

Rand and Egwene don't get info from the BT in over a month, but Nynaeve goes there and back in one night? Cringe!

Rand didn't do nearly enough stuff to account for 1 month. Barely a week. Cringe!

Verin's streak of not making a mistake for 70 years if over. And it would have been so easy to prevent. Cringe!

And even some minor things, like Mat's letter (he can't spell (but we know he can from earlier), but then talks of the "technology" with Elayne. So much for Carlinya and her raven tatoo. Cringe!

Still, lots of wonderful scenes, mostly with Perrin's arc.

And I felt this book was like a TV show cliffhanger. Perrin's arc was really the only one where I felt like we weren't teased. Too little of Moiraine. Too little of Rand. Too little LB prep.

I knew this was going to be a problem, as there was so much left undone, and maybe my expectation levels were too high (like with aCoS after LoC).

Last edited by The Angry Druid; 11-04-2010 at 01:33 PM.
  #13  
Old 11-04-2010, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davian93 View Post
I put TGS over ToM but I want to qualify that by saying TGS was one of my favorite books in the entire series and that Rand on the mountain was probably the strongest and most important scene/ending of any of the books. It is no insult to ToM as it is a fantastic read.

There are no lags really in the book...its a great great read. You won't be able to put it down.
Aye when it comes to the mountain scene with Rand. I voted though that I equally enjoyed both books.

I guess it boils down to the fact that in the end, I will most likely view this trilogy, as the one book that it was intended to be initially.

That TGS dealt with Egwene's and Rands main story arches in preparation for the Last Battle while setting up Mat's and Perrin's final story arches for the last battle. Now in ToM we get the final story arches of Perrin and Mat's characters in preparation for the Last battle, while Rand's and Egwenes parts in the story are the setup for the Final Battle. While we also see other minor character story arches coming to a close as well in preparation for the Final Battle.
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Old 11-04-2010, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adrienne View Post
I hate the time line issue even more with this copy.

I don't believe I saw a mention of the way women were dressed except for Faile and the removal of gold belts from her belongings.
Unfortunately, I agree fully with Adrienne's judgment on both issues. Time line is jarring and the deep level of thick description was all to frequently missing. Too many character voices felt off or the same as another character's, the plot felt "forced" in particular Elayne's story arc.


I wish it was not true, but I'm disappointed with Towers of Midnight overall. I feel like I wasted my money purchasing this book, and my time reading it. At this point, I'm seriously questioning whether to even read AMoL considering how disjointed, awkward the story is.

It's as if all the ornaments on a Christmas Tree have been 'striped' a week before the cerebrations were to begin. Then someone decided to hide all the wrapping and tape, so all the gifts are set out to be seen by everyone in view.


I have a distinct feeling the new author, has not grasped the necessarily details from the prior twelve Robert Jordan books including New Spring. Then the author decided to apply a type of Swedish Modernism to the Wheel of Time, in the tradition of IKEA; instead of relying upon the original 'thick interwoven multiple layered' descriptive qualities of the original series. So what's left? A bare bones outline of things to do: A List. A 'Tell'. Where is the spirit of feeling in Towers of Midnight? A 'Show'? What was once written in High Chant, is now written in Plain Chant.


If I wanted to read another Warbreaker, I'd have read Warbreaker again. If I wanted to read a Wheel of Time book, I'd expected it to match the vocabulary, style, spirit of prior books. Just as I expect a great musical album to. Tellingly, something is seriously amiss since Knife of Dreams was released. Taken together as a group, The Gathering Storm and the Towers of Midnight books are not up to the minimum standards of Crossroads of Twilight and Knife of Dreams.


Am I happy to write this unfortunate conclusion? No, I'm gravely saddened by what could have been a capstone to a great series.

Last edited by FelixPax; 11-04-2010 at 09:59 PM. Reason: A typo fixed
  #15  
Old 11-04-2010, 06:11 PM
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I actually agree with the gist of Felix's post. I'm not going to say I was disappointed with Towers, but I can say that my worst fears about the last few books have been realized. I've been saying for years that there's just way too much crap for RJ to end the series without things feeling shoehorned in at times, and completely anticlimactic in others. So far, that's been the MO of Gathering Storm and Towers. Sure, cool things happen. And sure, cool things happen in ways we never could have expected. But the general feeling I have of large chunks of books 7-10 being the equivalent of RJ's creative masturbation persist.

Now that I've put that awful thought into your heads, I can move on.

Lots of things happening does not equal a good book. The last book is going to have a ton of things happening, but with all the major plot lines which need to be finalized, we're talking about each finishing at breakneck speed. I just find that unappealing, I guess.
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Old 11-04-2010, 06:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Angry Druid View Post
Rand didn't do nearly enough stuff to account for 1 month. Barely a week. Cringe!
Yeah, before I read his ending POV, I thought we would end up doubling back.
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Old 11-04-2010, 08:09 PM
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It's very hard to rate these against each other. There were single events in TGS that were way more awesome (Rand/Moridin meeting, Semi capturing rand/Rand channeling TP/Seanchan attack) than anything in ToM, but ToM was more consistently entertaining and cool stuff kept happening on a more regular basis.
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Old 11-04-2010, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icon View Post
It's very hard to rate these against each other. There were single events in TGS that were way more awesome (Rand/Moridin meeting, Semi capturing rand/Rand channeling TP/Seanchan attack) than anything in ToM, but ToM was more consistently entertaining and cool stuff kept happening on a more regular basis.
ToM felt far more like Brandon than RJ...FWIW.
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Old 11-04-2010, 09:37 PM
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I agree that Elayne was seriously off. She seemed most like herself when she was being stupid and posing as one of the Forsaken, but her conversation with Gawyn was just...ugh. Like, who is this chick?

But this will not cause as many complaints as Mat being off did in TGS, because no one cares about Elayne.
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Old 11-04-2010, 09:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terez View Post
I agree that Elayne was seriously off. She seemed most like herself when she was being stupid and posing as one of the Forsaken, but her conversation with Gawyn was just...ugh. Like, who is this chick?

But this will not cause as many complaints as Mat being off did in TGS, because no one cares about Elayne.
I thought she was a little better in this one. Without Avi and Nynaeve around, she has far less girl talk time. Birgitte and Dyelin dont really facilitate that with her thankfully.
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