Thread: rand's reread
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Old 08-04-2014, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by rand View Post
I didn't get around to much reading today, so I'll just post a few things regarding the tGH prologue.

I know RJ uses a lot of references to Arthurian Legend, but Jaichim Carridin's alias Bors doesn't seem to have much of a parallel with Sir Bors. Though admittedly I don't know much about him. He gets killed by the rabbit in Monty Python, I think.
I believe that RJ's Arthurian parallels were for the most part "we'll see where I go with this". RJ ended up not liking where he went with Carridin, so he just killed him. He was originally supposed to play a more important role.

Originally Posted by rand View Post
Ishamael tells everyone that the room they're in is near Shayol Ghul. So is there an actual house there? Is this supposed to be the same building Ishamael kept making Rand visit in the dreams from tEotW?
The description is very different. Since the Pattern is so thin at Shayol Ghul, it has properties similar to Tel'aran'rhiod. Moghedien and others seem to think that it's that way because of the Dark One, but it's more likely the original thinness through which Lanfear et al. could sense the True Power on the other side. Any houses that exist near Shayol Ghul might or might not exist in the real world.

Originally Posted by rand View Post
Bors is able to tell one guy is from the Sea Folk because of tattoos on his hands, but beyond that he thinks the guy could be anyone from anywhere. But wouldn't he be black skinned?
I think his point was that he could be anyone from anywhere if his hands weren't showing. His disguise was otherwise good.

Originally Posted by rand View Post
Saying "Ba'alzamon" is apparently just as bad as saying "Shai'tan" (for DFs, at least). And come to think of it, how do people learn that the DO's name is Shai'tan anyway? If so few people say it, a Randland version of the telephone game could have drastically changed his name over the millennia (say, from Steven).
It can be written.

Originally Posted by rand View Post
Does Ishamael know that Mat and Perrin are ta'veren, or otherwise massively important, at this point?
He is probably the most skilled at reading the Pattern to find ta'veren. That is why he appears in all three of their dreams (and also because he's not entirely sure which is Lews Therin reborn).

Originally Posted by rand View Post
He wants all three men killed (or maybe not; he seems a little confused on that point), but he doesn't tell the DFs which one is the actually DR. Anyway, why does Ishamael still care about Mat and Perrin? He could just have Ingtar or Liandrin kill them both easily.
They were both there. They may have had specific orders along those lines, but Brandon posited in TOM that trying to kill a ta'veren before their time is tricky business, so he might have been reluctant to waste his key players on such orders.

Originally Posted by rand View Post
Finally, I wanted to make a list of the people at the Darkfriend Ice Cream Social to see which ones we can identify (which isn't too many, at least for certain):
Bors Jaichim Carridin
Illianer noblewoman --never revealed
Gray-cloaked 'figure' of unknown gender ... Bela.
Shienaran soldier Ingtar
Someone from Kandor ?
Someone from Cairhien Barthanes? ... Probably. This seems to be a meeting of the top tier power players aside from Aes Sedai, and no one else was that high in Cairhien. Weiramon might have tried to recruit Bertome Saighan later.
Someone from Saldaea Kadere? Probably not, see above. I am guessing Brandon wrote in Vram Torkumen in TOM partly because of the Darkfriend Social.
Someone from Ghealdan ? Could be anyone; we hardly knew any important people from there at all aside from Alliandre and Logain.
A Tinker male? I don't think Aram was a DF... He wasn't, and he wasn't important anyway.
A High Lord of Tear Weiramon? Almost certainly.
Andorran Officer in Queen's Guards Daved Hanlon? Possibly. I seem to remember that the timing wasn't quite right for some reason. Rahvin replaced most of the Queen's Guard with his own men—eventually, all but Tallanvor. Rahvin did not become a thing in Caemlyn until after Morgase went to Tar Valon for Elayne, and that was while they were gone from the Tower in TGH, so that hasn't happened yet at this point. I'd say it was Lord Comar but it's not exactly clear when he was dismissed from the Guard for his weighted dice.
Sea Folk male I can't remember if Brandon named one or not, but there was never a male Sea Folk Darkfriend revealed in the RJ books.
Black Ajah 1 Liandrin
Black Ajah 2 ? ... I'd guess not Alviarin. Liandrin was not a top dog, so I'm guessing the top dogs were too high to be required to attend (unlike the non-channeling Darkfriends). There were a bunch of Darkfriends with Siuan, but only Verin and Liandrin showed signs of having Very Important Orders. You could say Verin wouldn't have been stupid enough to let her ring show, but maybe she wanted to let everyone in the room know she was dangerous and to stay the fuck away from her.
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