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  #101  
Old 06-02-2012, 09:30 PM
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Last line of the chapter:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aviendha
"Do you have a bucket?" she asked the Windfinder faintly.
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  #102  
Old 06-02-2012, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Terez View Post
Last line of the chapter:
I was laughing at Aviendha's sudden sickness too.
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  #103  
Old 06-03-2012, 05:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Terez View Post
I don't think Egwene would make it long at Theoryland. (Shut up Gonzo.) She had just spent months with the Wise Ones...
The channeling Wise Ones may have confused her because they do show signs of aging, as a result of their harsh lifestyle. Just a lot less than other women of the same age do. Plus, she may have been further confused by the fact that not all Wise Ones channel.

Then there's the fact that at the time, the only female Forsaken she'd seen was Lanfear, who is not exactly a typical woman. She had also seen some of the male ones, but there were other issues which muddled the waters there.

Still, it does seem a bit of an oversight on her part.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terez View Post
I don't believe she was really intended as a red herring, though; Faolain is one of the first people Min views in Salidar (she said you'd think someone like Faolain would have an unpleasant future).
Nah, she started out as a wannabe red herring, but now she's a blue one.
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  #104  
Old 06-03-2012, 12:55 PM
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I <3 Mat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 17, The Triumph of Logic
"One of them jumped me in the hall." Mat kicked the chest lightly; it made a hollow sound despite the dead man slumped inside with his arms and legs dangling out. "This is empty except for him. I think they meant to fill it with whatever they could steal." The gold, perhaps? Not likely they could have heard of that, won only hours ago, but he would ask Mistress Anan about a safer place to keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 21, Swovan Night
Balanced on his toes, Mat listened, eyes searching the moonshadows. Only a cat moved, slinking along the street. The slap of running bare feet faded. The owner of one pair should be staggering, and the other bleeding. As he bent, his foot kicked a club as long as his arm on the paving stones; heavy brass studs shone in the moonlight. That would have broken his skull for sure. Shaking his head, he wiped his knife on the ragged coat worn by the man at his feet. Open eyes stared at the night sky from a dirty, creased face. A beggar, by the look and smell of him. Mat had not heard of beggars attacking people, but maybe times were harder than he thought. A large jute sack lay near one outstretched hand. The fellows certainly had been optimistic about what they would find in his pockets. The thing could have covered him from head to knees.
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  #105  
Old 06-03-2012, 01:29 PM
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And Aviendha:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 21, Swovan Night
Thom cleared his throat. "Tylin is a weak queen, and Carridin the ambassador of a power." Placing a stone, he kept his eyes on the board. He sounded as though he was thinking aloud. "By definition, a Whitecloak Inquisitor cannot be a Darkfriend; at least, that's how it is defined in the Fortress of the Light. If she arrests him, or even charges him, she’ll find a Whitecloak legion in Ebou Dar before she can blink. They might leave her the throne, but she’d be a puppet from then on, strings pulled from the Dome of Truth. Aren’t you ready to concede yet, Juilin?" The thief-catcher glared at him, then bent to a furious study of the board.

"I did not think her a coward," Aviendha said disgustedly, and Thom gave her an amused smile.

"You have never faced something you could not fight, child," he said gently, "something so strong your only choice is to flee or be consumed alive. Try to hold judgment on Tylin till you have." For some reason, Aviendha’s face reddened. Normally, she hid her emotions so well her face was like stone.
I don't know if I ever connected that precisely to The Far Snows before. I might have, but if so I had forgotten it.
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  #106  
Old 06-03-2012, 01:40 PM
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Another good pair of quotes:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 21, Swovan Night
"You have your own secrets." Folding her arms under her breasts, she sat on the foot of his bed. The way she looked at him, you would have thought he was a tavern puzzle. "For one, you’ve not told them you blew the Horn of Valere. The smallest of your secrets from them, I think."

Mat blinked. He had assumed they had told her. After all, she was Birgitte. "What secrets do I have? Those women know my toenails and dreams." She was Birgitte. Of course. He leaned forward. "Make them see reason. You’re Birgitte Silverbow. You can make them do as you say. This city has a pit-trap at every crossing, and I fear the stakes grow sharper by the day. Make them come away before it’s too late."
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 21, Swovan Night
"If he expects us to come to him on hands and knees...!"

Birgitte took a sip of the tea with a grateful murmur, and oddly, when she looked at Nynaeve again, she did not seem so intoxicated. "I talked him out of that. I don’t think he was really serious. All he wants now is an apology and thanks."

Nynaeve’s eyes popped. She had talked him out of that? Apologize? To Matrim Cauthon? "Never," she growled.

"For what?" Elayne wanted to know, as if that mattered. She pretended not to see Nynaeve’s glare.

"The Stone of Tear," Birgitte said, and Nynaeve’s head whipped around. The woman no longer sounded intoxicated at all. "He says he went into the Stone, him and Juilin, to free the pair of you from a dungeon you couldn’t escape on your own." She shook her head slowly, in wonder. "I don’t know that I would have done that for anyone short of Gaidal. Not the Stone. He says you gave him a backhanded thanks and made him feel he ought to be grateful you didn’t kick him."

It was true, in a way, but all distorted. There Mat had been with that mocking grin of his, saying he was there to pull their chestnuts off the fire or some such. Even then he had thought he could tell them what to do. "Only one of the Black sisters was on guard in the dungeon," Nynaeve muttered, "and we had taken care of her." True, they hadn’t yet been able to figure out how to open the door, shielded. "Be'lal wasn’t really interested in us, anyway - it was just to lure Rand. Moiraine may already have killed him, by then, for all we know."

"The Black Ajah." Birgitte’s voice was flatter than the floor tiles. "And one of the Forsaken. Mat never mentioned them. You owe him thanks on your knees, Elayne. Both of you do. The man deserves it. And Juilin, as well."

Blood rushed to Nynaeve’s face. He had never mentioned...? That despicable, despicable man! "I will not apologize to Matrim Cauthon, not on my deathbed."
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  #107  
Old 06-03-2012, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
The fellows certainly had been optimistic about what they would find in his pockets. The thing could have covered him from head to knees.
lol. Never noticed this before
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  #108  
Old 06-03-2012, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Terez View Post
And Aviendha:

I don't know if I ever connected that precisely to The Far Snows before. I might have, but if so I had forgotten it.
T...I love that you note the exact same cool things that I do. Again and again you pick out some of my favorite passages in the books.
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  #109  
Old 06-03-2012, 07:58 PM
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I'm sure.
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  #110  
Old 06-03-2012, 08:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 28, Bread and Cheese
"Come in, Thom!" Snatching his coat back all the way on, he started to stand, then realized that somehow the bloody woman had untied the waist of his breeches without him noticing. These two might miss that his shirt was undone to his belly, but they would not miss his breeches falling off. Tylin’s blue dress was not mussed at all! "Juilin, come in!"

"I am glad you find the rooms acceptable, Master Cauthon," Tylin said, dignity incarnate. Except for her eyes, anyway, when she stood so Thom and Juilin could not see them. Her eyes laced innocuous words with added meaning. "I look forward to having your company with pleasure; I shall find it interesting, having a ta'veren where I can reach out and touch him at will. But I must leave you to your friends, now. No, do not stand; please." That with just the hint of a mocking smile.

"Well, boy," Thom said, knuckling his mustaches when she was gone, "there’s luck for you, being welcomed with open arms by the Queen herself." Juilin became very interested in his cap.
This is funny, partly because Thom has had one queen already, and now has Moiraine who *might* yet take the Sun Throne. And Juilin has Amathera, who was a queen in essence if not in name. And Thom's first queen is meanwhile getting to know Juilin's queen in the presence of a woman condemned to worse than Thera's fate by Mat's queen, Precious Paendrag herself. But we were talking of Tylin, who was introduced to the story only to soften Mat up for his inevitable raven tattoos. A step up from OWNED BY MELINDHRA OF THE JUMAI SHAIDO.
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  #111  
Old 06-03-2012, 11:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 31, Mashiara
Everything had been chosen to impress the Mistress of the Ships, to try regaining a little lost ground, for all the good it might do. Green silk slashed with yellow in the skirts, embroidered in gold down the sleeves and across the bodice, with golden lace along the hem, and at her wrists, and just bordering the neckline. Perhaps that should have been higher, to be taken seriously, but she did not own anything higher. Considering Sea Folk customs, it was more than modest. Nesta would have to take her as she was; Nynaeve al’Meara did not go changing herself for anyone.
Funny how quickly she forgot why she started wearing low necklines in the first place...
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  #112  
Old 06-04-2012, 10:16 AM
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I had forgotten Seaine was from Lugard. I was wondering yesterday what nationality Lelaine is; I don't think we know. Also, Elaida told Seaine that she knew Alviarin had communicated with Rand, but not about what. I've always wondered how she learned about that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 9, A Pair of Silverpike
"Leane, that man could strike sparks from a damp cloth, if it wore the shawl. I don’t know Merana, but I've never seen an Aes Sedai who qualified as a damp cloth."
"I’ve met one or two," Leane chuckled. This time her sigh was plain. "But not Merana, true. Does he really believe he has friends inside the Tower? Alviarin? That might make him difficult for Merana, I suppose, but I can hardly see Alviarin doing anything to risk her place. She was always ambitious enough for three."

"He has a letter supposedly from her." She could still see Rand gloating over receiving letters from Elaida and Alviarin both, back before she herself left Cairhien. "Maybe her ambitions make her think she can replace Elaida with him on her side. That’s if she really wrote it. He thinks he's clever, Leane - maybe he is - but he doesn't believe he needs anyone." Rand would go on thinking he could handle anything by himself right up until one of those anythings crushed him. "I know him inside and out, Leane. Being around the Wise Ones seems to have infected him, or maybe he infected them. Whatever the Sitters think, whatever any of you think, an Aes Sedai's shawl doesn’t impress him any more than it does the Wise Ones. Sooner or later he'll exasperate a sister until she does something about it, or one of them will push him the wrong way, not realizing how strong he is, and what his temper is now. After that there might be no going back. I’m the only one who can deal with him safely. The only one."

"He can hardly be as... irritating... as those Aiel women," Leane murmured wryly. Even she found it difficult to be amused by her experiences with the Wise Ones. "But it hardly matters. 'The Amyrlin Seat being valued with the White Tower itself... '"

A pair of women appeared between the tents ahead, moving slowly, as they talked. Distance and shadows obscured their faces, yet it was clear they were Aes Sedai from the way they carried themselves, an assurance that nothing hiding in any darkness could harm them. No Accepted on the brink of the shawl could manage quite that degree of confidence. A queen with an army at her back might not. They were coming toward her and Leane. Leane quickly turned in to the deeper dimness between two wagons.
Eavesdropping? Easy enough to find out that Alviarin was countermanding her orders, but this is another story. And truly, the evidence that Alviarin had countermanded her orders might have come from Tel'aran'rhiod, which again points to Salidar.
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  #113  
Old 06-04-2012, 02:24 PM
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ACOS is really tight all around, in a way that I don't think any of the other books have been so far. This, for example:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 31, Mashiara
"I would appreciate it very much if you did not mention Myrelle's name again in my presence. Do you understand?"

He nodded, and she released the flow, but as soon as he had worked his jaw a moment, he said, "Naming no names, Nynaeve, you know she’s aware of everything I feel, through the bond. If we were man and wife... "

She thought her face might burst into flame. She had never thought of that! Bloody Myrelle! "Is there any way to make sure she knows it is me?" she said finally, and her cheeks nearly did flash to fire. Especially when he fell back against the cabin wall laughing in astonishment.

"Light, Nynaeve, you are a hawk! Light! I haven’t laughed since... " His mirth faded, the coldness that had dimmed in his eyes for an instant returning. "I do wish it could be, Nynaeve, but -"

"It can and will," she broke in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 34, Ta'veren
Alanna gave him one searching look with those big dark penetrating eyes; the tiny knot of emotions in his skull said she was calmer, more relaxed, than he ever remembered. Then she made a small motion, and Min touched his arm and went aside with her....

....Whatever Alanna was saying to Min, scarlet spots had flared in Min’s cheeks and she had raised her chin, though oddly, she seemed to be replying calmly enough. He wondered whether she would tell him. One thing he was sure of about women was that every last one had secret places in her heart, sometimes shared with another woman but never with a man. The only thing he was sure of about women....

...."Did you have an interesting conversation with Alanna?"

"Nothing that would interest you," she said offhandedly. But a faint touch of red stained her cheeks.
The whole book is laced with good prefacing like this.
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  #114  
Old 06-04-2012, 02:59 PM
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Two bits I noticed about the Jendai Prophecies in ACOS; I knew them vaguely, but put together they spell out a lot:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 13, The Bowl of the Winds
"A split sail is split, Nesta," the old man said suddenly, in a deep voice much stronger than his bony limbs suggested. Aviendha had taken him for a guard, but his tone was that of an equal. "It might be well to ask what aid Aes Sedai would have of us, in days when the Coramoor has come, and the seas rage in endless storms, and the doom of the Prophecy sails the oceans. If they are Aes Sedai?" That with a raised eyebrow to the Windfinder.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 34, Ta'veren
"The Jendai Prophecy says you will bring us to glory, and all the seas of the world will be ours. As we give to you, you must give to us. If I do not make the Bargain well, Nesta will hang me naked in the rigging by my ankles and call the First Twelve of Clan Shodein to name a new Wavemistress." A look of utter horror stole across her face as those words came out of her mouth, and her black eyes went wider and wider by the word with disbelief. Her Windfinder goggled at her, and Derah and Taval tried so hard not to, their eyes fastened to the table, that it seemed their faces might break.
How are all of the seas of the world supposed to be theirs, unless they join with the Empire, and the Empire conquers the whole world? Also, 'doom' and 'glory' don't seem to fit well together.
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  #115  
Old 06-04-2012, 03:45 PM
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Maybe after the next Breaking of the World, the total sea area will be smaller than Tar Valon now is?

Edited to add: could be another case of "a remnant of a remnant shall he save".

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  #116  
Old 06-04-2012, 05:23 PM
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I think there is foreshadowing for Harine's Bargain—the one she ends up honored for—being with Tuon and Mat. I'm pretty sure Mat has to be there; this is foreshadowed when he tells off Renaile and Co. in Ebou Dar just before the building falls on his head. I haven't gotten there yet, but it's one of my favorite bits in the whole series, despite a bit of cheesiness, so I could hardly forget it:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 39, Promises to Keep
"You can all channel, I understand," he said quietly, "but that doesn’t mean much to me." As well be straight from the start. "You can ask Adeleas or Vandene how much I care whether a woman can channel."

Renaile looked past him toward Tylin, but it was not to the Queen she spoke. "Nynaeve Sedai," she said dryly, "I believe there was no mention in your bargain of my having to listen to this young oakum picker. I -"

"I don’t bloody care about your bargains with anybody else, you daughter of the sands," Mat snapped. So his irritation was not that well under control. A man could only take so much.

Gasps rose among the women behind her. Something over a thousand years ago a Sea Folk woman had called an Essenian soldier a son of the sands just before trying to plant a blade in his ribs; the memory lay tucked inside Mat Cauthon’s head, now. It was not the worst insult among the Atha’an Miere, but it came close. Renaile’s face gorged with blood; hissing, eyes bulging in fury, she leaped to her feet, that moonstone-studded dagger flashing in her fist.

Mat snatched it out of her hand before the blade could reach his chest and shoved her back into her chair. He did have quick hands. He could still hold on to his temper, too. No matter how many women thought they could dance him for a puppet, he could -"You listen to me, you bilge stone." All right; maybe he could not hold it. "Nynaeve and Elayne need you, or I’d leave you for the gholam to crack your bones and the Black Ajah to pick over what’s left. Well, as far as you’re concerned, I’m the Master of the Blades, and my blades are bare." What that meant exactly, he had no idea, except for having once heard, "When the blades are bare, even the Mistress of the Ships bows to the Master of the Blades." "This is the bargain between you and me. You go where Nynaeve and Elayne want, and in return, I won’t tie the lot of you across horses like packsaddles and haul you there!"

That was no way to go on, not with the Windfinder to the Mistress of the Ships. Not with a bilgeboy off a broken-backed darter, for that matter. Renaile quivered with the effort of not going for him with her bare hands, and never mind her dagger in his hand. "It is agreed, under the Light!" she growled. Her eyes nearly started out of her head. Her mouth worked, confusion and disbelief suddenly chasing one another across her face. This time, the gasps sounded as if the wind had ripped the curtains down.

"It is agreed," Mat said quickly, and touching fingers to his lips, he pressed them to hers.

After a moment, she did the same, fingers trembling against his mouth. He held out the dagger, and she stared dully at it before taking it from him. The blade went back into its jeweled sheath. It was not polite to kill someone you had sealed a bargain with. At least, not until the terms were fulfilled. Murmurs began among the women behind her chair, rising, and Renaile stirred herself to clap her hands once. That silenced Windfinders to Wavemistresses as quickly as the two deckhands in training.

"I think I have just made a bargain with a ta’veren," she said in that cool, deep voice. The woman could teach Aes Sedai how to pull themselves together quickly. "But one day, Master Cauthon, if it pleases the Light, I think you will walk a rope for me."

He did not know what that meant, except that she made it sound unpleasant. He made his best leg. "All things are possible, if it pleases the Light," he murmured. Courtesy paid, after all. But her smile was disturbingly hopeful.
Tuon doesn't seem to mind nations keeping their hierarchy intact underneath her rule, so I don't see why she would change that for the Sea Folk. Harine can be Mistress of the Ships, answering directly to the Empress, like any other ruler.

But despite all that, I doubt anything will be properly decided until Rand gets there, wherever 'there' is. Maybe Merrilor, since it looks to be a good staging ground.
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Old 06-04-2012, 05:56 PM
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Tai'daishar (Kiruna's horse) was also a gelding. Now I'm disappointed.

Also, I think Rafela's comments that she heard 'reports' on Min 'several years ago' is a hint that Moiraine heard about Min through the Blue Ajah network and went looking for her because she was desperate to know something of the future and because the location happened to fit with a few clues she had. She had probably avoided going there because she had nothing solid and because it's rather out of the way, far away from anything important.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TEOTW
"What makes you think Mistress Alys has another name?"

"Because she told me," Min said, so patiently that he blushed again. "Not that she had a choice, I suppose. I saw she was ... different ... right away. When she stopped here before, on her way downcountry. She knew about me. I've talked to ... others like her before."
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACOS 35, Into the Woods
"I’ve heard of the White Lions," Rand said coldly. "Look among them for Darkfriends, and you won’t be disappointed." They had been some of Gaebril's soldiers; Min knew that much, and little more, except that Lord Gaebril had really been Rahvin. It stood to reason that soldiers serving one of the Forsaken would include Darkfriends.
And yet Rand didn't seem to feel the same about Lord Brend's soldiers, when the Legion of the Dragon took them in, and their leader tried to kill him.

You might call that another pairing of clues, since Rand defeats Sammael right after this, and the bit with the Legion is in the beginning of Rand's arc in TPOD.
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:43 AM
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And yet Rand didn't seem to feel the same about Lord Brend's soldiers, when the Legion of the Dragon took them in, and their leader tried to kill him.
A difference could be that the White Lions were Rahvin's personal force, whereas what you call Lord Brend's soldiers were just regular Illianer conscripts. Led, of course, by officers hand picked by Brend, but we'll ignore that detail for now.
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Old 06-05-2012, 08:52 AM
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I should have also mentioned the pairing of Moiraine clues; I think I didn't because everyone knows about them, but it fits into the theme. Just before they leave for the rebels' camp, Min thinks that Rand will almost surely fail without a woman dead and gone, and she's sure for a moment that Caraline is Moiraine when they first see her, because she has reason to think that Moiraine will eventually reappear. And then she thinks of Moiraine being the only viewing of hers that ever failed. I think RJ wanted to make sure that even the casual readers did not miss that; those clues are planted so close together that they are hard to miss. I'm not so sure he was successful, though.

Also, I wondered, perhaps for the first time, perhaps not, if Fain told Toram to distract Rand.

Now, it seems Rand really went mad after Dumai's Wells. He appeared to be handling it somewhat okay (aside from his issues with Perrin) until Fel and Colavaere died, and Lews Therin went away, and he convinced himself he raped Min. He locked himself up in his room, raging and sulking, until Min saved him. Then he went to see the Sea Folk, saw his ta'verenness in action, and it's all in Min's POV, but he's totally insane through the whole thing. I think I had forgotten just how much.

So, Rand sees Fain with Toram Riatin, gives a little speech about everything Fain did that Rand is going to kill him for, and says he's 'a Darkfriend, and a dead man'. And then he lets Toram distract him with a swordfight, all the while thinking he's going to touch Toram with his ta'verenness, never thinking to make the Barthanes comparison.
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